<p>esoteric, your parents will be fine. I am qualified to say that because I am an immigrant and a parent and my wife and I are the least well to do in our clan. Those who look down on us, if there is/are, I don’t care. Those who are kind and respect us, they’ve been shared our joy and happiness as well as pain and disappointment all these years. One more occasion won’t be one too many for them. Believe me.</p>
<p>*In certain Asain group, any school other than HYP is consider 2nd rated. *</p>
<p>Including MIT, lol. That’s how it is in my family. </p>
<p>I’ll scuttle out of the Parents Forum now.</p>
<p>Edit-
Posted in wrong thread. Sorry.</p>
<p>Thanks…you’re all making a lot of sense. People who only value me (and I’m not referring to my parents here) in terms of my GPA and my college degree are not people I should worry over. </p>
<p>Olymom, thank you so much for your post. Of course, your situation was much different than mine, and definitely more serious, but I’m able to relate to it. I am the ‘responsible’ one in my family, the one who works really hard, so people do have expectations of me and want the best for me. They’re all so excited…but you’re right, its only because they love me, and those who really do love me will understand. They’re the only ones who count. They will come around, eventually. Thank you so much for that. You really helped a lot.
Compmom, I would just like to clarify that its not my parents concern with prestige and validation that is making them excited. In their minds, Ivy League = great school, so naturally, like most parents, they want me to have it because they want the best for me. Its not the prestige factor that’s influencing them. I’m working on teaching them, though, that while the Ivies are great, they’re not the only great schools. They’ve visited other schools with me and when not influenced by my extended family, they’re very excited about those schools, too. </p>
<p>I keep reminding my parents about my other match schools and I have told them bluntly that I will most likely be going to one of them. They are immigrants, but as immigrants they are introduced to the Ivy League as the best schools in America – which, in my opinion, is not true. But you have to see it from their point of view…which parent wouldn’t want their child to go to the best school? Their beliefs aren’t correct, but their intentions are good.</p>
<p>I’ve always done well in school. I’m a good test-taker so when my extended family members hear about my scores, they think I’m going to get in. They applied to schools 10-20 years ago, when to be completely honest, you didn’t need as much as you do now to get into extremely competitive schools. They think I’m being modest when I try to explain to them that things have changed. Yes, if I were an applicant then, with the same credentials, I probably would have gotten into many of these schools. But times have changed. They don’t realize that, and then they talk to my parents, who, naturally, get excited. No one in our family has gotten into an Ivy before. They think that I have a shot, so my entire family is thinking “OMG! She might be the first one!” This doesn’t matter to me, but the bottom line is, immigrant or not, much of America hails the Ivy League as the hallmark of education, as elitist schools whose degree signifies intelligence/worthiness, and they – my extended family, at least – have bought into it.</p>
<p>Again, thank you everyone. You all have no idea how much you helped. This is only the beginning. It might be awkward and uncomfortable at first, but the bottom line is that September 2010, I will be at a college that I love.</p>
<p>did you apply to Yale. I predict Yale will take you 
good luck</p>
<p>*Most of those immigrants are highly educated people, some with more financial resource than most Americans, and understand/appreciate what a degree from highly ranked schools means. *</p>
<p>I don’t know about the “financial” aspect, it may be true in some cases, but not all…so many immigrant children come onto CC saying that they need FA and are frustrated because they aren’t yet citizens/residents and can’t get any. Or, they are residents, yet they still need a lot of aid. Many of these kids have parents who aren’t educated, they have low paying jobs and think elite schools are the only answer. </p>
<p>However, you’re right that some immigrant do have a lot of money. Some of their kids have come onto CC and have said that their parents have declared that they will ONLY pay for a top 20 school. Ridiculous!</p>
<p>To the OP…</p>
<p>What schools do YOU want to go to??? That’s what’s important. :)</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Why, yes. That’s precisely what we mean by “unsophisticated.” That’s an unsophisticated mentality. I don’t care how many PhD’s someone had in his or her home country or how much money they had or have. It is a mentality that betrays complete ignorance of how things work in America, where there are many, many fine schools in all different flavors (large, small, East Coast, Midwest, South, West Coast, urban, rural, Ivy, not-Ivy) and where it is the individual who makes all the difference.</p>
