Is enthusiastic coach call = "likely letter"?

Parent Cafe
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<p>My D has received a few very enthusiatic coach calls; "We want you!" calls. They are NOT saying "You're in" but then again, these are D3 schools. </p>

<p>Is this just boosterism & PR, or is it a verbal "likely letter?" How much pull does a coach have if they really want someone? </p>

<p>My D has great ECs on top of sport, her scores are median or better for her favorite schools, her grades probably below median, her essays good, no idea about recs as we haven't seen them, and we do not need financial aid.</p>

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<p>SBMom, is this for Haverford? I don't know what you are asking...i.e if this is a likely letter.</p>

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<p>Nope, nothing close to a likely letter. Coaches send out a number of these calls in order to get as many candidates that they can. Even if a coach has substancial pull, in the end he has to choose who he wants on the team and he will have a quota of sorts. When he has to make his picks, your D may or may not be one of them. D3 schools in particular have a tough time getting enough athletes on their list to pick and choose, so an aggressive coach will be beating the bushes alot. </p>

<p>In one situation with our athlete son 4 years ago, a coach was very interested, and by every sign, stats, team analysis, it looked very good. Then all of the sudden, the contact ended. Did not think much of the subject till I ran into the mother of one of S's colleagues in the sport> That was the coach's new recruit; my son was dumped when he arrived on the scene. Would have never found out except for the coincidence. At another school, the coach resigned and went to another college in the middle of the recruiting process, and the new coach had his own picks and did not want to deal with anyone on the old coach's list. At still another school, the program was dropped. A lot can happen between the enthusiastic coach's call and the acceptance letter.</p>

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<p>achat:</p>

<p>Not referring to Haverford specifically-- though the coach there also very encouraging. </p>

<p>jamimom, this is just what I was thinking but wanted to confirm. Obviously they all want the biggest # of possibles to apply because they know they may not be the 1st choice of the kids they want most and don't want to dissuade anyone.</p>

<p>So is it: until the actual acceptance comes in, cast a jaundiced eye on a coach's wild enthusiasm? One coach has actually flown out to Ca. 2x to see D play & said "you're in," but this is a less selective school where her stats are much more impressive.</p>

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<p>2 articles that may help give you some insight</p>

<p>Article
In admissions many get special attention</p>

<p><a href="http://www.thedartmouth.com/article...sauthor=&stext=%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.thedartmouth.com/article...sauthor=&stext=&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>Article:</p>

<p>Ivy league reconsiders the role of athletics in admissions</p>

<p><a href="http://www.thedartmouth.com/article...sauthor=&stext=%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.thedartmouth.com/article...sauthor=&stext=&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

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<p>Sometimes you can put more weight in what a coach says than others. It depends upon the coach, school, sport, and the other athletes applying. If a coach who is extremely enthusiastic like the one who flew out to see your D play twice, and said "you're in" and you look at all the stats, you might see that she is likely in that school even without the coach's say so. My son had a few schools like that--he was accepted at one school before he even got around to talking to the coach because his stats academically were up there and the school had rolling admissions--his safety school. But if you are looking at a selective school which is a bit of a stretch without the sport, and you know that the coach needs to pitch the adcoms for a likely admissions, I would not celebrate until admissions sends you a letter. </p>

<p>Brown, a few years ago actually sent out letters to kids warning them that they were not accepted until admissions sent out the acceptance letter, that any other correspondence from other offices of the university were not acceptance letters and should not be viewed as such. It seems that some of the coaches were overly optimistic and disappointed a number of aspiring athletes. </p>

<p>Unless your coach is the Joe Paterno type at a college in a sport that is revered and your D is truly a standout, you should enjoy the attention but recognize that it can disappear in a heartbeat if a better candidate shows up.</p>

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<p>I've heard that coaches are notorious for getting hopes up when they don't have any admission insight to back it up. At our school's "college night" we were warned about coaches.....</p>

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<p>The final say is still made by the admissions office</p>

