<p>Now I need to get serious about identifying some solid schools that offer great NMF packages, and U Al & U Ky are on the top of my first list. </p>
<p>I'm looking for a list of full-ride (or nearly so, bring Cost of Attendance under 10k or so, which I consider pretty-much-free) schools for this particular list. I need a school that has good math (the better, the better), offers engineering, and has at least some music offerings. Beyond that, the stronger academics and the more politically liberal (or at least moderate), the better.</p>
<p>I can figure out the $$ from the schools' websites. (Both offer awesome packages. KY offers a bit more, but AL offers it for 5 years!) To me, each offer spectacular packages.</p>
<p>Beyond the $$ packages, can y'all help me identify some contrasts? Which is better in what ways? Rankings? Grad school prospects? Etc?</p>
<p>FWIW, my dd is interested in mathematics and engineering. She is also a musician, and she'd like to have some opportunities to do some harp playing in orchestras or ensembles.</p>
<p>We're politically liberal, but dd is quite tolerant and happy with moderate folks and a diverse student body, although neither of us would be happy with a strong conservative atmosphere as diversity, tolerance, LBGT equality, and environmental stewardship are core values for dd. (This is why I didn't include OK on my first list, as I get the impression that it is pretty strongly "red", which really would be a poor fit. But, if I am wrong about that, feel free to correct me!)</p>
<p>Feel free to add more schools to these two if others come to mind.</p>
<p>I’d drop UK from your list as it does not seem to offer anything that you want. The environmental program is fairly weak, the school is not a hotbed of LGBTQ activism, nor does it offer much diversity. Alabama has a decent enough environmental program (with surprisingly strong offerings in some sub fields if the hydro sciences) and the college town part of Tuscaloosa may more accepting than some of the urban corridors of the state. </p>
<p>That being said, I do think it’s a mistake to not consider OU, especially if the alternative school is UK. OU is a much more racially diverse school than the other two options and the University of Oklahoma (NOT Oklahoma State) is only moderately conservative, with a very healthy liberal contingent, particularly in the honors college. However, the gobs of oil money that the school gets means that the environmental programs are lacking. On the plus side, the music programs at OU are surprisingly strong, and the engineering facilities are all less than a decade old. I believe the math program, although not highly regarded ranks slightly ahead of Alabama’s. </p>
<p>You should visit all of the schools you’re considering. I’ve visited Alabama twice and both times could not wait to get out. On the other hand, the parents on the Alabama forum seem to all be part of an online Bama cult.</p>
<p>You may also want to consider the University of Arizona, Arizona State, and the University of Minnesota. I believe all give good NMF packages (even if the website may not report it) and fit your criteria much better than either Alabama or Kentucky. ASU in particular is noted for its sustainability efforts, and the other two have excellent environmental programs. The LGBT scene at UMinn is particularly strong, although ASU/ UA are no slouches in this area either. All three are far more racially diverse than Alabama or Kentucky. </p>
<p>Depending on how advanced your daughter is, she’ll likely find the math offerings at all schools at least adaquate, although keep in mind that both UA and UMinn are top 50 programs, with Minnesota cracking the top 20. UA, ASU, and Minnesota all receive much more research funding than either of the two schools on your list with a great deal of it going into engineering related problems.</p>
<p>ASU just added a auditioned music performance minor this year. They have a great music program. My D is NMF Music/math dual degree there, so if you want info PM me.</p>
<p>Thanks. . . Ironically, I myself went to U Az on a generous NM package 25 years ago! I wasn’t a bad school, but it isn’t anything I’d want for dd, either. The drug culture was soooo pervasive in Az back then and the crime was pretty terrible, too. Anyway, it has enough negative associations for me that I wouldn’t ever take it on myself to encourage any of my kids to move to AZ. </p>
<p>Ok, so y’all are saying that Oklahoma is less conservative than Kentucky? Ok. </p>
