<p>Mary anna, i read your earlier post regarding your theatre student making callbacks for the opera and i wondered if she, too, had tried for mt. I thought it was very cool that she made those callbacks. What a wonderful affirmation of her talent. You can sure start to question that when those professors basically say to you, "you're not good enough for our program." I've really struggled with convincing my d that that one panel can't determine her talent. It's her gift and their thoughts and decisions can't change that. But, i bet she knows your student. I'll pm you and we can share info.</p>
<p>Susan, I think you missed my point. I wasnt saying that kids from the boonies shouldnt even try. Of course they should try! I was just saying that if they do try and dont get the results they want they shouldnt get discouraged because it could be because they dont have as much experience, training or CONFIDENCE as some others. Getting into the top conservatories is like getting into the Ivy League universities and I even wonder about how good the training really is at some of them since most of the kids they take are already practically professionals. Its like some of them get their reputations because of the successes of kids they graduated that were going to be successful no matter where they went. I know a girl that got into a supposed top school on a full scholarship for acting last spring. She has already decided she is wasting her life there and has put out a transfer application to her home states university where she can go for free, perform with a professional company, graduate in 3 years and maybe go to grad school after that.</p>
<p>Tripletreat,</p>
<p>I appreciate your concerns but I caution you to think more carefully before making statements like </p>
<p>"I even wonder about how good the training really is at some of them since most of the kids they take are already practically professionals. Its like some of them get their reputations because of the successes of kids they graduated that were going to be successful no matter where they went."</p>
<p>I don't know where you got that idea but it couldn't be further from the truth. I can only speak factually about the University of Michigan's MT program and in the entire program this year, there are only 2 students that I know of out of approximately 95 in the entire department who had noteworthy professional credits before entering UM - one on Broadway and one in a significant National Tour. Of course when the school begins to regularly graduate students who go on to notable careers as has been the case at UM (e.g. Hunter Foster, Jennifer Laura Thompson, Celia Keenan Bolger, Barrett Foa, Erin Dilly and Gavin Creel, just to name a recent few) it is going to attract talented students who want to go there. But I'm comfortable in saying that the schools that have the reputation of being tops in MT have gained that reputation for good reason - they provide excellent training. Again, that is not to say that there isn't good training available in other places, but "dissing" the well respected programs and the work their students do while in those programs does not do you proud.</p>
<p>Tripletreat,
Like the kids theatermom knows at UMich (and I even know a couple there too), the kids I know who got into the various well known BFA programs just this year alone are not professionals. They were ready for this step in their training. They had taken voice, dance, acting and had been in shows. Their experiential level varied. Some have mostly done school shows, some community theater, some summer programs, some regional theater. I don't think of my D's friends who got into very selective programs as professionals yet. They merely were ready for these programs, had talent, took lessons, did some shows, and so forth. And it is not like they do not NEED the BFA program or as if they are ALREADY trained. The training is still a challenge. Sure, my D says all the other kids in her program are talented. The college then takes them to the next level. No, they are not starting from scratch but no, they don't already know it all either. These kids will get more training in college and it is a rigorous program. They will be challenged and their classmates are not like the group back home at their regular high school (unless they came from a performing arts high school). </p>
