Music at Ivy Leagues

College Majors Music Major
1

<p>Hi guys,</p>

<p>I'm a violinist, but I'm primarily interested in either composition or musicology/music history so my college list includes most of the ivies, as well as Stanford, Chicago, Swarthmore and a few others. However--though I know they generally excel in almost all academic areas--I haven't been able to get a sense of specifics about their music programs. I know Yale is known for music, but it that mostly in the graduate school? I'm also particularly curious about Penn and Columbia; are music students overshadowed by their close proximity to conservatories, or is that just an extra resource? I may attempt to pursue a double major as well (undecided as to what field), so which schools would facilitate that the most?</p>

<p>Thanks for any advice!</p>

2

<p>Intelligent questions :slight_smile: Yes, Yale has a graduate School of Music. I think you are right to think about pluses and minuses of the presence of conservatories and other resources: others may chime in on that here.</p>

<p>You can continue in music in several ways, as I am sure you are aware. You can major in music for a BA or BM, do a double major, or a double degree, either BA/BM or BA/MM. Here is a site that is often posted on the different choices:
<a href=“http://www.peabody.jhu.edu/conservatory/admissions/tips/doubledegree.html”>http://www.peabody.jhu.edu/conservatory/admissions/tips/doubledegree.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Double degree programs often mentioned here include Yale’s, Harvard/NEC (BA/MM), Tufts/NEC (BA/BM), Bard (conservatory students are required to do a double degree), Oberlin (composition dept. includes TIMARA), Lawrence, UMichigan, Peabody/JHU and many others. I know that some students at Columbia benefit from the proximity of Manhattan School of Music but the Columbia double degree program is with Juilliard some distance away (not mentioned that often here on CC). </p>

<p>Do you have other academic areas of interest?</p>

<p>Some other things to consider: make sure you check out the compositional aesthetic, though that is less important at the undergrad level (Oberlin, for example, tends toward European avant-garde, for lack of a better way to generalize). Listen to professors’ works, student works if possible, and look at courses. Also check distribution requirements and the number of courses in music. For instance, my daughter was most interested in Harvard, where music classes formed 50% of her classes, and distribution requirements were fewer than at, say, Yale or Tufts. Also think about how you like to study: Yale has a composition seminar early on, Harvard has tutorials. Do you want weekly lessons or do you work independently? Also think about opportunities to get pieces played, though that is not always the obvious concert or two provided by the school. Extracurricular groups may commission fellow student composers and some students end up creating their own opportunities by getting funding from the school to create concerts. Harvard allows a thesis in the form of a composition, which is a plus- check out the other schools because I don’t know about the other Ivies in this regard.</p>

<p>Do you want to continue studying the violin? You can also check on the availability of lessons, either on campus or privately off campus. Double degrees that include a conservatory will sometimes provide both violin and composition/theory, but that is another thing to look into. And how good are the ensembles you would be able to play in? If you are on a campus with a conservatory or school of music, undergrad or grad, how does that affect your opportunities to play or get played?</p>

<p>Initial thoughts, a little randomly. Welcome here and come back with more questions!</p>

3

<p>I can speak for Yale. My S graduated with a double major–computer science and music. Music is a big part of the undergraduate culture of Yale. The Yale Symphony Orchestra is excellent–conservatory quality players. There is an abundance of opportunities for chamber music. The music degree is more theory/history oriented (not performance). I believe Hunt who posts here can address the composition aspects as S is a composer and graduated from Yale (is now at Juilliard for grad)–try PMing. The Department of Music (undergraduate) is separate from the School of Music (graduate). Please feel free to ask me any questions you might have about Yale.</p>

4

<p>You might consider Vanderbilt, too.</p>

5

<p>Ask @Glassharmonica about Penn. She would know about the music department there. Columbia’s composition department is focused mainly on its doctoral students, and there is a definite aesthetic specific to the department which may or may not suit you. However, undergrad students do form their own ensembles and find opportunities to perform and compose. Cornell has a strong composition department - again, mostly grad student focused, as does Princeton. Princeton has opportunities for performance and lessons for undergrads.</p>

<p>Swarthmore is a good one for your consideration, as are Williams, Wesleyan, & Vassar . Stanford is not strong in performance, but students can commute to San Francisco to play in the San Francisco Symphony Youth Orchestra, if they are a top player. And, yes, Bard has a fantastic music department - in the college, in addition to the option of a double degree in the conservatory (if you are an elite level violinist or composer.) </p>

