How to persuade parents that certain colleges are better than they think?

College Search & Selection
1

<p>First, my college list. The -- separates where I apply early or not.</p>

<p>Notre Dame *
Penn<br>
Carnegie Mellon *
Michigan
Rutgers *</p>

<h2>Purdue * </h2>

<p>Cornell
Georgetown *
NYU
Emory
Vanderbilt *</p>

<p>Alright. See those asterisks? Those are the colleges my parents disapprove heavily.</p>

<p>To some of you, this makes no sense. How in the world do they approve NYU and not Georgetown? Or Notre Dame? These are the reasons why they do not approve of certain colleges:</p>

<ul>
<li>They still want me to be a doctor - a lot. I don't. Already a clash of ideas.</li>
<li>They're not good colleges, academically. <--- Seriously.<br></li>
<li>International reputation isn't great. (For some)
*Religious affiliations. **I don't want to start a conversation in this topic on how much, or why, our beliefs differ.<a href="I'm%20just%20going%20to%20ignore%20you.">/b</a> But this is a real reason to them.</li>
</ul>

<p>This is the list they want me to go for.</p>

<p>Ivies
Chicago
Berkeley
Everything that doesn't have an asterisk.</p>

<p>What breaks my heart the most is that, after spending a month in Philly for a summer program, my heart has shifted towards Notre Dame and I think it's my top choice now. To think that I might actually get accepted there, and that my parents might never allow me to go... it's not a great feeling. They laughed at me when I showed them my college list because it was "terrible", and I had to really battle for them to visit various colleges. (No voices were raised, thank goodness - it was a debate that was almost formal.) I can't do anything about it if I can't persuade them, since I'm relying on their money (which might turn out to be a double-edged blade) for undergraduate tuitions, and I suppose I understand that they think that spending 60K for a school they hate would be a waste.</p>

<p>I'm doing a lot of research on a portion of these colleges. But everything I throw at them, they just shake their heads and say, "Just go apply for Berkeley. They're broke, they'll accept you for the tuition." (I'm in Jersey) Unlike some of CC users, I do NOT want to go to a college solely for reputation (though, if you look at my list, I admit it was a minor factor), but to my parents it's all about what they think.</p>

<p>I love my parents to death. We rarely get in heated arguments, and usually everything is forgiven in a day anyway. But honestly, I'm running out of things to shoot at them to persuade them that my college list is actually good. Besides college visits... anything I can try out?</p>

2

<p>My first concern is that both your and your parents’ lists feature several very expensive and hard-to-get-into schools that turn away many more qualified applicants than they accept. If you live in New Jersey, you should apply to Rutgers at least, if it’s on your preferred list anyway. Where’s the harm? Not knowing what your stats are, it’s hard to say what would be a balanced list for you, but you definitely need some more safeties on that list. </p>

<p>Your parents’ belief that you will automatically be accepted at Berkeley OOS because they need the tuition is very naive. Many of your parents’ beliefs can be refuted with facts and figures from several well-regarded college guides, the USNWR rankings, etc. You may wish to compile some documentation to show them.</p>

3

<p>

Your parents are obviously very wise. You should listen to them. ;)</p>

4

<p>My first thought was what NJSue said - you may not have the opportunity to choose between Penn and Notre Dame, or anything else on this top-heavy list. I assume you’re qualified for these schools you like, but so are lots and lots of other people. You need to find a couple schools that 1 - you like, 2 - you can afford, 3 - you WILL get into.</p>

<p>You (and your parents) just have to accept that you may not win the highly-selective-school lottery.</p>

<p>As far as your original question… I don’t have ways to convince, just thoughts on issues you may not have considered discussing with them. Note: When my son keeps coming up with new issues, it feels like nagging, and I think he feels the same way about when I keep trying to convince him. It would be better if you can avoid this pitfall (and then tell me how you manage! :slight_smile: )

  • doctor: there usually isn’t a pre-med degree, just some required classes. Are these bio and other classes interesting or awful to you? It seems that the med school decision could be deferred with full honesty and transparency: “I’m not sure about med school, but I would like to major in ____ and make sure I take classes that will get me to med school when the time comes.” Also, see if you can find med-school acceptance rates for the * colleges - if they’re good, that could help your case.
  • not good colleges - your parents seem invested in reputation; find rankings of the schools of interest to you and show that they are highly ranked (but then re-see my earlier concerns at the top of this post). Also, look at the degree programs for your majors of interest.
  • religious: are there required religion/Christianity classes at Notre Dame, etc.? Can you find statistics or stories on how all students feel welcome and not prosyletized?
  • international reputation - are you going to be an INTERNATIONAL doctor? Are you currently international? Do you plan to go to med school internationally? If none of those is true, then the international reputation isn’t important.</p>

<p>Good luck!</p>

5

<p>

Well, there is this:

People typically have their first major, then a secondary major (not double major) of “preprofessional studies.” Compare to the state I could find for Penn, which was 75%.</p>