<p>I hear you likening it to getting into the Ivy League. Well, with that too, a kid can come from the boonies. I think a kid from ANYWHERE can make it. I actually have a kid from the boonies who is attending an Ivy League school. If you work hard, achieve, seek out opportunities, pursue things with motivation and drive, you can do anything. </p>
<p>I don't agree that the colleges get a reputation because they churn out talented people due to the fact that they had a talented group to work with in the first place. Yes, the pool of students they accepted had the talent to make the cut of admissions but then the school educated them so they do turn out some very ready people for a career on stage. Getting into school is one level of it. Doing well once there will get you to the next level. It is not like the school is a waste of time. The school takes them to the next level. </p>
<p>There are schools and educations out there for everyone. A very selective school is not for all people. Schools make matches with students that fit their criteria. There are schools that are a good fit for various people and it is a matter of making the match between student and school. Then the student must work hard to get the most that she/he can from that opportunity at that school and seek the next level in their pursuits. This goes for ANY school, not just so called top ones.</p>
<p>I have no idea why you question the training and how good it is at selective schools. I can say that at the Ivy League school (Brown) my kid goes to, the work is very challenging and she must work hard. It is not like "gee, we have all these smart kids here and we don't have to teach 'em too much because they are going places anyway." The "training" there is tops and a student with motivation will fly with it. A student who just is there to say they went there, won't make it very long. I can say that the work involved in my other D's conservatory is long hours and requires hard work. They don't just say, "you are a good singer already". They say, "you are great at that but we are gonna show you how to be great at some other things you don't realize you can do too". You do a monologue, they pick it apart. And yes, you had to be good to get in but then they don't say, "you already know it all, so not much more to teach ya." They say "you hardly know what else you can learn, just you wait." A background before college helps, but it is just the beginning, not the end. </p>
<p>Susan</p>
<p>Theatermom, I didn't say a word about Michigan. I haven't even researched it because it is too expensive and doesn't have big scholarships or good financial aid as far as I could tell and I aint dissin ... I'm just sayin ... I don't even need to say ... Here is what other people have said on this forum ... </p>
<p>Carnegie student and Interlochen alum birdboy782 on 6/15/05
[quote]
... my class had several students come in from CCM, BYU, Colorado, etc. to start over. Also, some students come with extensive professional experience - even broadway, tours, sitcoms, etc - before they ever started CMU.
[/quote]
Doesn't Carnegie take like 8 - 10 students a year for MT? Where is there room for the country kids?</p>
<p>Father of a CCM grad mtdad on 12/03/02
[quote]
It would not be stretching the truth too far to say that maybe half of the students accepted into the really top programs have their Equity cards (meaning they are already professional performers), and virtually all will have a resume replete with lead roles in musical productions. These roles will most likely not be in high school productions (unless they attended a performing arts high school); more likely they will be commercial and/or top-notch community theater productions
[/quote]
and further on 9/24/03...
[quote]
The majority of the kids who go to the top programs while young in years have already established themselves as seasoned performers, many with Equity cards already in pocket. For these students the BFA and especially the conservatory setting are very good choices, but for anyone who is not obsessed with the theater it may well be the wrong path. My personal experience is with a child who caught the stage bug attending a theater day camp the summer before Kindergarten (we enrolled her simply as a way for her to burn off some of her boundless energy)and by third-grade she knew what she wanted. By the time she started her conservatory program she had 13 years of theater school, 13 years of community theater productions, and many years of voice & piano training to support her choice. The Boston's and CCM's of the world are for kids like this, but are most likely not the right choice for the majority of people.