<p>But, on CC, we’re supposed to pretend that by golly, because people who don’t know any better think this way, we’d better treat their opinions as important. </p>
<p>By the way, why aren’t the immigrants who have been here a while doing their part to convey to their friends and relatives back home, indeed, America ISN’T “HYPSM or bust”?</p>
<p>No, all we hear is that it’ll disappoint the relatives back home. And their opinions are somehow important, even though they are founded on nothing.</p>
<p>Might as well ask me to rate the “prestige” of universities in Belgium or New Zealand or something. Completely useless data points.</p>
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</p>
<p>That’s problem #1. Your scores aren’t ANYONE’s business except for your own and your parents. They simply aren’t the business or concern of your uncles, aunts, grandparents, etc. Why are they being broadcast?</p>
<p>“I keep reminding my parents about my other match schools and I have told them bluntly that I will most likely be going to one of them. They are immigrants, but as immigrants they are introduced to the Ivy League as the best schools in America – which, in my opinion, is not true. But you have to see it from their point of view…which parent wouldn’t want their child to go to the best school? Their beliefs aren’t correct, but their intentions are good.”</p>
<p>Just so you know, it’s not just Asian immigrant parents who feel that way. Some African and Caribbean immigrants feel that way.</p>
<p>One of my former students chose to go to the second tier public where I taught because it had an excellent major in his field of choice. He turned down a top 20 school to go there on a full scholarship. His parents threatened to disown him, and stopped talking to him after he turned down the top 20 school. They also refused to sign the paperwork for him to go to the public school, so he had to tell the public school he’d sign it himself when he turned 18 a month before school started. And his parents refused to transport him to the school.</p>
<p>Among other things, his mother told him that by going to the public, he’d “never meet the movers and shakers of the world.”</p>
<p>Anyway, he went to the public school, and became one of the best students in the school’s history. As a result of his being such a star, he also got opportunities that he wouldn’t have gotten at the top 20 school. This included two opportunities to meet the president of the U.S. when he was an undergrad. His relatives even happened to turn on the TV once to see him ask the president of the U.S. a question at a press conference. The student was a college junior.</p>
<p>By the time the student had graduated, he had long been reconciled with his parents. At the graduation party that his parents threw for him, his dad publicly apologized for telling his son not to go to the college. The student had several excellent career options, and by the third year after he had graduated from college, he was in a prestigious, well paying job that included frequent travel to NYC, Chicago and London.</p>
<p>Yesterday, about a dozen years after the student graduated, my husband (who also taught the student) and I spent the afternoon visiting the student, his fiancee (whom he met at our college) and his parents. at his parents’ home. His mother went out of her way to thank us both for supporting her son, and she said that she is so happy that her son considers us family.</p>
<p>So… keep this story in mind – whatever happens with your college applications. It is important to believe in yourself and to make your decisions about college based on what you feel is best for you. You are the only person who can live your life.</p>
<p>Mom2, I am definitely applying to schools outside of the Ivies I’d like to go to. I’m only applying to Ivies I’d consider going to if I was accepted.</p>
<p>Pizzagirl, my parents share my scores with my aunt and uncle when they ask. My aunt is very pushy and my mom isn’t clever enough to divert her attention. Before anyone reprimands me, I will say that my mother is very intelligent, but there is a difference between intelligence and cleverness!</p>
<p>Oh, NorthStarMom, thanks for sharing! I can’t believe his parents actually stopped talking to him, but I’m glad things worked out. That’s what I keep saying…its what you make our of your college experience, getting or not getting an Ivy League degree won’t make or break you.</p>
<p>Pizzagirl, I’m an American but still have had Asian parents ask me what my son’s SAT scores were. So I would imagine that if they’d ask me, a mere acquaintance, and would insist on an answer, they’d surely ask their own family members because this stuff is VERY important in their culture. I doubt “It’s none of your business” would cut it. I tried “He did well, thank you” and that didn’t work either. They demanded a number.</p>