<p>However, since Tenors isn’t considering medicine, it doesn’t really help.</p>

6

<p>I was decent at Bio in high school so I’m not ruling out being a doctor because of that; I just don’t have much interest in the profession for now.</p>

<p>Just read the original post, I don’t know why I placed an asterisk next to Rutgers. They’d prefer if I’d go somewhere else but that school is actually common ground we share on. I love Rutgers because of the environment, they love it because of it’s a suitable backup. I wouldn’t complain if Rutgers is my only choice because of that.</p>

7

<p>Will they forbid you from applying to the schools they hate? If not, I would apply to the list you have and the acceptances and rejections will solve the problem, or at least make it less complicated.</p>

8

<p>Just gonna throw this out there: 80% of Georgetown med school applicants get in to med school. The national average is around 40%. If they want you to be a doctor, this statistic alone should perhaps move them to reconsider. Doesn’t mean you have to be a doctor, but maybe they’ll be more respectful of your desire to go there.</p>

9

<p>A couple of suggestions:</p>

<p>try the “reaches, matches,safeties” discussion</p>

<p>the Ivies and Chicago are reaches for almost everyone; example: Brown says “no” to 78% of those with an 800 Reading, 82% 9of those with an 800 Math, 68% of those with a perfect 36 ACT, 79% of Valedictorians and 84% of Salutatorians.</p>

<p>In other words, your parents’ favorites are heavy with reaches - that goes for Cal, also</p>

<p>perhaps enlisting the help of a counselor to use Naviance or some other indicator to get a sense of which colleges on your list might be safeties or matches</p>

10

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</p>

<p>Pretty much all reaches or high matches for admissions (and is cost a concern?). That means that your default safety if you get shut out is community college for two years, followed by transfer to a four year school, usually to an in-state state university (e.g. Rutgers for you). While that can be a fine low cost option for many students, it does not seem like the kind of thing that your parents would be happy with based on where they want you to apply.</p>

<p>Re: pre-med… the pre-med courses can be done with any major, although it may not be a good idea to continue to do them (unless they are otherwise required for your major) if you do not get A grades in your first few chemistry and biology courses. Most pre-meds do not get admitted to any medical school in the US (and those high acceptance rates at some schools are only for those who apply – most pre-meds do not apply because they know that their grades or MCAT scores are too low). Note also that medical school is very expensive.</p>

11

<p>1) Show them USNEWS. Have you showed them rankings and selectivity</p>

<p>Also why do they think NYU is better than Georgetown, ND or Vandy? How are they choosing what schools they think are “good”, i.e. on what basis besides heresay (my feeling is that they might have an NYU bias since they live so close in NJ, if they lived in DC they would think Georgetown is practically Yale).</p>

12

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</p>

<p>Right, convince them by showing them meaningless rankings from a defunct magazine.</p>

13

<p>Please don’t be a doctor (or even premed) because your parents want you to! There are a lot of unhappy doctors - some who thought they always wanted to be doctors and some who were pushed/urged into the profession. Being premed can be very stressful and can keep you from exploring other career options which might be a better fit.</p>

14

<p>I think your list is a good one - has a nice range of safeties/matches/reaches, and is a reasonable length. Do your parents not want you to apply to all of the schools? At this point I would suggest that you just work on letting you apply to all of the schools, and defer possible future fights about what school you will attend based on your acceptances.</p>

15

<p>Nice to see some love for Rutgers, a school vastly under appreciated.</p>

<p>Tsdad: Rutgers College 1965</p>

16

<p>

“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”</p>

17

<p>To help with the topic of “I need to make sure I have some matches and safeties, and the Ivies are reaches for almost everybody” discussion . … </p>

<p>Here’s the page from Brown’s admissions office that details the profile of those that are rejected from that school:</p>

<p>[Brown</a> Admission: Facts & Figures](<a href=“Undergraduate Admission | Brown University”>Undergraduate Admission | Brown University)</p>

<p>In particular, draw their attention to the rejection rate of people with high 700s in SAT scores . . . </p>

<p>I can see you handling it to them while saying something like “Here is why I want to apply to “matches” and “safety” schoools . . . the Ivies are a reach for almost everybody these days.”</p>

18

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</p>

<p>I love Rutgers and I would still consider going there even if I were admitted to most of my top schools.</p>

19

<p>“International reputation isn’t great.”</p>

<p>Are you an international applicant? Then yes, the reputation of any place where you would study in the US does matter. If no one in your home country likes it, it will be hard for you to get a job when you return there after you graduate.</p>

<p>Are your parents immigrants? Then their list may just reflect what they heard about colleges and universities in the US when they were in their home country, and what they’ve heard about places here from friends within their own immigrant community.</p>

<p>As noted above, if you are a US citizen or legal permanent resident who is planning to start your career in the US, then the international reputation of your undergraduate college/university really doesn’t matter one bit.</p>

20

<p>Um</p>

<p><a href=“I’m%20in%20Jersey”>quote</a>

[/quote]
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<p>Probably got lost in the middle of that long post but I’m not international. Just noticed people ask this.</p>