6

<p>Thanks everyone!</p>

<p>I forgot to mention in the original post that I’m a HS senior, so at this point it’s a bit too late for me to be adding any schools. I’d given some thought to dual-degree programs with conservatories but I decided against applying. Though it is my main passion, I’m not 100% committed to music, so I’m looking for a place where I can explore many academic interests while still continuing to compose and perform, and see where that takes me. I think the deadlines for most conservatories have passed by now anyway. I applied to Princeton EA because I liked their undergraduate focus, but as I learn more about each school I get more confused about what would be the best fit. I suppose at this point I should just see where I get in and decide from there. I’ll definitely be back with more questions!</p>

7

<p>Princeton is a great choice! Good luck and hope you hear good news soon.</p>

8

<p>It’s good to be seeking information now, but seeing where you get in and deciding from there is wise. My son ended up at Columbia, but took the whole month of April to make the decision after he got his admissions.</p>

<p>I can speak a bit to music at Columbia, with the caveat that I know more about the jazz side as that’s my son’s interest. The school is very supportive of music and provides college credit for music lessons and performance. (I believe Princeton does this too, while I think that, at Harvard, music lessons and performance are extracurricular only - if I’m wrong about that hopefully someone can correct me.) My son has also found the music resources outside Columbia to be a major benefit - he has friends at Manhattan School of Music (which is a couple of blocks away), Juilliard (which is easily accessible - about 10-15 minutes on the subway), New School and NYU Steinhardt, and he plays with them fairly regularly. Columbia has a joint program with Juilliard, which attracts some incredibly talented musicians, and the New York Youth Symphony Orchestra is one of the best youth orchestras in the country. In addition to the music program at Columbia, the music resources in NYC outside Columbia are a major reason my son ended up choosing it.</p>

9

<p>Just to clarify on Harvard: not unusual to think their performance is entirely extracurricular, but
Harvard’s music department does have performance classes. Of course there is a lot going on with extracurriculars too.</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.fas.harvard.edu/~musicdpt/performance.html”>http://www.fas.harvard.edu/~musicdpt/performance.html&lt;/a&gt;
“Performance Courses The performance of music is at the heart of the Department’s mission, practice, coursework, and community. Harvard’s Music Department offers a full program of composition coursework as well as a number of performance courses, which usually culminate in a student recital. Performance courses receive Harvard College credit; most are eligible for concentration credit. Please check the course catalog for exact listings as some courses are not offered each year.”</p>

<p>Harvard also offers master classes. As for lessons, students arrange for their own teacher on or off campus, but can get credit for this work through independent study.</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.fas.harvard.edu/~musicdpt/performance.html#master”>http://www.fas.harvard.edu/~musicdpt/performance.html#master&lt;/a&gt; (scroll down).</p>

10

<p>@compmom, thanks for the clarification and sorry for my misinformation.</p>

11

OP please keep us updated and ask questions. As to performing opportunities at Ivy’s, sometimes there are amazing things happening where you may not expect it.

S1 plays with the Cornell symphony orchestra as a graduate student (not music - he was a double major music and science as an undergraduate) and we have attended several concerts. I was so impressed! This is an excellent orchestra comprised of 92+ students - only 2 are declared Cornell music majors and only 5 are from Ithaca College to fill in the percussion and low brass sections. The remaining 80 plus musicians are all non music majors and are excellent players! They performed the full Mahler’s Fifth Symphony - in December and are traveling to Dublin next week to perform it again. It is a monumental piece and they did it well! The conductor spoke to the audience at one of the concerts and said his faith in the future of classical music is strong because the majority of the Cornell orchestra are non music and STEM majors who, as great musicians, will go on and continue to play and educate the world about classical music.

We heard the Harvard jazz ensemble several years ago - excellent. We also heard the Yale concert band - yes and they were excellent also!

So please plan to visit and sit in on a concert or rehearsal when you get your acceptances. You will know immediately where you will be happiest.

One final thought - Cornell has an orchestra concert that features works of student composers and Vassar has a group that performs student compositions regularly. So also check that out specifically for the schools you are considering.

12

As noted above, my son was a music major at Yale, as a composer. He liked it very much. There were many opportunities to have his music played, and he liked his teachers (in the music department–the music school is quite separate). There are many fine performers at Yale, but there is no performance major. There are some lessons for credit. Some of the performing ensembles are very good, but they are essentially extracurriculars.