<p>D is a good student, but no super-star (3.2 GPA; 1950); her strongest/favorite subj is math, possible major art/math (architecture). She also plays 3 varsity sports (v'ball, swim and track/field) and is black.</p>
<p>We'll probably visit both schools, but I'd like to know what the CC community sees as the diff b/w Kenyon and Oberlin. From guide books and view books, I have noted the following:</p>
<ul>
<li><p>sports are popular at Kenyon; but purportedly no one plays sports at Oberlin (D is a jock and a very rah-rah fan)</p></li>
<li><p>Kenyon distrib req include language (D has lang based LD and limped through 2 yrs of hs Spanish w/ a tutor; successful completion of college course seems unlilely, but she might qualify for exemption as accommodation)</p></li>
<li><p>Oberlin has larger % black students than Kenyon</p></li>
</ul>
<p>if D is realy "rah-rah" i wouldnt recommend either school.. look instead at smaller division one schools, theyre the only place where youll get a rah-rah feel. (for example, Gonzaga). </p>
<p>Kenyon is much more moderate/traditional in everything.. i visited oberlin and hippies were crawling out of the woodwork. I havent been to kenyon, but i can only imagine that its not any worse. I have nothing against people who dye their hair green and listen to emo-screamo punk music.. i just dont want to be surrounded by them. If your daughter doesnt, kenyon would be a better fit. </p>
<p>Oberlin's best academic programs are life sciences (neurology and biology are the big ones)... if she wants to major in one of those, or is pre-med, oberlin would probably be a better place academically. </p>
<p>Oberlin has a music conservatory that is world-class.. when i visited there, music permeated every single corner of the campus. This seems like it would be really awesome.... but then again, i can see how a 20 year old might tire of it by the 30th time he hears a rendition of something Stravinksi. </p>
<p>Oberlin had really good food in the dining halls (compared to what you'd expect), make sure you eat there when you visit, and eat at kenyon, to compare.</p>
<p>Oberlin has a very strong and well-known Athletic Director whose aim is to beef up the school's athletic program. There is a rumor that he might be returning to Oregon, but as of now it is just a rumor. Your D could be strongly recruited for track if he remains (yes, I know it is DIII but they are trying to attract some athletes).</p>
<p>On paper, scholastically the two schools have strengths in a lot of the same areas. I don't know if Oberlin's "best" programs are life sciences. My daughter selected it to study completely different subject areas. It is most known for music, and, I would say, producing future academics. The student body is probably more overtly politically active than Kenyon's.</p>
<p>Oberlin is planning to place more emphasis going forward on athletics, a move that is frankly very controversial among the current "dodge ball target" student body. Even now though they have many great options for PE classes for the student body. I wish I could take some of them.</p>
<p>There are relatively few Republicans at Oberlin, I believe.</p>
<p>yes, tehre are few republicans.. when i was there, i picked up a copy of the school paper.. a front page story was about how a group of students founded a college republicans club.. they hadnt had a college republicans club since the late 80s.. and as i read further, i found out that the college republicans was actually founded by a bunch of moderate dems who were sick of the liberals arguing with nobody. </p>
<p>Ive lived in San Francisco all my life... i always thought those caricatures of liberals you hear from oreilly and hannity and limbaugh were innacurate.. i dont know anyone who owns a pair of birkenstock... Oberlin shocked me with how well it fit the caricature/stereotype. </p>
<p>yeah, they told me about their new AD. He was the head coach of Stanford's incredibly succesful track and field program (they dominate the pac-10).. for some reason he agreed to leave to take up the post of A.D. in Oberlin, OH. </p>
<p>I dont think this is an attempt so much to change the attitude of the school.. the professors and president and such will never let that happen.. tehy just want to have good athletics as well.</p>
<p>Oberlin is a great place, both me and one of my best friends got in, and he's going. When we visited I loved the atmosphere of the school in the sense that everybody is really friendly and open, and really progressive and NOT close minded. All of the there departments are great and they have an excellent rate for getting people into grad school and producing PhDs. Socially its really diverse, in close proximity to Cleveland, the Affinity houses are great, and food is cool yeah the town is small, but not as small as some I've seen in my life.</p>
<p>As a URM your D is an excellent candidate at most private LACs. If she wants to be on the best swim team in D3, she should check out Kenyon. Check the times on the website though. . .they are borderline D1.</p>
<p>Without knowing more about your D neither school strikes me as an optimal choice however, though I think an athlete might find Kenyon more of a match. I'd take a look at Bates and Wesleyan.</p>
<p>If you and your D visit next fall and want to talk to another Kenyon student send me an e-mail. My nephew will be a second-year student there.</p>
<p>I'll be a junior at Kenyon. I can't really compare Oberlin to Kenyon that well, as I've only been there a few quick times, but I'll try.</p>
