<p>@voice – what I am saying, based on my son’s experience as a current student at UW, who is on track to graduate with Honors in the Liberal Arts (complete the breadth requirements for Honors work) --is that unlike admission to other flagship Honors programs, it is not based on high stats. Here is what the Honors site says about admission: </p>
<p>"What role do my standardized test scores (ACT and/or SAT) play in my chances for admission to the L&S Honors Program? </p>
<p>Standardized test scores are not looked at during the admission process. Instead, we consider your responses to essay questions and your high school co-curricular and community involvement as measures of your willingness to engage with the liberal arts experience at the heart of the Honors Program."</p>
<p>In contrast, many flagship Honors programs, such as at IU, have no flexibility in Honors admission. You either have high enough gpa and test scores, at which point it is basically auto-admit, or you don’t have high enough stats and you are not admitted. </p>
<p>Honors program at UW is not some separate, super-selective group. It is an opportunity for students to take Honors classes or Honors discussion sections where they explore the material in more depth than the regular class/discussion. Students can take Honors classes if they aren’t “in” the Honors program. I’m not surprised that Honors students do well at UW, because they have already self-selected for a more intellectual experience by applying for the program. And it is an opportunity for kids like mine, who were not incredible high school students but very engaged as undergrads, to experience deeper intellectual engagement. </p>
“Yet another factor for those lucky enough to be able to choose OOS to consider.”
- The best bet for the OOS (for some reason, some kids absolutely have to be OOS) are not Honors colleges at state pubics, but privates that are known for great Merit awards, that will leave much less to pay than any OOS Honors. Privates do not care OOS vs IS, they just want to attract the best students.
This has been mentioned here and there throughout this thread but it is worth repeating and emphasizing. Be careful about conflating honors academic courses with honors housing or residential programs. Every program is somewhat different but living with honors students is not necessarily the same thing as taking honors classes. The increased intellectual challenge of honors classes is valuable. An all honor student living situation is not necessarily beneficial for all.
Agree with #62 – as much as my kid has benefitted from his Honors coursework, a student/family needs to understand the differences among programs. There are different models, blends and opportunities, sometimes involving combinations of extra advising, priority class registration, Honors courses, Honors dorms.
The academic offerings are key. Some offer required honors survey courses in various areas while others offer honors versions of specific courses. UW has honors sequences in math, chemistry, physics, biocore (as well as “integrated liberal studies”- a combination of various courses) that go well beyond the standard versions. Plus, honors courses can be taken through senior year- not limited to intro courses. No “campus within a campus” situation.
LACs and other private schools may offer more money but are not always of the same caliber academically as honors work available at some state flagships, or even the overall university academic caliber. Students need to decide if they are getting the same education when choosing among their options. Personal attention is to be found at large flagships, especially in Honors programs. There is also a certain ability to manage independently without hand holding to consider. Different personalities will thrive with different atmospheres.
Again, the most important benefit being in Honors is priority registaration. The other factors are so minimal, they should not laymuch in decision making. I do not see any negative whatsoever to be in Honors. Just do not think too deep, if qualify for Honors, then be in Honors. Not big deal! And being among “intense” crowd or surround yoursefl with diverse crowd ( I mean diverse in various levels of academic intensity, interests, I do not mean race or socioeconomic status here, kids are way beyond that), well, this type of decision is entirely up to a student and being in Honors or not has nothing to do with it. D. was looking into being with various types of people, she did not want to be strictly among intense pre-med crowd in Honors. So, she added Music minor, got into Sorority and both of these were the best ways (for her) to get thru successfully with very challenging major and get accepted into Med. School. Again, this was her approach, and every kid is different,.some need this additional push from the peers, the push that D. always wanted to avoid, her own push was enough for her, she just wanted to relax with friends, have a good time, have balanced life.
So, stating that one way is better than another is useless, there is no general rule here, each student need to figure out what he/she needs and follow their own plan.
Many honors programs have requirements to get that priority registration. My niece had to take a call class that almost killed her and she has to write a thesis. Not exactly a small price for being in honors. I don’t think she got priority registration, but did get to register before most in her year because of a credits which advanced her to the next level every year (as a Sophie gestured with juniors, etc)
Counterpoint to post # 65. Your series of one through vicarious living is insufficient to judge. I disagree totally with registration being the most important aspect of Honors. The quality of the academics trumps that. Besides, at a top U you will get into the Honors classes plus have many great options for electives if your first choices are full.
Also- some U’s have a very good campus social scene where frats and sororities only play a role for a small minority of students- most don’t want/need that to enjoy a great college life. Being in one of those is not at all needed for close long lasting friendships and great activities.
Premed at many top U’s is not at all the top of the class crowd. In fact, since being premed is only an intention it is not the main thing in most students’ lives- being involved in one’s major is the main academic focus (even among those who apply to medical schools). Being a physician is not as academically intense as it is for those who go on to PhD programs. Therefore, do not equate Honors with premeds at all. There is no major that is any more challenging than any other. It all depends on the interest and ability of the individual student. For a premed an English Lit major would probably be more challenging than any science major because the student needs to take many more science classes as electives instead of for meeting the major’s reqs, plus have many more papers to write along with the labs (although I recall writing at least 3 papers for 3 different honors chemistry classes as well as the honors thesis).
btw- I chose medical school over grad school after an intense Honors Chemistry major- the typical premed student is gunning for grades as opposed to learning a subject in depth. It was easier for someone I knew to finish after three years (pre AP credit era) with a math major and go to medical school because she did not have all of the lab hours we did in chemistry. It was great to have a passion to explore as an undergrad instead of just doing a major to get into medical school.
Figuring out which U to attend is why this thread was started. ie- how does one figure out Honors. The various posts here show that there are many variations and reasons to choose different U’s if affordable. Figure out which aspects seem most important along with the strengths of the department in proposed majors.