[/quote]
Noone has ever disputed those posts exept for the OCU info person that wanted to argue with birdboy about whether showcases are important. WCT, whose son goes to Carnegie, even confirmed her son's experience was like birdboy's. Also notice that WCT teaches voice and acting at a performing arts high school that has produced at least two NFAA WINNERS in the last 3 years ... her son being one of them. Also, didn't your d get her Equity card the summer after first year at Michigan? Didn't she have a supportive mom with an Ivy League theater degree that took Masters classes as an undergrad, an Ivy League professor father, a big city private voice teacher, years of big city dance training and a summer of precollege audition prep at Carnegie? See where I'm coming from? See where I got that idea? I never said the training wasn't good at the conservatories but can you say with a straight face that the teachers are BETTER than what you might get at a lower tier school when you think about the talented and EXPERIENCED students they get to work with? Where does the girl who studied at the Whitney Traysh Dance Studio and Hair Salon fit in there? (Sorry. I had to throw the last part in. I am in the process of writing a piece for our sketch comedy troupe based on the dance studio. haha)</p>
<p>Tripletreat,</p>
<p>I wasn't trying to get into an argument with you. I used UM for my example because it is always cited among the top programs in the country and it is the only one of which I have first hand knowledge. I try not to pass along information that is second or even third hand. I have no direct knowledge of the pre acceptance qualifications of CCM students (other than those I know who were accepted by both CCM and UM and chose UM - 12 in the past 2 years) so cannot comment on that. And the discussion between birdboy782 and Wct was about the importance of senior showcases and the quality and quantity of classes at CMU, not the professional experiences of CMU students.</p>
<p>My point was never that there are not talented students in the "top" programs - of course there are. I was asking you to support your statement that MOST of the students in these programs came in as "practically professionals" and therefore would be successful no matter what kind of training they receive, therefore suggesting that the top programs really do nothing to earn their reputation other than having figured out how to recruit all the most experienced, best trained students. Gee, assuming that they have come up with some secret recruitment weapon, how do you think they keep them once they get them if their training isn't up to the demands of these very experienced students? Hmmmmm.....</p>
<p>With regard to my own child, she had had less than a year of voice lessons (and sporadic ones at that) at the time she auditioned for college and had appeared in a sum total of three musicals in her entire life, all at her NON-performing arts high school. I'm not sure how my undergraduate theater degree from 1972 and the fact that her father is a college professor can be considered reasons for her being accepted to UM. While she had many years of dance training, I can safely say that she worked at our town equivalent of the Whitney Traysh Dance Studio and Hair Salon, not Philadelphia's Rock School of Ballet. And yes, she did audition, was offered and accepted an Equity contract to perform in summer stock this past summer but will be the first one to tell you that there is no way that would have happened without the amazing training she received in just one year at UM.</p>
<p>So, if you want to continue to believe that kids without opportunities for professional work or training prior to college have no chance to be admitted at top programs and shouldn't even try, that is your perogative. But the message you are spreading is so negative it makes me sad to think that some other student who really might have a chance will read your post and miss an important opportunity. What is it that they say in sports? The only shots you are sure to miss are the ones you don't take.</p>
<p>Theatermom, You are usually one of the nicest people on this forum and I definately dont want to cause bad blood but my message is NOT negative in the slightest. I said Of course they should try! but if they dont get in, they SHOULD. NOT. BE. DISCOURAGED. How is that negative?</p>
<p>Also, the conversation between birdboy and wct isnt the issue. The comment from birdboy that I quoted was him telling about his CLASSMATES at Carnegie which says a lot. And MOST of them being practically professionals was an overstatement. The quotes I gave from the person with direct experience from CCM said that it wouldnt be stretching the truth that maybe HALF are already professionals so I will stand corrected on that. If someone else with experience with CCM wants to correct what mtdad said go right ahead. However, as of right now it is the record on this forum. I do know a girl that got in Carnegie off the waitlist for acting 2 years ago. She was a damn good actress from a top arts high school but said that at first she felt totally inadequate compared to the other drama kids there. </p>
