<p>My friend and I both go to a top %5 public school in Southeast Michigan. She is a senior and I am a junior. Last December, she got her EA acceptance decision, much to shock and joy. If you're wondering how, I think I have an answer, though I'd like your thoughts about this. She and I are both Chaldean refugees (the Christian ethno-religious minority in Iraq) who came here to Michigan about three years ago to flee violence after reeiving death threats, started as ESL students with all regular classes and moved into honors and AP's as early as sophomore year (me) or junior year (her). As I stated, she got 22 on her ACT first try and 21 on the second, so it's pretty much it's her level. However, her unweighted GPA was 4.0 (took 2 AP's by time of app) and she was a member of NHS, her only formal EC. I think the essays she wrote is what got her in. She basically wrote about experience as refugee and background, including ability to speak three languages and so. Is her case very unusual for applicants like her or is she herself was a unique applicant they couldn't resist rejecting? I realize that many Chaldeans and other refugees live in Michigan, but most of the high school generation ones were born here and so are considered Americans. And even few of those apply to Umich. I got 30 on my ACT and have 4.00 unweighted GPA (after taking 3 AP's and 5 honors classes so far but will show 9 AP's on transcript). The rest of my profile is practically the same or a little better. Will I likely get accepted? What about other good universities like Berkeley, Duke and JHU? Chaldeans are wayyyy more unheard of in the latter two. Thank you all.</p>
<p>It happens a lot. Some truly accomplished and gifted students cannot do well on the SAT or ACT. My sister had under 500 in each section of her SAT and she was accepted at Georgetown. She graduated from Georgetown with a perfect 4.0 GPA. Universities known that not everybody does well on those standardized tests, and Michigan is one of the few elite universities that actually deemphasize them. I am sure your friend will do very well at Michigan. That is why they accepted her.</p>
<p>That being said, regardless of her ACT results, your friend was lucky to have been accepted because Michigan has become very difficult to get into. Each year is substantially harder than the year before.</p>
<p>In your case, you obviously have a shot, but you will have to articulate your interest in Michigan effectively in your two supplement essays, as you seem to think your friend has. Perhaps she can let you read her essay.</p>
<p>As an IS student, your chances of getting into Michigan are going to be better than they are of getting into Cal or Duke or JHU. That being said, why apply to those schools? They are not better than Michigan (they are actually inferior when it comes to quality of life on and off campus), and they will likely be more expensive. Of course, if you really like the serious vibe at JHU, then applying there, as well as Chicago, Columbia, CMU and Rochester makes sense. If you like the hippy feel at Cal, and/or are thinking or moving out West to work in Silicon Valley, then applying there makes sense. Duke really has nothing to offer than Michigan doesn’t.</p>
<p>The reaches that are really worth applying to for a resident of Michigan, given how strong your own flagship is, are Harvard, MIT, Princeton, Stanford and Yale. Any of those universities is worth choosing over Michigan, assuming cost and fit are addressed.</p>
<p>Michigan is run by hippies. I am not surprised. Let’s all write about some sob story and we’ll all get in. YAY AFFIRMATIVE ACTION.</p>
<p>You’ll probably get in. You might even get some scholarship despite being average. That’s how the world works though. It’s unfair.</p>
<p>It can happen, though with Michigan, I am surprised. My son does not have anything special in his background, got a 22 on his ACT, and got into schools where he was on the crest of being in the lowest quarter test score wise. He did not apply to Michigan, and I would have thought it would have been highly unlikely that he would get accepted there, as I also believed did for a number of schools on his list.</p>
<p>I was told some years ago, that as large as Michigan is, and as many apps that they get, they do take more time and trouble evaluating their apps beyond the numbers than a lot of schools of that size with that application volume. A counselor at a small private school told me this, in discussing how kids from this school are often disadvantaged in admissions to large state schools since the grades are not weighted and the curve is steep. And that is so, at some schools that will do an auto cut based on raw numbers, but Michigan was mentioned as an exception. </p>
<p>In my opinion, you have good shot at Michigan. Yes, your chances at a number of those privates mentioned would not be as good as it would be for in state MI. But if your family can afford them, and you prefer them, give them a go. Any of the universities mentioned are worth choosing Michigan if you like them better and the cost is doable.</p>
<p>4.0 UW + good hook + instate + strong essays = high chance of acceptance
Not particularly surprising.</p>
<p>If you are a Chaldean and go to a top 5% school in SE Michigan, I assume that you go to school in Oakland County - most likely West Bloomfield, Bloomfield Hills, Walled Lake, Birmingham or Troy. There are so many students in these schools that go to Michigan the admissions office knows the schools so well and base admissions more off the transcript than the test scores. Admission with the 22 ACT is still a bit of a surprise even so but admission with a 24 or 25 is not an unusual occurrence even for those who don’t have the hook of affirmative action for ethnic minorities or low income people (I don’t know if bearcats has a problem with affirmative action for rich people and children of the political and corporate elite). If you keep doing what you’re doing, your chances of admission to U-M are pretty good. And as Alexandre states, students admitted with the low scores often perform as well as those with high scores.</p>
