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Do you really think there is no Being superior to you?
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The moment one believes and starts living for the ends of an unmanifest ideal, one begins to hold one's self in bondage. There is nothing superior to the vice of man.</p>
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Trancestorm, the way you post makes me believe that you think you are too sophisticated for the idea of "God."
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Does that imply that god is an unsophisticated idea? :)</p>
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So whether or not the Bible is the Word of God, it can serves as a testamony to the divinity of Jesus Christ.
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</p>
<p>The bible is a circular, self justifying document. It is just as much of a "testamony to the divinity of Jesus" as Harry Potter is a testamony to flying witches and magic potions.</p>
<p>What really blows my mind is that an omnicient being would "stoop" to our level and send his son to take all my sin away. That is some amazing love. I don't know about you guys, but I have done some pretty crappy stuff, and to think that (even just maybe there might be a posibility) of some higher deity that cared enough about me to take the punishment for all the bad stuff I did/will do.</p>
<p>This is just a thought I had: What if there is no God and all these Christians are just believing in nothing, and when they die that's it...they're just dead, and there's no God to judge their sins or any heaven or hell to go to. But what if when they do die there is a God and he invites them to live with him in paradise forever, and the people that didn't believe where tortured for all eternity. I don't know. Christianity may seem like a joke or a crutch to some people, but in the end I'd rather have lived my life as a Christian and find out that there's no God, than live like He doesn't exist and be cast away from his presence.</p>
<p>I read this story once about an oriental woman who during a war was impregnated by a soldier, and when she had the baby it was a little baby girl. As this girl grew up she looked different than all the other oriental children, so they called her something that means something to the affect of ugly alien. Eventually her mother couldn't stand the shame anymore so she abandoned her. This girl ended up in an orphanage. When she was about nine years old an American couple was going to come to the orphanage to adopt a little boy. She helped prepare the little guys for the big day. When the day finally came the American man after looking at the boys saw her standing there, pointed to her and said that he wanted to adopt her. Her, with her scarred and diseased body. He walked up to her and put out his hand for her and she spat in his face and ran away.</p>
<p>Why would she do that? This man was literally offering her an opportunity of a lifetime and she spit at him. The girl could not understand or believe that someone could want or love her with all her imperfections. Yet he did.</p>
<p>I know I just posted three in a row, but...</p>
<p>What I find interesting about the Bible is that is was written by many authors over many years, and yet throughout the entire thing there is a theme. All these people believed the same exact thing. Compared to other holy books, this is unique. </p>
<p>There are also various other historical documents that contribute to the validity of the Bible. Not all of the documents were written by Christians. The best ones, were actually written by the skeptics of the time.</p>
<p>You all speak as if YOU want to become God! People, in my opinion, who are agnostic and doubt the existance of God want to be in total control.</p>
<p>I haven't posted in a while but want to say this. I have seen Christianity influence lives in so many ways. I have seen people who have purple and green hair, use slanderous language, and other horrible ideas become completely changed by Christianity.
The Bible has influenced society so much. This book has had such an impact on society.
I have learned from this debate that one can not change the views of someone else. I could sit here all day claiming proof for my religion but it won't make a difference, y'all. You can't change the views of another.
Let us talk about England, shall we? England's glory days were when Queen Victoria sat on the throne, IMO. Why? Well, once, an Indian diplomat came to Victoria and asked her what the secret was to England's greatness. "The Bible," she replied, "is the secret to our success here in England."</p>
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People, in my opinion, who are agnostic and doubt the existance of God want to be in total control.
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<p>Theists and atheists are just as likely to get hit by a car while crossing the street. Control? Right. If anything, it's the theists who love to fantasize about living forever. </p>
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I have seen people who have purple and green hair
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<p>Yes. Truly terrible. </p>
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use slanderous language
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</p>
<p>I suppose attacks on evolution (and numerous scientists) by "institutes" like Discovery don't count?</p>
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This book has had such an impact on society.
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<p>It has. It's started a huge number of wars. It's been used as an excuse for violence, bigotry, and discrimination. It's been used to take advantage of others, for money and for power.</p>
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. I could sit here all day claiming proof for my religion but it won't make a difference, y'all.
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<p>Offer some proof. Any proof.</p>
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"The Bible," she replied, "is the secret to our success here in England."
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<p>Ah yes. The brutal imperialist philoshopy had nothing to do with it. Right. Nice try though.</p>
<p>Tetrahedron,
Hasn't the Quran started wars? And what about the positive impacts of the Bible. This book has changed heathen tribes, changed lives, and developed nations, like England. Not sure why you condemned my Victoria example but really, during the reign of Victoria, England was at its pinnacle of power.
Oh, by the way, I don't believe institutions like Discovery ever used slanderous language against evolutionists. It burns me when people say things like that because Christian scientists and organizations are continually ridiculed incessantly by Evolutionists. There are even universities today where one can not graduate without accepting the BELIEF of evolution.</p>
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Furthermore, one can hardly vouch for the reliability of the 24th chapter of Matthew, the 13th chapter of Mark, and the 21st chapter of Luke, which all prophesy great happenings, and end those prophecies with "Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled."</p>
<p>That generation passed nearly two millennia ago, and nothing has happened.