<p>And no ... If you live in Phili, there is NO WAY your d studied at the equivalent of the Traysh studio. Thats impossible! haha You would have to come to the rural south or midwest to see the roadside studios in one stoplight towns and have a conversation with the owners to have any inkling about what Im talking about with that ... but they don't take kindly to yankees so you might not wanna. :) Were talking big haired ladies that inherited the studio from their grandmothers and have no college or certification from anywhere. Yes. Places like that do exist and are the only option for some kids. In Phili? No nuh uh ... Not possible. :p ;)</p>
<p>Triplethreat...</p>
<p>I am not pleased that you label me as "wanting to argue" with birdboy about the validity of senior showscases. One single handed vision on the topic was being presented and I offerd another vision. I could care less what one school does over the other. That's their business. But I was only offering an alternative opinion that everyone needs to hear about.</p>
<p>OK, I will chime in here. </p>
<p>I have had two students at CMU MT
Neither one had worked in an Equity theatre. One had only done high school shows. The other, high school and community theatre.</p>
<p>For what it's worth</p>
<p>xxx,Mary Anna</p>
<p>I want to offer another word of encouragement to any of those students out there who might be intimidated by even the suggestion that only students with serious professional experience and training are going to be accepted into the "top tier" MT training programs. If that were the case, most of these schools wouldn't bother to hold auditions, they'd just accept students based on their resumes.</p>
<p>I loved the post by CoachC awhile ago wherein she spoke to the ability of auditors to identify raw natural talent and how when she was in a position to make choices about students, she always looked beyond the resume to the qualities that don't show up in one - things like passion and work ethic, the kind of thing you CAN'T teach but without which a student will never reach his or her full potential. </p>
<p>If I had thought that my D would have been evaluated on her resume alone, it would have been foolish for her to even think of auditioning at many of her chosen schools. Fortunately, we were given reason to believe that such was not the case (mostly from people who post here on CC), that the auditors would evaluate her on what they saw and heard her present, what she had to say for herself when she met them and what she wrote in her applications about her reasons for wanting to pursue MT. Without question there are many more students appying than there are spots for in these programs, but the two most important steps to being offered one of those spots are working your butt off in whatever training and performing opportunities are available to you, and believing that success is possible. </p>
<p>Believe.</p>
<p>I lost my post but will try again.</p>
<p>I'm not sure what to say but I want kids to know that rather than think they can't make it into these programs because of where they came from or that they did not have the same opportunities than the next kid, is not a good way to think about this because it is NOT true. Also, I want to reiterate that I know plenty of kids in the known BFA programs and none were Equity going into it and I would not call them professionals either. It is usually a teensy amt. of kids that have such credentials as they enter the programs. </p>
<p>I think Theatermom's D is a great example. She had one year of formal voice lessons, had only done three musicals, and had done a lot of ballet. She succeeded in getting into a very selective college program. The fact that she got into an Equity show the summer after freshman year, is due to additional training and skills she obtained at UM. It is not due to having TONS of training or opportunities prior to college. She obviously is talented, got into UM, got more training, and then got cast in an Equity show. She did not have to have years of professional work to get cast, just the talent. The UM training enabled her to go for the next level. </p>
<p>What a kid from the middle of nowhere should not do is bemoan that he/she did not have as many opportunities as such and such kid from a bigger area where there is more/better training and more theater opportunities or a kid with more money, etc. What someone needs to do is to make the most of what is available where they live, have drive and passion, piece together whatever training they can obtain, work hard, hopefully have supportive parents (it helps), and go for it. I am positive that kids from unknown areas where there is less can get into BFA programs. </p>