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<p>There are 'likely letters'. They were issued in October. A call or letter from the coach is not the same thing .</p>

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<p>I will also add my voice to this thread, as my son was a recruited DIII athelete last year. All of the coaches were encouraging, each calling every week. When my son went on his recruiting trips, he was told various things: one coach was presssuring kids to apply EDII, but told my son he did not need to -- he had already applied Rd and was accepted. Another coach on a visist told him he was "in," and he was. Finally, on third visit to a school he was told "his application was being supported," which it was, but he was waitlisted, and then accepted.</p>

<p>The moral of the story: while most of the coaches I believe try to be honest, you ain't in until admissions says your in.</p>

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<p>concerneddad, what is your son's sport and how did he decide on D3 v. D1? I apologize if you have covered this somewhere else. I'm relatively new here.
My son is a hs junior and will likely be a recruited runner. We are in the very beginning of the whole process. I've read a lot of the recommended books and the posts on this board. Thanks. Karen</p>

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<p>karenindallas, he was (he decided to no longer play) a football player. It was, in reality, talent level that defined D-I and D-III. He was always a very good student, so he was recruited by a few Ivies, and several D-III schools. When he got injured, the Ivies dropped him. </p>

<p>Quality of education was always a concern to him, and all of the schools he looked at were top-tier, or close thereto.
CD</p>

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<p>My son is currently a freshman on the football team at a D3 school. A handful of colleges were interested in him and he received a lot of calls during the fall and winter from the coaches. All of the schools were highly selective academically. Coaches in the NESCAC for example, are alloted a certain number of "slots" by the admissions office. To be supported by the coach could mean having one of the slots or just being recommended to the admissions office by the coach.</p>

<p>In either case, the academic record has to meet the school's minimum standards. Because there is some difficulty in attracting good athletes with good academics to these schools, recruited athletes are pressured to apply early decision and make the committment. A coach does not want to "waste" a slot. </p>

<p>In my son's case, his application was supported. He applied early action with no binding committment on his part. He was accepted EA. I don't know if supported meant a "slot" or just a recommendation from the coach.</p>

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<p>Thanks for all the input. It is really difficult to assess the relative enthusiasm & the relative difficulty of admission, and it helps to hear your experiences. </p>

<p>All my D's top choices are reaches (nothing way out of the ballpark, though; all are possible even without her sport but obviously strengthened considerably with her sport.) She applied to two EAs, so hopefully in two weeks there should be two safetys in hand. That will make everything less stressful. If her ED comes through, we celebrate! But if it does not, she would probably consider aplying ED2 to one of her other top schools... But if she is waitlisted at the ED school, she may want to wait for RD on that one.</p>

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<p>SBmom: As my son was "deferred" at his ED school, admitted at his EA school, and accepted off the wait list at was ealier his #2 choice, I know all to well the cominations and permutations you have descibed. Good luck to all.</p>

<p>And, I would add, that my son is as happy as any kid could be with his school, even though it did not turn out to be his ED school.</p>

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<p>My son had weekly enthusiastic calls from coaches and promises of money from Div 1 for running. One of the schools that recruited most heavily , the coach had him out, sent him post cards etc. he was waitlisted. At other schools I think it gave him an edge in admissions. For the most part it did help him with admissions but he was still in the range of the schools. The wait list was a surprise and an eye opener for him however as the coach was so encouraging. My S would never commit to that school being his #1 choice however as he wasn't sure and is very honest so that may have been the reason.(Wash U) The coach asked him repeatedly if it was his 1st choice school. He ended up at the best place for him Pomona and the running helped him have the edge that is needed for that school. I read an article that said the football coach did not get many of his recruits in last year so that may change for this year.</p>

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<p>arizonamom--</p>

<p>Can you clarify your post? Did your S apply ED to Wash U and get waitlisted after being told by the coach that he would be supported? Or are you saying he applied there RD along with other schools after being recruited, with no specific support from the coach?</p>

