<p>It sounds like we were both "once bitten twice shy"-- and much smarter in evaluating the options when people came out of the woodwork. I think the ever-changing landscape is a key thing to understand... When my D recently withdrew herself from some schools where she had gotten Early Action acceptances, it surely opened up new spots for someone who is waiting for RD... It's all shifting until everyone is committed.</p>
<p>We are lucky that the ED2 school was one of the most appealing to my D apart from the coach. The Coach at the ED2 left nothing to interpretation-- very clear, factual, and forthright. Also, this coach was plain ol' nice. My D will enjoy working with this person. In fact, three other coaches were equally clear about support & where D stood as a priority. </p>
<p>In retrospect, coach at first school was not really being unclear, I just didn't know the right questions to ask & how to read between the lines.</p>
<p>Speedcoach -- Yay!!! So glad to hear your S's happy ending!!!!</p>
<p>I agree with above posters that whatever else you feel comfortable sharing in terms of your family's experience would be mega-valuable to others present and future perusing these boards -- it seems to be very difficult to get information on how real live people actually navigate the recruited athlete process. Like a board game, there seem to be so many ways to roll the dice and have a different outcome along the way.</p>
<p>The "ever changing landscape" is a great way of paraphrasing it. My son's sport is not important. What is important is that the process is a fluid one and is never over until a letter is received. In many ways, it is also very Darwinist in that it is the "survival of the fittest." Every coach is out to get the best recruits. I really do feel for them because they must deal with this process every month of the year. It must really distract them from their coaching tasks. Since it seems that all our insights are valued in the future, I would be happy to continue to share them. Perhaps we can spare some future parent some angst about the porcess.</p>
<p>My son's good friend was rejected ED2 from a top LAC after the coach told him he was first on the list. The young man is devastated as he bought his hoodie after his visit and has been on cloud 9. His mother told me a week before the letter that the coach had reiterated this to them that week. Having gone through a similar process, with a similar school though not the same sport, I did not feel too good about a few things about situation but said nothing as I do not like spreading the gloom when everyone is so happy. The boy was definitely admissable, falling within the mid 50% range for SAT1, and good grades though not high from a rigorous school. What I knew that the family did not know was there was another prospect with higher stats sports and school wise in the wings who did not apply ED2 but was making a commitment in a letter.</p>
<p>That, however, is why she applied to 5 other schools anyhow. We were pretty sure the coach was credible. (I actually asked, so what if Venus Williams shows up next week?, and I liked the answer.) But nothing is the equivalent of an actual letter of admission (or likely letter). Until this is in hand, no assuming & no celebrating.</p>
<p>This is a great thread; I hope people keep sharing their experiences. I knew nothing about athletic recruiting until a few months ago, when My S's coach encouraged him to contact the coach at his first choice school. I'm trying to learn all I can because my daughter, who is a freshman, is already excelling at her sport and wants to continue it in college. I found the Chris Lincoln book "Playing the Game" to be very informative and entertaining.</p>
<p>"Playing the Game" is the Bible of Athletic Recruiting. So many of the scenes which Lincoln describes happened to us that is was erie right down to details. This book should be mandatory ready for people on this thread. It gave me a great insight into how the game was played.</p>
<p>Sbmom, did your D get a likely letter? I do not remember. I am so happy for you and for her. And you certainly spread your risks well with the variety of choices your D has. Am a bit worried about this young man as he did not do as well in choosing. Parents were so sure he would get right in as he has good stats and is in a high impact sport. But he is a bit small, and I don't think his coach is so sure about him playing college level; I don't feel he got an enthusiastic rec from him. But this particular coach was not playing straight, I am sure.</p>
<p>Actually, I know of a horror story where someone received a likely letter from an Ivy and was then not admitted. The student's SAT scores and grades were not, I believe, anywhere near an Ivy norm.</p>
<p>I also know of a student who received a likely letter from a (different) Ivy and was admitted.</p>
<p>My S did not receive a likely letter, but was admitted...to a different Ivy from the two mentioned above.</p>
<p>Don't think that is going to work. If he does not have his home coach's support, he is going to have a problem. My S had heard some things about that. I believe at least one school brought it up in a very veiled way. Sometimes you really have to read between the lines of what they say. He needs to focus on schools where he does not need the coach or the sport at this point. Some of his schools require a modicum of demonstrated interest, and just visiting with the coach is not going to help much if the sport is a bust. It is not a piece of cake getting into a school through the sports card.</p>
<p>Maybe the coach would support him for SOME level of program. I'm sure if he got this far that there are programs where he would be a real asset. It's too bad there isn't an assistant coach or someone else who would support him.</p>
<p>In my D's case her HS coach is an academic teacher who was totally not involved in endorsing her for anything. He's a teacher, not a professional coach. Maybe the kid can do it on his own? </p>