<p>My kid knows lotsa kids who do theater in other states and more metropollitan areas. They have many opportunities that we don't have here. I have never heard her bemoan that fact. Others have performing high schools (our entire state does not), some go to performing arts boarding schools (we never would send her away nor could afford to), some have thespian clubs, competitions, state Tony style awards in theater, drama classes at school, show choir, lotsa theaters in the area to audition at, etc. NONE of that is true here. So what. Ya make do with what you have and find ways to pursue it. Maybe your mentor is a teacher at school. Maybe there is a music person in the community. Maybe you just do school shows. Even our little town has a community theater. Maybe you can get your parent to drive far to a dance studio or a theater to do a show (we travel very far for both). The main thing is to hone your skills and if you have talent, you can get in. Ya need talent, skills, some experience in theater, some training, passion, motivation, very good academics, and also to research and find out what you need to know to apply to these programs. I told you that not only is my D from a rural area, but her roommate at CAP is as well and so are some other kids from our region at Emerson and Ithaca for example. </p>
<p>To imply that you have to have professional experience first is quite inaccurate. The kids I know at CMU, CCM, UM, Tisch, Emerson, Ithaca, Syracuse, BOCO do NOT have professional experience or are not Equity. </p>
<p>I recall when my D auditioned at UMich, during the ballet segment of the audition, she said that the ballet faculty person came up to just her at the barre to ask her where she had trained. My D said it was strange because she felt funny as if the person might expect her to name a place she had heard of and she had to tell her of our dance studio in Vermont where she definitely never would have heard of it! </p>
<p>As far as the NFAA ARTS awards, I had never even heard of them until I read about it on this forum, I think from TheaterMom in fact. I videotaped my D for the MT one. She ended up winning a Merit Award in MT. Upon looking at the winners' list, I saw no other winners from our entire state in any of the categories. I do not know if kids here even heard of it. Nobody here gave a care at our school about this or knew about it. I know that at some schools, they are prepping kids for it. On the winners' list, there are lots of kids from known performing arts high schools. So? There are kids from the boonies like mine too. Now that my kid is at CAP21, sure, she has met some kids who have done some neat thing or went to places like Interlochen. So? She is right up there with them. You can have talent or obtain skills even if you did not have the same opportunities as someone else. The colleges are looking for the talent and skills, NOT where you came from. Yes, it might be easier to get training or more show experiences if you lived in X, or went to Y high school, or had lotsa money, or this or that, but you still can find SOME training and SOME opportunities and still have talent and STILL get into a BFA program. </p>
<p>I am taking the time to say this because I know kids in these programs and they do not come from professional backgrounds. SOME have done way more than others and yes, some had some great opportunities growing up that we don't have here, but there are kids from the middle of nowhere who are in right among them, and holding their own. I have observed this first hand. Some examples.....my kid did not have music theory in school but she took ten years of piano lessons and she placed out of Music Theory requirements at CAP21......that is with NO AP or anything, just cause she has studied instruments a lot. Anyone can learn an instrument with a teacher in most any location. She placed into the highest level ballet, tap, and jazz classes (they have four levels of each for freshmen in CAP)....she definitely took a lot of dance growing up...and we do love our studio....but it is not a known studio. This is a very very small area here. Her roomie took at another studio in our state, in a small town. She also placed into the highest levels of dance at CAP. So, yes, they had training but it was not exactly at SAB or anything! In our little rural state, they sought out any training they could find and it was good but involved lotsa travel. There were very few show opportunities but they auditioned for them and traveled to do them, plus school shows too. My D had the opportunity to attend a summer program out of state and that is an option (though it does cost money which can be prohibitive) for kids who don't have lots where they live to do it intensively elsewhere over the summer and to be with other very talented kids from all over. </p>
