Over Parenting - How does this article sit with you?

<p>I guess I come from more of a “whatever makes you happy” family. I have always supported my kids in whatever they wanted to do, but it was always their idea. My one idea for my son ("Hey, T ball will be fun!) was an absolute disaster. If they had chosen a career path that didn’t include college, I would have supported it. My niece is a horse wrangler - working in Montana in the summers and Arizona in the winters. She loves her work, supports herself and didn’t need a college education. </p>

<p>I understand that in some communities, a college degree is a necessity (preferably from a “prestigious” uni or LAC). And I understand that some people and children start the college pursuit in elementary or middle school. But that is not my experience. And, IMO, that type of life is fine, as long as it doesn’t stress out the kid or parent. Life is too short to be stressed about stuff like that. </p>

<p>They can always take another path - after college. </p>

<p>Eh. It depends. Depending on the college, you could just be tossing away your cash. So few college graduates are graduating into any kind of job they really want anymore, some of them might be better off just going to work or trade school. If a kid’s heart isn’t into the college thing, and the family can’t afford the college, and there will be borrowing involved, particularly borrowing on the part of a reluctant student, I’m not sure I agree that college is the best option.</p>

<p>On the other hand, if the parents can pick up the tab, there’s a lot more room to state what is or is not an “option.”</p>

<p>I see of lot of parents who are involved and caring, but really underestimate everything about college and wait too long to plan for it. For example, they think elementary school and middle school performance doesn’t matter, yet how their child does in the early years determines his high school placement. And the student is not likely to get admitted to a top school if he can’t even gain entry to the AP’s offered in his high school because in 7th and 8th grade the message he heard from Mom and Dad is “it’s just middle school.” A mother just told me today she and her husband have been looking at some colleges for their junior. Not too late on that, but they really had no idea what college costs, and are completely shocked to learn how much money they will actually need. It’s going to be difficult to start saving enough now. They also think that because their D has “good grades,” colleges will throw money at her. Good luck with that.</p>

<p>There are a lot of extremely naive people out there, when it comes to college admissions and paying for it. No doubt.</p>

<p>And the typical public school system starts educating families about this at the beginning of senior year, when it is far, far too late. </p>

<p>Some naïve ones see folks who are more in tune with the college process and have planned earlier and out of self-defense label them extreme. To justify their failure to anticipate what would be needed, they call preparation pushing, and diligence obsessiveness. They want to believe that they never would have wanted to do what the prepared folks did even if they had known to do it, so they insist that any effort in that direction would have traumatized their offspring or deprived them of their childhoods. They exclaim, “It’s crazy! If that’s what it takes, it’s not worth it.” They go on to tout the fact that they did what was most important, which was to ensure their child’s happiness. And I’m sure they did do that. </p>

<p>Some kids need more hands-on parenting than others. My parents were very hands-off as both worked, and they and one of my brothers were in a panic for two months because he never applied to college and wanted to go. My other siblings and I all coped on our own, and just let our parents know when we needed checks for application fees and where we decided to go after acceptances were sent out.</p>

<p>Happiness is a range. I’m sure if I gave all my kids the choice to live at home and play video games all day, and not go to school, most of mine would say “sounds great!”. But if you explain to your kids what you are helping them achieve and why, you might get buy-in. If you don’t get buy-in, step back and ask why you are doing it - is it for you or them?</p>

<p>I loved this article. It is an opinion piece if you don’t hold the same opinion that’s fine too-the author says “some” more than once they are talking about their own experience.</p>

<p>I like the questions-that’s a nice checklist.</p>

<p>Where does it put down kids who are in elite colleges? Where does it say everyone? The author says “for some parents”.</p>

<p>I see this a lot-and most of the kids aren’t even applying to elite schools. </p>

<p>“Some naïve ones see folks who are more in tune with the college process and have planned earlier and out of self-defense label them extreme. To justify their failure to anticipate what would be needed, they call preparation pushing, and diligence obsessiveness. They want to believe that they never would have wanted to do what the prepared folks did even if they had known to do it, so they insist that any effort in that direction would have traumatized their offspring or deprived them of their childhoods. They exclaim, “It’s crazy! If that’s what it takes, it’s not worth it.” They go on to tout the fact that they did what was most important, which was to ensure their child’s happiness. And I’m sure they did do that.”</p>

