My dd14 has been accepted to several programs. She is deciding between USC and Cal State Dominguez Hills. How important is prestige of the institution when it comes to finding a job? She likes both programs, and she will end up with the same degree and PPS credential. Cost wise, Dominguez Hills is a steal, while USC is quite expensive. Any advice?
She won’t earn much so keep cost as low as possible.
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You are aware that DH is, largely, a commuter school? Is that important?
The cost is so different. I agree that you need to keep your costs down because your daughter will, more than likely, work at a school where the salary is based on a teacher salary plus going up on the scale with units.
If she has a teaching credential, to go along with that Counseling degree, she would be more marketable.
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Salaries for school counselor start higher than for teachers, but it’s not a get rich career, for sure!
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Yes, she is aware. She already had the undergrad residential experience, so that is not important to her. She is planning to share an apartment with an old college friend who is working in that area.
@aunt_bea This! As long as she can pass her comps or any licensing exam, she won’t have an issue finding a job. Don’t pay for the brand name school for a major like counseling where she won’t reap any tangible rewards. Counseling is a great job, but it isn’t super competitive and doesn’t pay that well.
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I think for her, what draws her to USC is the faculty and program quality and, alumni network. Her thinking is that with USC’s strong alumni network, she will never be out of a job. The cons is ROI, and having un subsidized loans. If money is no object, USC wins.
With Dominguez Hills, the pros are ROI, only taking subsidized loans. The cons are regrets of turning USC down, and forgoing that experience.
She is weighing everything, including loan forgiveness programs which would apply after 10 years working in the educational sector.
The loan forgiveness program for educators has been a disaster. I know lots of educators who have made their payments, put in their 10 years only to find out that their loans were not eligible (this can be a whole thread in it self).
Counselors have a higher starting salary than teachers. You must have a masters degree in order to get licensed. Teachers, usually have 5 years to get 3 years experience and a masters to get professional certification.
@aunt_bea Unless you are already teaching and getting a Masters in school counseling as a second credential having a teaching credential with your counseling degree will not make you more marketable. It will give you the option of if you are looking for a teaching position or a school counselor position. Get the counseling degree and if you have to get extra credits to get the salary boost (which you most likely will- get it in leadership, supervision or building administration- with the goal of becoming an administrator (perhaps AP of Counseling) in 7-10 years). In addition if you already have tenure in your license area as a teacher, you start the process all over again when you become a counselor (you are untenured in this license area and have the lowest seniority).
@catmom1-Counseling is a great job, but it isn’t super competitive and doesn’t pay that well.
In many parts of the country there is a shortage of counselors, in NYC it is a very competitive because there has been a freeze for almost over a decade (first year counselors straight out of school in NYC start with $63,905, students who complete 60 credit masters start with 71,374 - probably pretty comparable salary in Ca). Sorry, no school is going to hire a counselor at the expense of a teacher. In times of a budget cuts, extra counselors will always be excessed before teachers.
Look at the course offerings at each school (you want cross-cultural and culturally relevant counseling, restorative justice, trauma informed counseling, data)
The most important thing will be a rich internship experience.
She should work her internship like a job (you are short changing yourself, if you are only going to do the minimum number of hours to meet your licensing requirement). Take it as a 10 month job interview because if there is going to be any movement at your school, you want to be the person that someone has to knock out of the box to get the job. for the DOE to be large organizations, they are incestuously small. It is very important to know how to start and end the school year.
Make sure that her cooperating counselor gives her mandated counseling students to work with (that is the real basis for getting and keeping a job).
Don’t forget the real purpose for having school counselors is to provide related services counseling as part of the IEP. How the student’s social emotional is effecting the academics. Learn how to read an IEP like the back of your hand.
If she thinks that all she will do is sit in her office and chop it up with kids asking “and how does that make you feel” pick another profession. She is going to become very quickly jaded with the amount of paperwork and accountability that comes with the job.