<p>D's credentials were verifiable because of the accomplisments of her team, the strength of the league, and her personal win/loss record. She also had a tape. We were neophytes and the tape was nothing great; just some clips of points & games during some practices and some matches. (The practices were important because the best level of competition could be found on her own team.)</p>
<p>On the other hand was the coach maybe shooting him down as a kid not committed to the sport, not likely to continue, slacker in practice, bad sport? Tha'd be hard to end run.</p>
<p>Finally, some coaches would give you a small boost if you could play as a walk on and had the basic academic credentials.</p>
<p>Assistant coach supports him. Kid is totaly committed, not a slacker, good sport, good kid. Head coach feels he has to be honest in his recs. Not a good situation.</p>
<p>Home coach support is huge factor. My son's head coach played 11 years in the NFL, his position coach 5 years in the NFL, and his youth coach had 14 years in the NFL. All three were soldily behind him. His postion coach filed many phone calls week after week. And even with that, he was shut out of the Ivies (mostly due to an injury that halfed his senior year), and got into Pomona off the wait list because the coach was blinded sided (his words) by the admissions office. The others schools that recruited him all accepted him, as the coaches said would likely be the case. And, in each instance his grades and scores were enough in and of if self for admission.</p>
<p>I could not imagine, howvere, what the situation would have been without coaches talking up his work ethic, his on and off the field leadership, his solid judgment, his dedication to the game, etc , etc. Film can only tell you so much, and after that if there is nor overwhelming evidence of athletic prowess, you better have a credible voice speaking in the college coach's ear.</p>
<p>The good news is that my son's college search came to a happy ending this week when he learned that he had been accepted into one of the more prestigious Ivy League schools. His admission was supported by a Coach at that school.</p>
<p>This news ends an experience that has been an emotional roller- coaster ride for my family during the past 9 months. </p>
<p>The experience has taught me a lot about the college recruiting process for non revenue sports and I would like to share my observations with you. I elected to provide this long post after I spoke today to a mother of a student in the same non- revenue sport as my son who was proudly telling the world that her daughter, who is a high school junior is being "recruited" because she has received letters from colleges. I hope the process is easier for this girl than my son however I have heard more stories from other parents that have endured an exhausting experience like ours rather than a simple straight forward recruiting process for their child. I do not believe the recruiting process is as simple as it at first appears.</p>
<p>The point I want to make is that merely because your son/ daughter receives promising telephone calls and letters or because a Coach gives you his "word" that your child will be admitted to his school you should not rest until you get the coveted acceptance letter in your hand. </p>
<p>Because my son participates in a non revenue sport and the Ivy group is a small circle I have purposely avoided using school or coaches names.</p>
<ol>
<li><p>We were advised to attempt to market our son by sending out letters with his sport resume to a approximately 10 Ivy and LAC schools. We included a copy of his unofficial transcript so as to not waste anyone's time recruiting him if he clearly could not get admitted. In response to our mailing we received an encouraging reply from nearly every school. We thought that the process would be easy. I now believe nearly everyone receives a form letter of encouragement in response to their letter of introduction.</p></li>
<li><p>My son was promptly invited for an overnight weekend at one of the top Ivies ("Ivy #1). The Coach did not mislead us in any way. That Coach was a professional. The Coach at Ivy #1 told us that he would invite "x" number of candidates for my son's sport position but he would only support admissions for 1/3d of those that visited. My son went to the school and fell in love with it but never heard again from the coach. As an adult I can distinguish the probability of rejection. A 17 year old kid had a more difficult time understanding the probability of rejection. My son was heart broke. Please prepare you son/ daughter for disappointment.</p></li>
<li><p>A few weeks later an assistant Coach at a mid level Ivy (Ivy #2) called on a Monday and summoned my son to be at their campus that Wednesday. We were told that he must be there at that time if he ever wanted to be considered for support in the admissions process. We dropped everything and made the trip of considerable distance. In hindsight I believe that a prospect that had previously verballed to the Coach at Ivy #2 may have wavered. My son was the replacement. The Coach told my son unconditionally that he had reviewed his transcript with admissions and that he would support him for early decision admission. My son was lead to believe that the support from this Coach was firm and in return that assistant Coach asked my son to give his word he would apply early decision. Two weeks later the Coach from Ivy #2 called and said that he could not support my son for ED admission. I spoke to the Coach and he told me that the school's admissions office had concerns with my son's academic record however that Coach told me that if my son did great in his January marking period then he would support him for admission into Ivy #2. My son worked like hell during the fall marking period and had his best marking period ever. This experience was the most positive aspect to the entire process because until this point of his life my son had