<p>so... here's a little post for us who didn't get in.</p>
<p>if anyone could take a guess as to why I got flat out rejected, and not even deffered, that would make my heart warmer, knowing that there was some reason.</p>
<p>sat I: 2140 (690W 690R 760M)
satII: 790M 680Bio
5/5 BC/AB Calc
~3.65 unweighted gpa - 3.5 frosh and steadily rose to 3.75 last year
Multivariable Calculus class @ Dartmouth college
4 year all season athlete - 4 year V spring rack, 4 year V xc ski, 1 year V xc running (I only ran senior year, played soccer all the other years)
I talked to both the xc running and skiing coach, both were very nice, and "would love to have me on the team" kinda thing - not recruited
3 Years competative debate w/ numerous speaking awards, etc.
4 years photography - now doing independant study - won awards at local and state competitions
amazing GC rec - i've known my gc for a long while (i played youth hockey w/ his son) - and he wrote a great letter for me - or so he says
Teacher recs - um... apparently they must not've been that great???
national merit commended student or whatever
Volunteered @ dartmouth CS dept over summer as research assistnat
part time job last 2 yrs, all sorts of other ****</p>
<p>if anyone could shed some insight, i'd be very happy</p>
<p>good luck everyone else, and if you want to be angry/sad/wahtever else you want, do it here</p>
<p>my essay was actually very good. i can pm it to you if you'd like... i spent a long time figuring out what to write about, and the overall product was quite good.</p>
<p>i also sent in some sample photographs w/ my application as well as a resume, if that matters, which it doesnt</p>
<p>I can't believe you didn't get in... You sound like such a perfect fit. The combination of excellence in math/sports/arts seems like such a Williams combination. </p>
<p>Will you be applying to Dartmouth RD?? It's so similar to Williams, and I would venture to guess that if you did well in your multivariable class, you could get a rec from that professor.</p>
<p>oh, and i also had a good friend of mine who's AT williams now as a frosh write my peer eval... and yeah, i'll probably talk to the math prof and have him write a rec for me as well... but i may not do taht b/c the class was really huge (like 60 kids), so it wasn't very personal, even though he was a VERY cool guy</p>
<p>gl everyone, and have fun wherever you're going</p>
<p>You shouldn't feel any shame whatsoever. You look like a great student, but you just didn't match up with what Williams was looking for.</p>
<p>In a way, you were hurt by athletics on your resume because Williams attracts so many strong recruited athletes. Williams coaches have a say in about 100 recruited athletes accepted in each class. Of these, 66 are below average academically for Williams, the remainder are about average (an academic "3" rating). </p>
<p>Although you don't provide your class rank, I'm guessing that you were probably not valedictorian or salutatorian of your class. Therefore, you would be an academic "3" -- which is good, but not enough to get admitted without something else. Unfortunately for you, the academic 3's who get admitted with athletics as their "something else" at Williams are the ones on the coach's lists. You picked a school with a national recruiting base for Div III athletes.</p>
<p>Realistically, you probably would have needed to be an academic 1 or 2 to have gotten an ED acceptance.</p>
<p>our school doesn't have class rank, which is why it's not on there... but is taking all honors math, science, english, and french classes, as well as a multivariable calculus @ dartmouth and good (decent) sats is only an academic 3? is there something i'm missing? what the hell is a 1 or 2?</p>
<p>and should the academic "3" i "deserve" yield to a flat out rejection, on top of all everything else? ii'm still confused</p>
<p>I really can't understand the flat out rejection. Unless Williams has radically changed their admissions policies (which is possible), you absolutely should have at least gotten deferred to RD. I would call the admissions office and ask to speak with an adcom. Be very polite, and let them know that you were surprised by the outcome. Is there a chance that there was some sort of mix-up?</p>
<p>Ask them if there was anything sub-par about your application. You could also ask if they have any recommendations for submitting your regular decisionapplications... "Is there anything I should change???"</p>
<p>Again... you will have plenty of choices RD, and this seems like a blunder made by the admissions office.</p>
<p>An academic 1 is lofty territory. Ranked 1st or 2nd in your high school class with SAT math/verbal above 1525. Only about 15% of Williams students are academic 1s. </p>
<p>I don't know the cutoff for academic 2s, but I'm guessing it's probably #1 or #2 class rank and 1450+ SAT math/verbal.</p>