<p>I'm reading it as the latter, because of what you said about your S being unwilling to indicate it as his 1st choice school. Athletic recruiting appears to be mysterious and to vary from school to school, but I have heard of coaches 'flagging' candidates. Clearly this would only happen in a 'love match' when the athlete is willing to commit to the school and the school the athlete. If an athlete isn't ready to say that a school is his or her #1 choice, wouldn't the coach rightfully expect that the candidate is leaning elsewhere, and move on to a candidate who is a better fit for his or her program?</p>

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<p>Arizonamom, can you private message me and send me your email address? My son (jr. in hs) is a runner and I have some questions for you about the whole recruiting thing. I wondered what your son's distances are (cross country and track???? and how strong a runner he was in high school). I know the coaches we've talked to so far really want the runners to commit ED so the coach knows they will come if accepted. We are early in the process, of course. Thanks a lot. Karen</p>

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<p>Dizzymom, My son applied regular decision and was undecided between 2 schools at the time. The coach called him regularly, had him out for a visit and sent him a postcard after his visit saying he would be a great addition to their program. He told the coach that Wash U was up there and one of his top choices. He had not visited everywhere until mid April as finaid was a concern and he was waiting to see where the best merit/aid was from. When he visited Pomona he was sold , it was that perfect fit and that was not one of his original top 2 or even the best financially. It just goes to show that things work out in the end. It is hard to have a first choice when you haven't visited everyschool and my S was trying to be honest with the coach. I do understand however that most coaches don't want to waist an endorsement on someone who may not end up there. Karenindallas, I will send you more info . via e-mail</p>

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<p>If I were a recruited athlete, I would call the director of admissions and get the details for that particular schools' athletic admissions. The same terms mean different things.</p>

<p>For example Williams claims to have 66 athletic "tips", but the number and the term "tip" is misleading.</p>

<p>Those 66 slots are really reserved for impact players whose qualifications would not be sufficient for admission without athletics. Williams ranks their applicants on a 1 to 9 scale academically. Virtually all academic 1's are admitted. About 65% of academic 2's are admitted, with ECs being the deciding factor and so on and so forth. The college as a whole averages an "academic 2.8". The 66 athletic "tips" average an academic "5", with a "7" being as low as they will go, even for a star defensive end. There is some negotiation back and forth with the admissions office, but as long as the 66 meet the agreed upon distribution of low stats (i.e. not ALL 6s and 7s), the coaches pick these students. About half of these 66 are allocated to the football team, with ice hockey being the other big consumer of lo-stat athletes. The academic qualifications of these 66 "tips" had been steadily declining over the last decade, despite increasing stats for the non-athletic "tips". Morty Shapiro finally stepped in and forced the coaces to reverse that downward trend with the "tips" in the most recent classes.</p>

<p>In addition to the 66 "tips" used for impact, low academic athletes, coaches are also given 32 slots to use on students in the academic 2 and 3 categories. These are kids who could be accepted academically if their ECs put them over the top. Basically, the coaches have the authortity to make athletics the EC the puts them over the top for 32 additional kids.</p>

<p>Finally, there are approximately 30 more kids in each class who are admitted by the admissions office, rating their atheletic ECs in the same way they would consider any other ECs and academic qualifications. These are mostly academic 1s and 2s who are deemed likely to play four years of varsity sports at Williams.</p>

<p>In theory, the coaches get the same 100 or so "slots" to use whether the kid ends up going to Williams for not. However, you can be sure that the coaches don't waste their slots and will not designate the kid without a commitment to attend, if the coach "gets him/her in".</p>

<p>Other schools don't give coaches as much leeway in getting low-stat kids accepted and the athletes who are tagged by the coaches still have to pass muster in the admissions office. These schools, of course, don't usually win any national championships!</p>

<p>Thus, phone calls from coaches can mean a lot of different things. At Williams, it could mean a lot because the coaches have the ability to get 66 kids accepted almost without regard to academics (assuming they can read, write, and tackle). At other schools, the coaches can identify kids they'd like to have and definitely give a boost, but are ultimately at the mercy of negotiations with the admissions office.</p>