<p>Does your chance of getting into an elite college like Stanford increases significantly if you can afford to pay full tuition and if you are a legacy applicant?</p>
<p>yes it does</p>
<p>Both help.</p>
<p>your gets a HUUUUUGE BOOST if you're an international applicant who's willing to pay.
And if you have legacy, combine that with average test scores and grades and you're in :D</p>
<p>
[quote]
And if you have legacy, combine that with average test scores and grades and you're in
[/quote]
^ wth you're so wrong.</p>
<p>Yeah. Being able to pay does not make much of a difference at top schools. The effect legacy has on applications generally depends on the applicant; if you're good enough then it helps you. If you had absolutely no chance to begin with then it does not make any difference.</p>
<p>Simply put, you need to be as good as the next guy if you're paying full fees. You need to be quite a bit better than the next guy if you're asking for fin aid.</p>
<p>Hope this clears it.</p>
<p>Being able to pay does make a huge difference for internationals.
Just look at UPenn: 1300-1400 international students are enrolled, but only 200 of them receive financial aid. You think only 15%-20% of the international applicant pool are asking for fin aid?</p>
<p>I fully agree with what you're saying. But the fact remains that all those accepted to UPenn w/o asking for aid deserve to be at UPenn. Maybe less than those who got rejected from because of aid, but they still deserve to be there.</p>
<p>Sadly, this is what happens at non need-blind schools. It's tough.</p>
<p>Being able to pay doesn't mean that you'll get in everywhere - it's just that you wouldn't be at a disadvantage. Some people think that not being at a disadvantage is an advantage of sorts. I don't.</p>
<p>Now we agree.</p>
<p>dude when people who's SAT scores are in the 1800-1900 range, without any extra hook, get accepted into schools like UPenn, Carleton etc. etc. without AID or any extra hook while those with 2200+ get rejected because they applied for aid, you can say for certain that asking for aid makes a HUGE difference.
And if a 400 point difference in the SAT isn't a HUGE difference then I don't know what is.</p>
<p>Though I agree with Lakshya when he says being able to pay doesn't mean you'll get in everywhere but in most top schools, especially the Ivies, asking for aid makes a HELL of a lot of difference.</p>
<p>I don't know much about legacy, but I know it helps.</p>
<p>(@ NoFX -- well obviously if you can't spell properly/use slangs in your essay/get really bad recos/forget to press the submit button in the common app/send the admissions office a pack of marijuana and tell them that if they accept you they'll get more etc. etc. then even with aid duhh...obvious reject)</p>
<p>People who get in with scores in the 1800-1900 range are in the minority. In addition, they must've had something that helped explain/overshadow their lackluster scores.</p>
<p>It's all about the whole package, not just scores. I got 2200 in the SATs, does that guarantee me admission? No.</p>
<p>3 of the Ivies have a need-blind policy and the others are very generous in giving aid. Your assumption is wrong.</p>
<p>Ahh I forgot to mention "without any extra hook". Sorry.
And I know that the application isn't only about test scores but trust me, I've seen people with almost null EC's, average essays, average grades and average SAT scores get into the top schools..
The Ivies are "generous" in giving aid. They meet 100% need for everybody who gets in. But consider the students who applied for financial aid and were accepted and those who applied for no aid and were accepted and just compare their stats. Then the difference will be obvious.</p>
<p>And even I got a 2200+ in the SAT, but I'm still fretting over whether I'll get accepted into any of the colleges I applied to........I know that a 2200+ does not guarantee admission or anything else for that matter as well as you do.</p>
<p>That just doesn't happen. Believe it or not - they are people out there not applying for aid who are just as good if not better than those applying for aid. And this group isn't a minority - so it doesn't make sense in accepting the type of people you mentioned just because they aren't asking for aid.</p>
<p>I never for once stated that those who don't apply for aid are not great students.
All I'm trying to say is that those who don't apply for aid and have a significant advantage( statistically) over those who don't apply for aid. Thus people who aren't as good generally have a MUCH GREATER CHANCE of getting in if they don't apply for aid.</p>
<p>(oh and 200th post, haha never noticed my 100th post so....woohoo I guess?)</p>
<p>
[quote]
those who don't apply for aid and have a significant advantage( statistically) over those who don't apply for aid
[/quote]
I think no one here disagrees with that. You have to keep in mind that the international pool at selective schools is the most competitive sub group of all applicants. Within that pool, you are at an advantage if you don't apply for fin aid (or vice verse - you are not at a disadvantage), but relative to the American kids, just being international puts you at a great disadvantage (fin need or not). After all, no one is accepted solely for not asking for aid. Donating half a million to the school is another story...</p>
<p>IMO, paying full fee and legacy does help a lot..but the only thing that one should keep in mind is that there is no way of neglecting the fact that deserving students do make it in top colleges at any ''cost''....although the pool will b a bit less competitive if u pay full fee(at a non-need blind uni.)..and if ur applying to a college which does bothers about alumni/legacy thing then it becomes even less competitive...</p>
<p>Lets just leave it at requesting for financial aid as an International is a disadvantage.</p>
<p>My friend is paying full cost at Cornell, he only had a 1300 cr+m SAT score 700-750 on his SAT IIs and he was wasn't really at the top of his class. His ECs weren't that stellar, even though he had vast resources available to him. Just my two cents.</p>
<p><a href="@%20NoFX%20--%20well%20obviously%20if%20you%20can't%20spell%20properly/use%20slangs%20in%20your%20essay/get%20really%20bad%20recos/forget%20to%20press%20the%20submit%20button%20in%20the%20common%20app/send%20the%20admissions%20office%20a%20pack%20of%20marijuana%20and%20tell%20them%20that%20if%20they%20accept%20you%20they'll%20get%20more%20etc.%20etc.%20then%20even%20with%20aid%20duhh...obvious%20reject">quote</a>
[/quote]
No. YOU implied that an applicant with:</p>
<ul>
<li>average SAT scores - 1900+</li>
<li>average school grades - average meaning couple of As and mostly Bs</li>
<li>average essays - no errors but just not outstanding</li>
<li>average recs - which means the 'standard' recs</li>
<li>who can pay full tuition</li>
</ul>
<p>has AN AUTOMATIC acceptance to STANFORD.
This is what I disagreed with.</p>
<p>^^
well he may not have an "automatic" acceptance to Stanford (don't know much about Stanford admissions), but if he had applied to schools like UPenn or Cornell he would most likely be accepted.</p>
<p>I don't realize why people can't face the fact that it is so much easier to get in to the top schools without aid. When you state that you do not need aid you are put into a different applicant pool and compared separately. Since the applicants who apply without aid are <em>generally</em> much less competitive than those who apply for aid, the admissions process for them becomes a lot easier and they are compared only to people who apply without aid.
And the reason top schools accept so many international students without aid is just to increase their diversity and boost their 'international' status. Almost every single college has a 'quota' for different countries which they must fulfill. Thus if their aren't enough qualified applicants who applied for aid or if their isn't enough aid left to give, then the colleges just take students from the pool of students who have applied without aid.
That's the reason why there are many <em>qualified</em> candidates who apply for aid but are ultimately rejected just because there isn't enough aid left to give around. When you apply for aid, its no longer about how <em>qualified</em> you are to attend the school, its about how competitive you are as compared to the rest of the applicant pool.</p>