<p>Kenyon is more traditional than Oberlin- definitely has more of a mix of people. Hippies, preppies, jocks, etc. It is predominantly liberal, and those few conservative students are made to feel kind of uncomfortable. </p>
<p>The studio art program is well known as an excellent undergrad program. The math department at Kenyon is pretty small, but those I know in it seem happy with it.</p>
<p>As for athletics, Kenyon definitely has the upper hand, especially in swimming. Kenyon isn't really a school spirit, rah rah type of place, but it is far more than Oberlin.</p>
<p>I visit Oberlin a few times a year (I dance at Kenyon, and we do joint workshops sometimes), and for the most part I like it. The town of Oberlin is small, but not nearly as small as Gambier. The one complaint I have about Oberlin is the pressure to be their liberal-hippie stereotype. I've felt like a lot of the students try so hard to fit the mold, while at Kenyon any level of liberalness would be welcomed.</p>
<p>Please let me know if you have any questions, etc-- I'd be glad to help.</p>
<p>It was the intellectual atmosphere at Oberlin that attracted my daughter to attend. She got sold during an overnight visit, through late-night discussion sessions with the students in the dorms. She felt that these were the type of people she wanted to hang out with.</p>
<p>It has a particular feel. I would guess that you don't have to do much to fit the mold if you ARE already in the mold. And I'm sure there's a range of people who would thrive there, not just one type. But certainly there are others who wouldn't.</p>
<p>It's unlikely D will swim in college. Track is her best sport (D-I or borderline high jumper and sprinter, slightly weaker in shot put) and most colleges offer both both indoor and outdoor track seasons.</p>
<p>D liberal, but not rabidly so. And more preppie jock than hippie (current BF w/ shoulder length hair, notwithstanding) - - but far more sheltered than her appearance suggests (learned syn for marijuana in health class). </p>
<p>She's not intimdated by the presence of smart kids (BF is scary smart), so long as there's more to do on campus than play Scrabble in Greek (one friend's descript of Swarthmore). But, she would not find a steady diet of green hair and bang-your-head-against-the-wall music at all appealing (almost refused to tour a sch where guide was very nice White boy - - w/ dreads).</p>
<p>From the posts, it sounds like Kenyon will be a better fit socially than Oberlin. Still, Kenyon can't match Oberlin's proximity to Cleveland (a girl has to get her hair done) or number of black students. I guess we'll visit both. </p>
<p>Redim, you're right, neither is a perfect match, but we were looking beyond the usual NE suspects to get a little geog "bounce." We've considered Wesleyan and Bates (even w/ low % of black students, what jumper wouldn't want to attend Dick Fosbury's alma mater), but both are are "reach" schs and lousy w/ strong(er) NY area applicants.</p>
<p>
[quote]
long as there's more to do on campus than play Scrabble in Greek (one friend's descript of Swarthmore).
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Well, daughter did take a few board games to Swarthmore, and I believe they have had one heated all-night monopoly marathon, but no Scrabble in Greek! Quite a bit of Texas Hold 'Em Poker.</p>
<p>I've sometimes pondered how I would help my child pick an "elite" college if I were Af-Am. I think I would probably try to put together a list of pertinent questions: percentage Af-Am faculty, history of Af-Am enrollment (to weed out some Johnny-come-lately diversity schools), policy and reality of theme housing, overall campus climate towards minorities, etc. Then, I would have child take advantage of opportunities to discuss these issues with current Af-Am students and faculty at each school.</p>
<p>I also recently posted some information on African American student resources on my website. Can't post the direct link because I don't want to upset the CC moderators but click on my name to the left and then "see carolyn's personal page" for a link. I have lots of other useful links and information about searching for and evaluating various colleges there as well.</p>
<p>Oberlin's Allen Art Museum is one of the top few college art museums in the nation. It has a very unique lending program which allows students to literally borrow an original Picasso for a semester. </p>
<p>While the athletics are most definitely not regarded as a priority, the facilities are very good for a DIII school--Oberlin has a very impressive athletic complex.</p>
<p>To the best of my knowledge, Oberlin is quite a bit more well-known than Kenyon. An earlier poster mentioned Gonzaga, I'm from Montana, and Gonzaga's a very well-respected school in the region, very athletic also.</p>
<p>Some kids do well in any environment. My D is that type. She was accepted at both Oberlin and Smith, but went to a small Catholic college that offered her a generous merit award and a paved path to med school. BIg difference in campus atmosphere. She has had some regrets as the school is outright deficient in the arts, where she has interest and ability. She has had some regrets about that. My niece, who turned down Cornell for a small, unknown school that gave her basically a full ride blossomed ever so much in that environment. She shared with us recently that her therapist felt very strongly that the good match she made in a college was a key factor in the way she bloomed. They say "Bloom where you are planted" but some kids are a bit more finicky about the soil.</p>