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</p>
<p>Actually, I just picked up a book yesterday called Misquoting Jesus. The author is a now-agnostic/atheist former "born again" Christian. He is the chair of Religious Studies at UNC-CH. He mentioned this passage regarding the fig tree specifically. Apparently, the way he interpreted it was that, ** when the fig tree bloomed ** * that * generation would not pass without seeing the end times. The fig tree is supposed to be a symbol for Israel, and a generation in Bibical times would be about 40 years. Israel, he reasoned, was created in 1948. So, the end times should have come by 1988.</p>
<p>I know this adds no meaning to the discussion (I'm an evolutionist, progressive, "search for social justice and practice ethical values" Christian. I personally resent what the fundamentalists have done to Christianity), but I thought it was interesting. I think the author (Bart Elhman?) concluded that that passage either must have been added at a later date or that Jesus was a prophet mistakeningly preaching end times that would never come.</p>
<p>"Oh, by the way, I don't believe institutions like Discovery ever used slanderous language against evolutionists. It burns me when people say things like that because Christian scientists and organizations are continually ridiculed incessantly by Evolutionists. There are even universities today where one can not graduate without accepting the BELIEF of evolution."</p>
<p>If someone can make it through four years of college biology courses, collect a biology-related B.S., and still manage to believe that evolution is just a farce, there's a serious problem with either the person or the school.</p>
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This book has changed heathen tribes, changed lives, and developed nations, like England.
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<p>Um... you mean it destroyed different cultures? Ok, that's not exactly positive. England's development in the 19th century is due to the Industrial Revolution. The Bible had nothing to do with it.</p>
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I don't believe institutions like Discovery ever used slanderous language against evolutionists.
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<p>Sure. Do I need to link you to their page? It's pretty obvious.</p>
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burns me when people say things like that because Christian scientists and organizations are continually ridiculed incessantly by Evolutionists.
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</p>
<p>Um... there are millions of Christian biologists out there who have no problem with evolution because - gasp - they are reasonable people. Instead we have a bunch of ridiculous fundamentalist organizations with no scientific basis. There's no such thing as an "evolutionist" any more than there are "gravitationalists" or "heliocentrists." </p>
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There are even universities today where one can not graduate without accepting the BELIEF of evolution.
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</p>
<p>Or the "belief" in heliocentrism or gravity, right?</p>
<p>Victoria reigned from 1837-1901. The age of industry or industrial revolution was from 1760-1900. The correlation of these two time periods are quite close.</p>
<p>Yes, please post that link. I wonder what slanderous, vulgar language they used.
Heliocentrism and gravity are solid, concrete, proved scientific laws whereas evolution is just hypothetical and speculative. No matter what you say, evolution has NEVER been proved and (Ha!) never will be proved because of the lack of scientific evidence. How will ya'll prove evolution next? Piltdown Man? Ha Ha! Lucy or A. Afarensis? HA! Nebraska man? Coelocanth (incessant laughter) :)
Charles Darwin was never "the sharpest tool in the shed" Why, he couldn't even pass medical school. (roaring laughter) He..He couldn't even become ordained as a preacher. ( Laugh!)</p>
<p>Ok...perhaps call it darwin's postulate. I have yet to see a theory half as credible as natural selection....For the most part, natual selection holds as a valid induction; sucessful (for the most part) in its explanation. Put it this way...it has not been disproved and is induced to be credible (it is based on an induction by observed fact even though it is not a categorical deduction). </p>
<p>The bible on the otherhand is based neither on an induction nor a deduction. The bible is based on something that holds far less cridibility: faith.</p>
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Heliocentrism and gravity are solid, concrete, proved scientific laws
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</p>
<p>Really now? "Proved" you say? How are they proved? With evidence? Hm... how is evolution proved? With evidence? Wow... sounds oddly similar...</p>
<p>A good thing to learn is that in science you cannot "prove" anything. That's a term out of mathematics. You can provide sufficient evidence, but nothing can be proven. And in all the cases, sufficient evidence has been found.</p>
<p>That is where I disagree with you, Trancestorm. Evolution is based on as many assumptions and hypotheses as special creation. Although it(evolution) has never has been disproved, it surely has never been proven. Tetrahedron often times compares evolution to such concrete laws as heliocentrism and gravity which is absolutely ludicrous. Evolution is just a speculation!!!
Evolution goes against all realms of science.
Observation-no one was ever there to witness evolution or to observe it</p>
<p>Hypothesis- Well, I guess evolutionist can hypothesize</p>
<p>Experimentation- No, evolution can neither be replicated in the lab nor tested. You may hear about some clown who supposedly replicated evolution, but it is never true.</p>
<p>One may say, " Well, Christianity goes against science too." That's right! Why? Christianity is not science. There is no AP Christian science. Christianity is a religion. It sounds as if you all are quite scientifically inclined and that is great. But science does not answer all questions.</p>
<p>Hey, thanks for the post. I loved reading it. It was so hilarious how they put in the post about embryonic recapitulation. This idea went out a long time ago. And..And the part about horse evolution. They talked about how this horse had 15 ribs, then evolved into this horse with 13 ribs, and then this horse with 18 ribs.</p>