<p>So they demanded your son’s SAT scores. So what? You’re under no obligation to give those scores to them. I hope you didn’t. Maybe they’ll catch on that it’s not appropriate in American culture to inquire about other people’s SAT scores.</p>
<p>I agree with Pizzagirl. They are being rude, and you are under absolutely no obligation to respond to them. Just refuse to answer, and then end the conversation.</p>
<p>I have many Asian friends who immigrated here from various parts of Asia. None of my friends ever has been that rude to me. The people you know are plain rude. Their actions aren’t due to being Asian. There are people who were born in this country who will be just as demanding if one allows them to treat one that way. There are many Asian immigrants who respect and follow the cultural norms here about viewing things like test scores as being private.</p>
<p>/\ /\ So is CC’s culture american or not ? Everyone asks everyone’s SAT score here</p>
<p>There is a difference between an anonymous forum in which someone’s SAT’s are asked in order to gauge the level of college they are looking at, and real life, in which the idea of actually asking someone for their GPA or scores is tacky and inappropriate.</p>
<p>I had a manager repeatedly ask me for my GMAT scores when I was applying to / got into business school. In front of others, no less. I did wind up putting him in his place. His inappropriateness didn’t oblige me to tell him anything.</p>
<p>Sometimes people ask not out of inquisitiveness but to have some sense of how to evaluate their own children’s chances.
People who are unwilling to share can now refer inquiries to the CC websites where admitted/deferred/rejected students post their stats.
If others insist on asking for your kids’ stats, you can claim that it’s only one case among thousands, and no inference can be drawn from your child’s experience. And if they keep on insisting, you can say MYOB.</p>
<p>I have traveled to countries where perfect strangers have asked me how much salary I earn, how much I paid for xyz, and made highly personal (read “derogatory”) comments about my appearance. I’ve shrugged them all off.</p>
<p>One thing people DO fail to understand is in many Asian culture people DO care about what other people think of them. That is a very powerful incentive for people to do the right thing in the Asian society - may it be not to steal, cheat, or lie. In the Western culture, we have laws and rules to enable everyone to live in a peaceful way. In many Eastern culture, it is how one is regarded by his community governs his behavior. There are some people who may not want to respect their parents, but the fear of been outcasted by his community would often force them to do the right thing.</p>
<p>I don’t think there is ONE prevailing culture in America. Our culture is made up of many different cultures. In the NYC area there are large communities of Jews, Chinese, Koreans, Spanish…If you belong to one of those communities you would tend to behave more like them. I am a Chinese who does not interact with the Chinese community that much. I am taken back sometimes when my parents’ friends would ask me how much is my house, but then I remember it’s not that they are being noisy with ME, they are just curious about the housing market and are just making small talks. I would no more tell a Jewish man he is rude when he won’t shake my hand than I would tell a Chinese person is rude by asking me how much money I make.</p>
<p>*/\ /\ So is CC’s culture american or not ? Everyone asks everyone’s SAT score here *</p>
<p>When we ask for stats, we are not doing so to be nosy or judgmental. We’re doing so to help the OP find the right school. When neighbors, co-workers, friends, family, etc ask, they are just being nosy.</p>
<p>We don’t “know” the people who post, therefore we can’t gossip about them or really do anything with the info. We’re kind of like “consultants” (lol) - we need the facts so we can give intelligent suggestions. Otherwise, we’re just throwing out silly suggestions.</p>
<p>BTW…when friends ask me for college advice for their kids, then I do politely ask for their stats - no point in suggesting an ivy for a C student with a 20 ACT. I would NEVER ask for such info in any other setting.</p>
<p>*But, on CC, we’re supposed to pretend that by golly, because people who don’t know any better think this way, we’d better treat their opinions as important. </p>
<p>By the way, why aren’t the immigrants who have been here a while doing their part to convey to their friends and relatives back home, indeed, America ISN’T “HYPSM or bust”?*</p>
<p>Very well said. </p>
<p>The immigrants (and anyone else) in this country bear some responsibility for perpetuating this “HYPs or bust” mentality. Certainly, while living in this country they have come into contact with thousands of people who have become very successful without an ivy pedigree.</p>