<p>Academic 3s could be some combination of higher test scores/lower class rank or higher class rank/lower test scores -- still darned strong. I figured my daughter was probably an Academic 3 when she applied -- that's about where she landed on the Academic Index calculators. Ranked #2 in her class with test scores in the same range as yours.</p>
<p>Academic 3s at a place like Williams need a strong "something else" that fits with the particular slots the school needs to fill -- everything from muscians to debaters to community service volunteers to lacrosse players to theater people and so and so forth. That's where the luck part comes in: does your "something else" match up with what the school is short of in the applicant pool that year? For example, how 'bout the strong theater person applying to Harvard the same year that Natalie Portman applied? Or the strong cello player applying the same year as Yo Yo Ma? What can you do but read 'em and weep?</p>
<p>i was thinking of either calling or emailing the an adcom member, emailing would probably be less of an awkward conversation, bu yeah. I would definitely ask to see whether anything, first of all, was missing from my app, or if there was anything I didn't do (or anything i DID do), that lead to the rejection... So far i'm not sad or angry as much as confused, and I'll definitely ask them if there is anything I could have/should have changed or should change for future apps... </p>
<p>but thanks for the input/info - it'll be a hard next couple of weeks</p>
<p>Reykjavic, my guess is that it could be a combo of the SAT scores (although the math is strong) and GPA (although I don't know how to interpret your high school's GPA). I think ID is right that you would have been an academic 3.</p>
<p>I know a kid with a very high 1500's (old SAT score) and great grades (one B+/ all else A's/top public school) who was deferred by Williams today.</p>
<p>actually academic 1 are given to applicants who are on average top 3% of their classes and have SAT scores of almost 1550 -dats wat i read...you can check it out in the Williams site to verify..</p>
<p>Over on the Swarthmore forum, we're commiserating with a great guy who did everything right: visiting campus twice, once for an overnight, sat in on classes. Baseball pitcher who had done the whole baseball coach recruiting thing. Perfect 1600s on the math/verbal part of the SATs. 8 APs at one of the two or three best public high schools in NJ. Deferred.</p>
<p>Sometimes you just have to say, "I gave it my best shot" and it wasn't meant to be.</p>
<p>It's hard to be really precise because a valedictorian could have slightly lower test scores and still be an academic 1, but a top 3% er would need higher test scores.</p>
<p>Hey Reykjavic,
Like everybody else, I'd say not to worry too much. I got deferred today and I have very similar things as you on my app. Similar SAT scores, lower SAT II scores. I also take calc 3 at my school. The rejection is a little confusing as you seem to be a good fit. My weighted GPA is 4.3 (top 2% of school), same sports as you actually, emailed xc and nordic coach, same response as you. I'm a pretty good violin player, one of top in rochester, ny. Sent in a CD with some pieces I recorded. Physics internship at university of rochester lab for laser energetics, I sent my paper to the school. I volunteer at a hospital near my house, i'm the captain of my school's masterminds team etc etc. We sound similar, crappy luck I guess? I would definitely try to contact them and ask about the rejection, but a good friend of mine was also rejected at Columbia and he's also similar. Just curious, where do you ski? Probably near Hanover if you worked at dartmouth, were you on JO team in truckee?</p>
<p>GPA 4.15
Top 10%
ACT: 34
SAT: M670 W790 V740
SAT II: 730 Writing, 700 Math IC (this was prob the worst part of my app, i prob should have retaken, oh well.)</p>
<p>Tennis: Varsity 4 years (1st singles the past 3), All-Section, All-League, MVP, Scholar Athlete. USTA Tournaments past 4 years- Eastern Section Rankings
(Talked to tennis coach and same thing with rey.. not actually recruited even though she seemed all nice and positive)</p>
<p>Music- Percussionist in school band, played at Carnegie Hall with band, treasurer of band past 2 years, treasurer of musical honors society</p>
<p>Essays were good but could have been better as I have revised them a little more since I applied for my other applications.</p>
<p>Teacher Recs and Counselor Rec should have been good.</p>
<p>Girl Scout Gold Award- raised 2000+ books for homeless children
and other community service including midnight run, tutoring, thanksgiving drive for soldiers in iraq, taught tennis to kids at the boys and girls club, etc.</p>
<p>Model UN 4 years- President this year</p>
<p>its kind of random i think. you need someone pulling for you at the school or you just have to be absolutely amazing at something.</p>
<p>Ya I'd have to agree with the pull thing. Everybody I know there either had parents/siblings who went or were pulled for sports. Sort of sucks for kids who are very high achieving in lots of areas, but not amazingly good at 1 single thing.</p>