<p>How can a student that has a 4.0 at a top 5% HS in Michigan get a 22 on their ACT? </p>
<p>Or are our HS posters on here just pulling HS rankings out their you-know-what like usual?</p>
<p>Congrats to her. Sounds like you have a pretty good shot to. Michigan pimps diversity every chance it gets. Just write a really good essay and you’re golden.</p>
<p>^ Thank you! She is very smart and motivated (gets 5’s and 4’s on her AP’s). It’s just that standardized tests and timing aren’t for her. Thanks for everyone else who posted. I sincerely appreciate every response. Good luck to everyone applying next year, including me xD!</p>
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<p>It happens more frequently than you can imagine. Would you expect a 4.0 student to adverstise a low ACT on a billboard? And it happens for reasons other than affirmative action and pimping diversity. I’d be curious to know how ThisIs would have done on his ACT if it were given to him in Aramaic and how he would feel if someone told him he were admitted because they couldn’t find enough white guys.</p>
<p>She actually bashed them in her essay for putting too much emphasis on standardized tests! Can you believe this guys? xD I guessed they liked her taking this kind of risk.</p>
<p>Actually, Michigan is one of the best universities that does not place too much weight on test scores. Stanford, Cornell and Brown also do not care too much about test scores.</p>
<p>Lolifofo, as a Catholic whose husband is of Middle-Eastern descent, I have a special spot in my heart for Chaldean refugees. Welcome to the U.S. and to the state of Michigan. <3</p>
<p>I think your chances of getting into UofM are excellent but I would give the same advice to you as to any student: Apply at a few reaches, a few good fits and at least one safety. Pay close attention to total costs for all of those schools. Keep working hard but be sure to have some fun, too.</p>
<p>I’m delighted for your friend and I look forward to being delighted for you, too, when the time comes!</p>
<p>Thank you very much, VillageMom. I appreciate your lovely response, and I am definitely following that plan. I hope everything turns out fine. :)</p>
<p>It"ll be difficult to get into Berkeley OOS, JHU, or Duke with a 30 on the ACT no matter how good the rest of your academic profile is. Why would they take you when they can take a student with much stronger test scores who grew up in equally unfortunate circumstances? Michigan is less selective as they have a larger freshman class to fill and a weaker applicant pool so you stand a good chance of admission to U of M.</p>
<p>Rochester would most likely be a safety and is a decent option if you want a change of pace from the state of Michigan and want to go to school OOS.</p>
<p>Your sister was very fortunate to get admitted with an ACT score of 22.</p>
<p>well it just shows how simple statistics work.</p>
<p>When you have a larger student body, you 're just more likely to see students at the extreme ends of the mean. Let’s say a school has an ACT range of 29-33 like Michigan does now. If you have an entering class of just 500 students, you probably won’t find too many students with a score of 22. But if you have an entering class of 5000, the chances of a seeing student with a 22 ACT would be more probable. </p>
<p>I dunno about Berkeley, but I’ll agree with JHU and Duke. Since Berkeley’s range is quite low 27-32 compared to the others.</p>
<p>@goldenboy8784 She’s not my sister :D</p>
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<p>Just for the record, JHU’s middle 50% ACT scores are 30-34, just a smidge higher than Michigan’s 29-33. That said, JHU’s acceptance rate is below 20%, so anyone’s odds of admission are pretty low. It’s not necessarily that they’re admitting “stronger” students, it’s just that they have fewer places to fill–freshman class is less than 1/5 the size of Michigan’s, so although they only get about half as many applicants as Michigan, they’re still going to reject the vast majority of them, regardless of qualifications. If it’s any comfort to you, they will accept and enroll a non-trivial number of applicants with ACT scores of 30 or lower, who make up 1/4 of the entering class. It just may not be you. But they’ll reject a lot of applicants with ACT scores of 34, too.</p>
<p>Goldenboy’s error is to assume colleges are as fixated on test scores as he is.</p>
<p>Personally, I do not think IS student should bother applying to Duke (or Northwestern). It really has nothing to offer that Michigan does not offer. Michigan matches Duke in terms of academic excellence, unique specialized programs, individualized attention, resources available to students, research opportunities, campus life, college town atmosphere and athletics. The only difference is cost of attendance. Unless one comes from a lower income family, Michigan will likely cost much less for an In-State student. Top-ranked Michigan residents should definitely apply to reaches, but they should either be very different from Michigan in the experience they offer (Chicago, Columbia, Dartmouth and Johns Hopkins fit the bill), or be better academically (only HYPSM fall in this category). Wasting an entire application (effort for writing the supplemental essay, sending SAT and SAT II scores etc…) for a school that is essentially an identical peer is not worth it.</p>
<p>Alexandre, usually I agree with you, but I don’t think anyone should feel discouraged from applying to Duke or Northwestern. Every university provides an experience which cannot be replicated. Michigan may not be for everyone.</p>
<p>If one has the financial means, they should go for it. Plus, financial aid differs from place to place. I’ve known people who have chosen places like ND or USC because FA allowed them a similar COA to Michigan.</p>
<p>A college application takes like what? A couple weeks of time? That’s not so much considering one goes to college for 4 YEARS.</p>
<p>A couple weeks?</p>
<p>Jesus…</p>