more or less coasted and received good marks. He now understands that he could not coast. We sent the transcript to the Coach at Ivy #2 but received no reply. My son wrote more letters during January/ February to the Coach at Ivy #2 but never again received a return letter or call. I now believe that the Coach found another kid at the position and had moved on which he was entitled to do. I do however believe that this Coach was obligated to inform my son that there was no possibility of future support with admissions so that my son could adjust his plans accordingly. I have since talked to another parent of a high school student who dealt with this same assistance Coach at Ivy #2 and he described a similar experience for his son. The other father believes that this Coach lines up recruits by giving a false hope to provide fall backs if his first choice recruits commit to another school or are denied admission.</p></li>
<li><p>In early November my son received a call from an assistant coach at a 3d Ivy ("Ivy #3) who inquired whether he had any interest in his school. Because a 17 year old is inclined to tell the truth to a fault, my son relying upon the statements of the Coach at Ivy #2 replied that he had "committed" to Ivy #2. Following that call I explained the facts of life to my son and he attempted to ignite interest by telephone calls and e- mails to the Coach at Ivy #3 but that Coach never again called.</p></li>
<li><p>In late October my sons scholastic Coach became concerned that my son was not receiving the attention he believed he should have received. The scholastic Coach cold called an assistant Coach at Ivy #4. Ivy #4 is generally considered to be better academically than Ivies 2 & 3. The college Coach did not return the scholastic Coaches telephone calls. The scholastic Coach kept calling the assistant Coach at Ivy #4. I recall telling the high school Coach that it was OK to stop calling because the non response was a response however the scholastic Coach insisted that it a matter of respect that he deserved the courtesy of a returned telephone call from the college Coach at Ivy #4. Finally the coaches crossed telephone line and my son was invited for a visit to Ivy #4. When we arrived at Ivy #4 the college Coach was not particularly friendly and I feared that our invitation had only been a courtesy for not returning the telephone call. </p></li>
<li><p>In early December my son was invited by a top LAC to visit. The Coach at the LAC told my son and me that he had reviewed his transcript with the admissions office and was confident that my son could be admitted if he applied ED2. The LAC Coach said that he was less confident my son would be admitted if he did not apply ED2. During the car ride home my son said that he would hold out for Ivies #2 & 4. I told him he was being foolish; take the sure thing at the LAC and move on. He refused.</p></li>
<li><p>In the intervening months my son developed a number of choices. He was admitted to 2 National Universities both ranked top 50 by US News, and 2 Masters Colleges each ranked top 10 in their region by US News. One of these schools also would give him a 1/3d scholarship. [Note: remember that Ivies and LAC do not give athletic scholarships.]</p></li>
<li><p>We heard nothing from Ivy #4 after our visit until February when the Coach called and asked my son if he would attend if admitted. My son had liked Ivy#4 very much. My son said that he would attend Ivy #4 if admitted. Four weeks later the Coach from Ivy #4 called and asked my son to confirm that he would attend if admitted. Again my son said "yes". By this time I believed that Ivy # 4 wanted him and my wife and I began to believe it was the best place for him. The more we read about the school the better we liked it.</p></li>
<li><p>This week my son learned that he had been admitted to Ivy #4 and the LAC. He will proudly attend Ivy #4 without a nickel of scholarship money. My wife and I believe that the experiences my son will receive in and out of the class room while attending Ivy #4 will create opportunities that will expand the choices during his life. The experience recruiting drama proved to be worth the end result.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>In conclusion let me tell you what may seem obvious: it is a big, big world out there and there are many many talented kids that are seeking the same place in the prestigious college that your child desires. There is some luck involved. At least for non revenue sports your son/ daughter will still be required to have good marks. It is great if your son/ daughter is successful in gaining admission to the school they desire however if they are not successful in being admitted to their dream school then that is still the same kid that you love. </p>
<p>Wow, Otis, what a story! I'm glad it worked out for your son, but what a difficult process for a teenager to go through. And from what I've read on CC, your experience is probably (sadly) typical. </p>
<p>My D is a junior and we have been making the rounds, visiting schools, and meeting with coaches, both D1 and D3. The D1 coaches are much more encouraging, specific about which camps/showcases to go to in order to be seen, and clear about the level of accomplishment that they need in order to recruit someone. D3 coaches have ranged from wildly encouraging to downright rude (do they forget that they are representatives of their institutions!) One athlete we spoke with at a D3 school said he was one of 80 recruited that year for his sport, expected to try out for a fall practice team of 40 and then winnowed down to 20 for the spring season. I guess D3 coaches can promise a whole lot also, and they are not accountable for their promises because they are not really "recruiting" you with a scholarship or National Letter of Intent. D1 coaches may promise and perhaps mislead as Otis describes above, but once the process is over, a player will know where she/he stands with regards to that team.</p>