The big takeaway for next few years is going to be the ability to do SEL, and develop school wide programs supporting SEL along with creating and executing a comprehensive counseling plan that aligns with ASCA.
No, they do not teach college counseling advising in your grad program. You learn it at your internship (if at a high school placement and you can be with the people who are doing it or on the job).
I think that students are always looking for the “best internships at the good schools.” You will probably have to wait for some one to retire or die before you can get a job there.
You don’t know where you will be placed, if you are going to be part of a 10 person team or the only counselor in the building and sometimes have to go where the job is.
The richest experiences come from the most challenging environments (Title I schools, working with children who are overaged/under credited, chronic attendance issues, food insecurity, IEPs, doing BIPs/FBAs, learning how to do data driven counseling, assessments, case conferencing and placements). If you are learning how to deal with the challenging things in your internship where you are getting the help advice, the rest of it will be a cake walk.
Hope this helps
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This is why I said the “marketable” statement. We’ve had budget cuts happen often in our middle and high schools in our district. (California has a very low budget for education.). Those counselors and APs that could return to the classroom, had jobs; those that didn’t, were let go. (The pay scales were based on units beyond the B.S./B.A., and a large percentage of teachers already had their M.A./M.S. degrees.)
As for the counselors needing to know IEP’s, I couldn’t agree more! Sometimes our counselors were the primary “leads” during IEPs, with contentious parents and their attorneys. It was thought that the counselors could bring down the tone.
My sister attended USC, and the alumni network was there, but they didn’t help her to get her job in the educational settings. She interned in LA County but returned to SD County. All of the local schools were desperate for bilingual OTs, so she had her pick. She does see alumni at the games.
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Out side of a citywide job action, if your school does not have money to pay for you, you are excessed. You still work for the department of Ed, but you are not assigned to the school.
There is no loss of pay or seniority. You are placed in another school first by district, then by borough.
If there is a city wide job action (layoff, it is seniority by license area). If you are a GC with low seniority, then you are laid off; your don’t get to jump back into your teaching license where you may have more seniority.
Wow! @sybbie719!
@InfoQuestMom, so, is the family willing to pay those excessive fees to go to USC?
My sister was on scholarships, so it wasn’t too much of an issue.
I totally agree with you that it is not worth USC money for school counseling unless money is no object… I
know that I went to NYU for both school counseling and Ed pysch (but I was still working in corporate -they paid). Building admin license from CUNY
Wow! Thank you so much for this thorough and incredibly insightful response. I forwarded your input to my daughter. She had already made up her mind and emailed her acceptance to DH yesterday, and your post definitely helped her confirm her decision was the right one.
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No, the family paying for grad was never on the cards. We have a dd22 and DH is 63. We made it very clear early on that we will pay in state for undergrad but anything above they need to figure out how.
Thank you so much for your input. Your personal experience with your sister is also very helpful. We are also in San Diego and my dd is bilingual.
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In case you know any one who is a bilingual candidate for
Speech and Language (Monolingual and bilingual)
School Psychology (*Edited to remove counseling)
Blind and Visually Impaired
Bilingual Special Ed
The NYC DOE will pay for your masters (in exchange for 4 years of service after you graduate) through the Jose P Scholarship Program
Info here
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Wow! I wish I had known about these kinds of programs 40 years ago!!!
I think I was the only bilingual candidate in my Speech/Language/Hearing program back in the Stone Age! Lots of loans to pay back, but fortunately, I’ve had job security and I met an engineering guy (husband) that helped me pay those loans back quickly!
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I thought about you when i posted, because you have experienced sending one of your kids across country 
Yes! Not fun for when the eldest wanted to experience snow (more like play in it)!
I became very familiar with Southwest direct from San Diego to Buffalo!
Now, the middle one has completed UCSF- she may be out in PA for her residency!
Bi-coastal kids! Thankfully, the hubby has miles!
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@InfoQuestMom I’m sure your kid will have a great experience! Best wishes!
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