<p>It doesn't matter if you are from a dirt road or Manhatten, you can really find SOME sort of training and opportunities and even if they don't match up with what other kids had, so what...make what you can from what you've got and with drive and ambition, and talent, you can still go far. If you sit back and say, "I have no chance against those kids from NY, those kids from Interlochen, etc. etc. , woe is me....", you will not stand a chance. Life is not fair in terms of opportunities but make the most of the ones you DO have and go for it. Don't compare with others. Life is not a competition. Go for YOUR goals. Seek out YOUR opportunities. I know my D has and she comes from a smaller town than likely you do. We don't even have a traffic light in our town, LOL......or a dance studio, voice teacher, or acting teacher. Ya find ways to do this. It takes lots of effort. It takes some money but you do not have to have LOTS of that to find opportunities such as community theater or teachers at school, etc. It helps to have parent support behind what you want to do. And of course, if you live in ja pip like we do, you need parents who can be taxi drivers. Don't underestimate yourself and be jealous of what others have where they are. Go for it. You can do it too.</p>
<p>Susan</p>
<p>PS, I did not see Theatermom's post above when I wrote mine as I lost mine and had to write it again but want to say that I agree with how eloquently she put it.</p>
<p>I've really been avoiding this thread since posting on Friday, as it took some very combative turns - but I want to chime back in now based on what theatermom said and add my voice to those saying to our students here who feel true passion for MT, "Yes, GO FOR IT!!!" I was NOT at all suggesting anything else in my post on Friday - and I still maintain what I said then:</p>
<p>"Sometimes lack of admissions to a selective schools is a kind of "prognosis" of one's potential performance career success - NOT always, but SOMETIMES."</p>
<p>The SOMETIMES was CAPITALIZED for a REASON. :) I have seen many people go though MT programs who probably NEVER had real hope of making a LIVING in performance -c'mon folks, let's be honest, EVERYONE can find a theatre school, but ALL of those people can't MAKE A LIVING as performers!!! However, many of them COULD make wonderful livings in other areas of theatre - and I think it is VERY MUCH my job to make my students aware of non-performance avenues of success in theatre. As Mary Anna astutely pointed out, is not up to ME to cast judgement unless I am the CASTING PERSON, which I sometimes am - but as a teacher, my job is to encourage and develop talent so that students can blossom when THEY are READY to. I feel that it is ALSO my job to discuss the "what if" situation with EVERY ONE of my college auditionees - what IF you don't get into any of your MT schools? Do you have academic backups? Will you work more and reaudition? This has always been a very helpful discussion for my students, which often reveals the depth (or lack thereof) of their commitment to studying theatre or MT, and we discuss in a completely supportive environment. And I have had several wonderful Shauna-type students who did NOT get in anywhere during their first year of auditioning but got in the NEXT year. </p>
<p>My two all-time favorite student "success stories" are of young performers who were blatantly told by other "experts" that they should "pursue something else" - and both got into VERY TOP programs, one after only doing theatre for a year, from a midewestern town where there was nothing and I MEAN NOTHING theatrical - he simply sought out opportunities in a city 3 hours away and drove his butt and his continually breaking-down car to that city twice a week for training. It CAN be done - he discovered a passion, had some VERY raw talent, and got into a major program when he was frankly not very "good" yet by most standards - but that department RECOGNIZED his talents and his intelligence and work ethic (cause they actually read his recommendations!). This turned out to be THE PLACE for him - and like SeaShells originally said, each of you auditionees WILL find YOUR place. If you have "safeties" and bigger names on your lists and still don't receive any offers of admission, then it's definitely time to critically self-evaluate, which ISN'T easy. You have to ask yourself: Was my material TRULY prepared enough? (That's a HUGE question to ask and answer HONESTLY!!!) Did I have good material? Do I love this enough to dive right back in, work even harder with my newfound perspective, and do it all again? And so on...But knowing those questions NOW can also help you to avoid the pitfalls of not preparing INCREDIBLY well and also picking appropriate material (NOT easy on your own, I know - that's why I coach!)</p>
<p>You readers of CC have a tremendous advantage that many "trained" students don't - you have a broad perspective acquired by comparing the many diverse and differing experiences and opinions you read here. You will soon find that EVERYONE has a DEFINITE opinion about EVERYTHING in theatre...oh, the DRAMA in drama, lol...and hopefully, you will step back from it all and make your OWN judgements at each school and when you are done with all of your auditions. </p>