<p>Frankly there are too many schools to visit them all. I am putting together another list of more competitive and smaller LAC and private universities, and those will require visits, too. I’m trying to narrow our sights a bit so we best manage our limited travel time and travel budget.</p>
<p>ASU pays plane fare for NMSFs to visit. Not parents or hotel, but kids can go alone and do an overnight in Barrett and eat in dining hall so virtually free. Just in case you change your mind about AZ. The honors college at ASU is quite nice and worth having a look. Also, a free trip to nice weather in mid-winter.</p>
<p>I second the recommendation of UMN- Twin Cities for math. They have a top math program. We visited there and I promoted it to D, but the music prof wasn’t quite right. Two years ago they added a 50 credit hour performance music BA (they call it ‘applied emphasis’), so it is possible to dual degree there without killing yourself.</p>
<p>In general a bigger city will offer more performance opportunities outside the university than small town, so more total opportunities.</p>
<p>the parents on the Alabama forum seem to all be part of an online Bama cult.</p>
<p>lol…funny.</p>
<p>my older son went to Bama on the NMF scholarship and was a math major. He was accepted to every PhD program he applied to and enrolled at his top choice…an elite univ. </p>
<p>My younger son went to Bama on a large scholarship as well. He was a Chemical Eng’g major. He’s now in med school.</p>
<p>Bama is in a good-sized city. The school’s students range from liberal to conserative. The city is a good mix as well. the congressperson is a Democrat. The school was Obama Country during the last two elections…but probably a little less so the second time simply due to some loss of popularity. </p>
<p>Since the last couple of incoming frosh classes have been more than 50% OOS, it really creates a more diverse campus in “thought”.</p>
<p>Celesteroberts: where can I get more info on this trip? I’ve heard nothing but great things about Barrett, and I’m definitely interested in checking them out. Plus, I’d give an arm to get out of Michigan for a few days in the winter.</p>
<p>We received the offer in the mail last year, looked like junk mail, called ‘boarding pass.’ I think you can just call or e-mail them. Either Michelle Hollin (michelle.hollin at asu.edu, 48096515200 or Emily Hsu(email similar, 49809659348.) You do not need to have applied, just be NMSF or Hispanic or Achievement. You can turn the visit into whatever you want beyond the standard visit. We added lots- music audition, class visits, meetings with students in her majors and profs. Here’s a link: [Student</a> Experience Day » Barrett, The Honors College](<a href=“http://barretthonors.asu.edu/admissions/student-experience-day/]Student”>http://barretthonors.asu.edu/admissions/student-experience-day/)</p>
<p>The reimbursement for travel depends on where you live. D’s ticket was more than their offer. When I submitted receipt, they reimbursed the additional money, though I did not ask. If your child goes alone(mine didn’t), there is light rail from airport to campus, $2. They’ll meet you at the station with golf cart and take you back to Barrett. They are very very nice people to deal with.</p>
<p>We are from the Midwest and had not initially considered seriously any schools quite that far away. But Southwest flies direct to Phoenix from an airport an hour from home, so travel is not as much of an issue as I feared, especially with light rail less than 2 blocks from Barrett.</p>
<p>Also, some depts may have additional scholarships to add to the already generous NMF award. My D received a very nice one from music dept. They said they do not look at other money received from ASU when making decisions about their awards.</p>
<p>Okay, I’m from the Midwest as well and was not planning on going too far out of state prior to taking the PSAT, but everything has opened up with this. Thanks for all the info!</p>
Tuscaloosa has fewer people than either College Station or Lexington, KY. While there are parts of it that are nice, a decent sized city it is not. Decent sized college town is a more appropriate description IMO, especially because it’s relatively isolated.</p>
<p>Whenhen, you visited Alabama twice and both times couldn’t wait to get out? Why visit a second time? More importantly, why couldn’t you wait to get out? I have yet to hear anyone actually visit the school and not like it. May not be the right fit for each visitor, but those who actually visit are impressed with the campus.</p>
