<p>I've been wondering what types of hazing are present at the academy. Thinking about it in perspective, most frats/sorities typically have hazing rituals, and I'm sure USMA is no exception, but to what extent does it occur?
I found a few videos on youtube, it never seems like it is extremely hostile, but what else occurs other than shower parties?</p>
<p>Hazing in the traditional sense is not allowed (there are strict rules about what is allowed and what is not), but I'm sure some of the current cadets can share their experiences.</p>
<p>Beast cadre have some pretty strict rules against the kind of hazing you're talking about. Most of you should be able to handle someone yelling at you. And all the pushups are really for your own good. The practice will help you pass the APFT. </p>
<p>Our daughter was a squad leader last summer for Beast. We went out for R-Day and had dinner with her sponsor family. The last thing the LTC told her was that she should never think she should be mean to any of the new cadets. He suggested she earn respect by being accountable for training them properly and by leading rather than pushing. She said that's exactly what they were told in their own cadre training.</p>
<p>Will there be some bad eggs? Yup. But they're being graded, too.</p>
<p>To put it in perspective, a few years ago at uSAF academy , they had problems during Recognition (the capstone event of 4* year)with upperclassmen making freshmen go through "the tunnel of love" where they crawled beneath a long line of upperclassmen with their legs open and got physically beaten with backpacks that were loaded with heavy textbooks.</p>
<p>That's hazing. Getting yelled at, doing pushups, running everywhere you go, etc. That's tradition.</p>
<p>I'm sure USMA has many traditions that the plebes follow as well, but i'm sure it's not any sort of hazing.</p>
<p>Were do the shower parties fall in? boys will be boys?</p>
<p>Females join in whenever they want, too.</p>
<p>'Haze' here is typically used when referring any sort of harassment by the upperclass. As far as really bad embarassing/stupid fraternity stuff, my company hasn't had any. You'll get a ton of verbal abuse and maybe even dropped (it depends on who's doing the hazing), but that's about it.</p>
<p>I got hazed more during Reorgy week than I did all of Beast. You will absolutely dread going to duties and meals won't be enjoyable at all. Once academics start, the upperclassmen will pay less attention to you but not much changes. You still have to walk around the Cadet Area with your hands cupped and greet everyone.</p>
<p>Hazing at the Virginia Military Institute is by far much, much worse.</p>
<p>Shower parties here are usualy for birthdays and are all in good fun, the sergeant we did it to thought it was hilarious and punked us back the next morning.</p>
<p>yeah, the shower parties in the videos never really seemed too hostile, I was just wondering, since that was caught on tape, if there were truly hostile attacks that went on that werent shown.</p>
<p>Halloween- West Point style?</p>
<p>YouTube</a> - trick or beat</p>
<p>Some of these YouTube clips make me think that the USMA is not quite the place that I thought it was.</p>
<p>I know we need some "college fun", but in a place where the focus is on "Duty, Honor, Country", and we come there to acquire the skills to support those values, these clips seem quite inappropriate. </p>
<p>This "frat boy" kind of behavior makes me think that alternatives such as ROTC might provide a more realistic approach to a military career, without having to deal with this WP "Me and my guys, who are upperclassmen above you, will put you through some "traditional ordeals" approach. </p>
<p>I suspect that I will be flamed for taking this kind of thing too seriously, but I want to make my career decision based on the best training available, and when I see stuff like this, I'm thinking USMA, traditional notwithstanding, may not be the route to follow.</p>
<p>I am not criticizing, I'd just like to know what others think about the value of "hazing", however it is defined, and how the USMA version of it might differ from other officer commission programs.</p>
<p>It doesn't matter where or how you get commissioned because in the United States Army, all officers are equal, whether they did ROTC or whether they attended a Service Academy. The fact of the matter is... what you see at West Point, will probably not be in any way similar to what you will see in the Army. This is indeed true. I have lived on over 8 military bases worldwide, and it is far less formal and strict as it used to be. I'm sure west point is looking for people that are not only outstanding, but also people that are willing to have some fun. You can't lead troops if you are always by the book and a complete jackass that no one likes. </p>
<p>By the way, that isn't Hazing. Its far from it. It's more of a prank in IMO. You would know real hazing when you see it, and it often involves serious emotional and physical harm.</p>
<p>winnie,</p>
<p>These 2 videos are a small snapshot of life at West Point. You've seen or heard of so much of the serious side of cadet life that I can see how they would be surprising. The cadets/mids at any service academy lead a tough life with more than just the academic pressures their friends at top colleges experience. Blowing off steam is healthy and fun - especially when you think about where the cadets who graduated in 2003 are right now.</p>
<p>You're right. ROTC is a fabulous alternative to a service academy. It will lead to the same career as an Army officer. No one should be flaming you for asking a valid question. However, don't judge the entire West Point experience by a few snapshots. It's certainly not perfect, but that doesn't take away from the incredible institution that it is. It's one of the few places that displays its warts right on its website. You can read newspaper articles about serious issues that the Academy is dealing with. Learn as much as you can - positive and negative - about all of your options. And keep asking questions.</p>
<p>Good luck to you.</p>
<p>Very well said ^</p>
<p>As the mother of a plebe I am happy to see that the cadets get to have some fun and it's not study and duties 100% of the time.</p>
<p>In the last 5 weeks of school I have participated in over 85 hours of military training, ie in the feild, as a member of Infantry Tactics Club. I would like to know about any other ROTC programs that gives that kind of opertunity.</p>
<p>Thank you all so much for your reasoned replies! This is exactly what I had hoped to find in these forums: perspectives from people who know what they are talking about, which will help me develop my own views. Much appreciated.</p>
<p>I just stumbled up on these videos, which were the ones that had borderline behavior IMO. I was wondering how bad these were in the eyes of USMA, if it was grounds for expulsion, or just tradition. At the same time that I think that the activities are very unprofessional, I think it'd be kinda fun to get into a massive pillow fight. </p>
<p>Here's a few positive videos of cadets blowing off steam!
YouTube</a> - Roxbury Plebes - Happy Valentine's Day from West Point
YouTube</a> - ARMY-navy video!!
YouTube</a> - numa numa west point</p>
<p>And of course there are a slew of other positively funny videos, way more than the ones that make you question USMA's intent. I found them after watching some of the funny ones, and then I started wondering how that fit in with USMA's standards.</p>
<p>The Corps has not!!</p>