<p>One final note, which I know I have said before (Ahhh, the memory fails and I'm too swamped to search for my relevant post!:) ) Although I would NEVER pronounce definitive judgement on a student's talents, I WILL tell them straight-up if their attitude or work ethic is lacking - that I CAN judge, since they are WORKING for me. And like theatermom reminded us - those things are REALLY key - and when I say work, I mean WORK with a capital W (and all other letters capitalized!) If you don't FEEL like you're working REALLY hard at your audition stuff, then you AIN'T :) - and you need to!!!</p>
<p>Good luck!</p>
<p>CoachC</p>
<p>Just wanted to add I also strongly agree with soozie about not bemoaning what you DON'T have - none of my students would EVER have gotten in anywhere or gotten any jobs if they approached things in that way!!! I was writing as soozie was posting, so I missed saying that...</p>
<p>P.S. Auditors care about what YOU "bring to the room" - not what you DON'T!!! REMEMBER THAT, and BELIEVE IN WHAT YOU HAVE TO OFFER!!!</p>
<p>I know a professional ballet dancer who is now on the faculty of a top MT/Drama program. He grew up on a tropical island. In order to go to a bigger ballet school and acquire better training he had to take a 2 hour bus ride to a hour-long ferry 3x a week. He did this for a while, until he was "discovered" by a scout visiting the Caribbean. He was placed on a scholarship and lived in NYC, went to school and tried to cope with the massive changes in his life. He struggled at first but then was able to work hard, pull his life together and dance in many major roles across the US, including a long stint at ABT. He also became very active in the dancers' union. He didn't speak more than 3 words of English when he arrived here!</p>
<p>Although this all sounds like the premise of a corny movie script it proves that perseverance, luck, talent and success can happen to anyone from anywhere.</p>
<p>Great story Freelance! While we are at with inspiring stories of that sort.....</p>
<p>Here is one: My daughter had a director of a musical one summer at camp. Actually he came up with musical, a revue, called Another Openin Another Show which consisted of the opening numbers from 40 different musicals. It was a fantastic show. Anyway, he not only directed the show but taught all the choreography, including the original opening number choreography to shows like 42nd Street (tap) and A Chorus Line. My D was in awe of him. He had danced on Broadway. He had won an Emmy for choreographing the Miss America Pageant. All this and much more. BUT ya see, he had NO legs. He had two prosthetic legs. He lost both legs as a little boy. They were amputated due to illness. He spent a LONG time in a hospital as a child. If he can make it on Broadway, DANCING no less, anyone can.</p>
<p>Susan</p>
<p>Ok, gotta jump in here. Hope my d isn't reading this; she'll KILL me. She is at CAP21 right now, and I've had many sleepless nights wondering if the 39K+ per year for a degree that might not lead anywhere is worth it. She entered with 8 equity points and also worked Off-Broadway for 1 year; did tons of community theater. Dancing is a MAJOR weakness for her. However, she said after attending school that her dance classes at CAP are her favorite classes - and she is a total couch potato. I am so impressed that her teachers are so encouraging; if you knew her, you'd drop dead thinking that she was actually INTO dancing. She said she is learning SO MUCH. In addition, she came home this past weekend and played me a tape of her voice lesson. This teacher is BRILLIANT and SO PROFESSIONAL. I heard her sing, and I thought it was actually a different person. He taught her to breathe (although she's had sporadic voice lessons in the past few years; from very trained professionals on Bwy, etc.) the CORRECT way, and she says it's SO much easier now to hold on to a note, and her voice sounds so much more "open". I can't explain it. All I can say is, in only 1 month, she has already had excellent training, and I think I can now throw away the Sominex (not that she's guaranteed a career, or anything, but I know now that she's getting excellent training.) So those people who say that the way the Ivies get their rep is by getting good people - well, maybe they're good, but when they graduate, they're EXCELLENT.</p>
<p>There is so much inspiring instruction. Let's give credit where credit is due.</p>
<p>I have had students (I know you are sick of hearing about "my fabulous students", but it's my only point of reference. Please forgive) who have attended Tisch in various studios. </p>
<p>They have remarked many times about how many dancers entered as freshmen who couldn't sing, and by graduaton could hold there own vocally. </p>
<p>Others could sing exceptionally upon entrance but had two left feet. By graduation, they could handle most dance combinations thrown their way.</p>
<p>Others reached new levels of depth and understanding in their acting and became capable of true greatness in 4 short years.</p>
<p>Most of these students entered with no professional experience whatsoever. </p>