<p>mmom, we didn’t look at UKy or UAlabama, but in case you apply to UKy, you should know that admission to their honors program is not automatic for NMF, and is not easy to get into. You need to take the honors app very seriously. The son of an aquaintance had this experience last year. He was OOS NMF and got into the Global Gatton Scholars Program(I think that’s what it’s called?), visited and showed a lot of interest, but did not get accepted to honors. If you scan back on the UKy forum to this spring’s threads, you’ll see the same happened to a Kentucky family with NMF twins who had excellent stats. So they enrolled elsewhere of course, as being part of honors (new bldg!) would be part of what one expects going there on the scholarship. I have seen others post similar comments about the UKy honors program on CC.Good luck with your search.</p>
<p>Once because I was touring the school as a possible transfer option as it initially appeared to have a solid program in my area of interest, although I left somewhat unimpressed. I visited a second time because I was passing through the area, wanted to take a break from driving, and knew that the campus was both safe and fairly bikable. As per your second question, the school felt far more Southern and Greek than I was comfortable with (btw, I had the same reaction after I visited Ole Miss), and my tour guide certainly didn’t temper my impression of the place. It’s a nice campus, but it wasn’t one that I particularly enjoyed.</p>
<p>To the OP, I am saying that the University of Oklahoma will be more liberal than the University of Kentucky. The very conservative students in the state are much more likely to go to Okkahoma State if they’re deciding between the two schools. I’m a liberal from CA (although probably slightly economically conservative by Venice Beach/ Berkeley standards) and do not consider my views to be either marginalized or outside the school’s norm. </p>
<p>M2CK, I deliberately chose College Station as it is often brought up as an example of a true college town, that is a place, separated from the larger metro areas, whose livelihood depends on the continued existence of the college. The fact that Tuscaloosa has around the same number of people indicates that it is not a decent sized city but rather a college town through and through. For the record, I believe that many college towns have more cultural opportunities than some cities 10X their size.</p>
<p>whenhen I would agree that among OK students, the more conservative students tend to go to Oklahoma State. The school “felt” very conservative when we visited. </p>
<p>My son is very liberal and does not feel like he outside the norm at OU, either.</p>
<p>Has your daughter considered the University of Tulsa? The presidential scholarship is a full ride. It is competitive, but most recipients are NMS. They give 40-50 every year. </p>
<p>TU is a great school. It’s small but very diverse…they draw a lot of international students. They are very strong academically. Regionally, they are known for their engineering school. They also have fantastic music programs. The classes are small. My son is in his second year there and has not had a class with more than 60-70 students, and that is unusual. The student/faculty ratio is something like 11 to 1. </p>
<p>TU has a lot of what your daughter is looking for. It’s definitely worth a look.</p>
<p>I second Tulsa. If your D is not chosen for the Presidential scholarship (requires a separate application, btw) as a NMF she is likely to be offered full tuition.</p>
<p>Also, look at UT-Dallas, which is known for engineering and CS. It has an orchestra/chamber ensemble. UT-Dallas offers an automatic near-full-ride to all NMFs. It is a very diverse school, with a high percentage of international and Asian-American students. Neither conservative nor liberal, imo.</p>
<p>Bama:
more of a college town feel
beautiful campus-spotless and well maintained
strong Greek presence
Southern hospitality (seems more formal)
FAR from the Midwest- 1 hour to airport
higher ranked
NMF- 5 years tuition, but stipend not full room and board each year, with easy acceptance into Honors
Football</p>
<p>Kentucky:
urban feel (short walk to downtown Lexington)
campus undergoing some updating, not as “perfect” looking
has a Greek community, but does not appear as prominent
Midwest hospitality (down to Earth comfort)
company runs a bus at breaks (X-Mas, Thanksgiving, and Spring) to various areas
daily flights from Lexington airport
NMF- 4 years tuition and room and board allowance, honors very competitive
Basketball</p>
<p>Both schools have been wonderful with communication, quick acceptance, and making DD feel wanted. Both are great schools, but feel very different. Feel free to PM me, as these are our top 2 choices.</p>