<p>The college experience is about spreading your wings and discovering that creative soul that exists inside. It's a process of self discovery, lead, hopefully, by inspiring professors. No young person comes to this with all the elements in place. There is much to learn.</p>
<p>Since I don't know where else to logically put this post and since I started this thread, I thought I would post it here even though it's somewhat of a digression. </p>
<p>My thoughts are in regard to whether a student should pursue MT if he/she doesn't make it into the top colleges. There has been ample discussion here of people who were successful without going to the top colleges so I'm not going to belabor that point. </p>
<p>What I would like to say, however, is that I strongly feel that a student (in whatever area) should pursue his or her passion/dream in whatever way possible, rather than settling for a major that he or she doesn't really care about. Studies have shown that people who pursue what they are passionate about end up being more successful in the LONG RUN than those that don't.</p>
<p>After my D didn't get accepted to the top MT ivys, we seriously questioned whether she should pursue MT as a career or not. I am an academic/career counselor at a small business college and talked to colleagues, as well as her voice and drama teachers about this issue. Colleagues at work suggested having her major in a safe choice like business management or communications. My D would absolutely HATE business and might possibly like communications. Her voice and drama teachers encouraged her to pursue theater.</p>
<p>The way I see it is that she is in a very good theater program (she auditioned for the BFA on Monday and is waiting to get the results but felt it went extremely well) where she has already learned a great deal, been totally immersed in all aspects of theater, and where she has learned to take her own initiative to become better at her craft. </p>
<p>As CoachC said in his last post, there are many avenues to pursue in theater and it is true that some ambitious, talented people will not make it to Broadway. But some can be successful and happy in other theater-related areas such as teaching drama. Teaching drama is my D's "back-up" plan actually. Also, many people over the years have said that they could picture her on "Saturday Night Live." Her new college professors said it as well after seeing her in the first student run performance. So maybe musical theater isn't in the cards for her as much as she loves to sing, but there could be other possibilities in acting/theater.</p>
<p>The reason for my post is not to provide you with an update on my D's progress but to hopefully help the high school seniors out there who may be struggling with the same issues that my D and I went through regarding whether or not she should pursue a career in theater. Beware of the naysayers and go with your gut instinct and what's in your heart and don't settle for a major in which you'll be unhappy. You probably won't do well and you'll be miserable. Find a school (even if it's not your first choice) where you can follow your dream and take it from there.</p>
<p>The way I see it is that there are no guarantees with many college majors. I'm sure we all know people who are not working in the area in which they majored, for one reason or another. </p>
<p>Of course, you need to be realistic as well and, as I would always say to my D, "You need to have a back up plan." If Broadway is your absolute goal and you won't settle for anything else, then it would be more critical for you to make it into the top MT colleges. By the way, I don't know if this have been posted in the forum before, but I believe that all Broadway wannabes should read the book, "Making it on Broadway" by Wiener and Langel. If you can read that book and STILL want to pursue a Broadway career, then I would say you've definitely got the drive and passion!</p>
<p>YES!!!! GREAT book! SeaShells' wonderful post gave me an idea - is there a thread here about "Valuable MT Resources?" I have a HUGE list I have amassed through my own experiences (books, link to informative websites, etc.) and would be more than willing to share. I am in work...heck :) this evening and don't have time to search or start a new thread right now (just taking a brief break to catch up on email and, of course, CC), but if anyone else wants to do that, I will post as soon as I can (probably this weekend) - or I'll start the thread myself when the work get a little less crazy here.</p>
<p>Thanks again, SeaShells, for your wise words about pursuing your dream and finding how it best "fits" for you (if I may paraphrase), and the great book suggestion!</p>
<p>CoachC</p>
<p>Coach, great idea. I started a new thread that anyone can contribute MT resources to. When you have time and want to share yours, go ahead. Everyone else, add on anything you know of that is useful...books, websites, etc. I "stuck" the thread at the top of the forum. </p>
<p>CollegeMom</p>