<p>And some people are forever in “competition” with their neighbors and kids’ classmates’ parents, either wanting approval or feeling better that they had a superior outcome than the family down the block. It’s funny how no one ever “insisted” to me that I must have pushed my kids because they got into top schools. If they said anything, it was “congrats!” and they moved on. It seems to me that no one would accuse another parent of pushing unless the pushing was obvious and public in nature. </p>

<p>I don’t know about that-there is a lot of jealousy I see in my little part of the world-and judgement. I know people who are going to be bitter no matter what. It’s very easy to see with sports-how people live vicariously through their children-it’s easy to get caught up in it I know I have had my moments and I am very ashamed at my behavior at those times and hope I have learned from my own mistakes as a parent.</p>

<p>I can identify with this article in my life-without leaping to the conclusion that kids who are at better schools than my kids are somehow only there because they were pushed-I don’t make those kind of broad brushed judgements as a rule.</p>

<p>@shawbridge I do agree with your observation that there is a lot going on at schools that adults may have no idea about unless like your wife they have that kind of connection with the kids.</p>

<p>The overbearing, homework-doing, success-uber-alles, my-kid-must-engage-in-exact-things-to-get-into-HYP parent is a convenient bogeyman (or, more usually, woman). She’s just like the Mercedes-driving Welfare Queen: she makes an easy target for vilification. We all know her, are never friends (though sometimes in-laws), and we can all feel good that if we’re not perfect parents at least we’re not her.
Whether she (or the guy who has a claw and attacks kids in lover’s lanes, or the homicidal hitchhiker, or Tailey-po) exists or not really doesn’t matter. She doesn’t have anything to do with anyone else’s kid. The only thought that comes to mind here is to suggest to Ms. Gilman: “you do you”. Of course, then she wouldn’t get HuffPo’s Parents section to give her or the private schools she conveniently heads any free publicity…</p>

<p>There’s only jealousy if you engage with these other people. There is no law compelling you to care about what these people think. These are random people - they happened to move to the same neighborhood you did and hence your kids go to the same schools. You are not obligated to get caught up in their little Peyton Place dramas unless you choose to. </p>

<p>I know some body at work who is not married yet but is a fan of Amy Chua. I think if this person has kid, I can see she might emulate Amy Chua. </p>

<p>I forgot to write she is not married and has no boyfriend and does not have any kid yet except some puppies.</p>

<p>People who have no children tend to have all kinds of opinions on what they’ll do when/if they ever have them. Most of them make a lot of changes once the hospital sends them home with this small, squirmy creature who lives to mock their planning.</p>

<p>I’m not sure whether we “over-parented,” “under-parented,” or “goldilocks-parented.” I guess for us, the experience was perhaps different than for most because we homeschooled through 8th grade.</p>

<p>I think our view was school is about learning. It’s about academics. It’s about reading, writing, math, science, history, literature, etc. We chose a curriculum that was rigorous, but when we found that in the middle school years it became a little obsessive, we dropped it, and came up with our own.</p>

<p>In the early years, the kids were usually done school before lunch. In the later years, they were still out playing in the yard when they’re traditional school peers were getting off the bus in the afternoon. We did things with other homeschoolers, both school-related, and more fun-related. They participated in some community group sorts of things (karate, baseball, etc.). But not to the point of having highly-scheduled lives. A few hours per day, our two sons got to do what they wanted, whether it was shoot hoops outside, or play some other sort of ball with each other, or read, or draw, or paint. Just, no TV or video or computer games. As long as they did their best in their basic curriculum, they could pursue what they wanted to pursue, within reason. </p>

<p>Academically, we told 'em, do the best you can do. And they did very well. As I said, their curriculum was rigorous. Some folks we knew were critical because they thought the curriculum was too tough and put too much pressure on our sons to perform academically. But they seemed to like it, they did well, and they were still playing out in the yard every afternoon, so how tough was it?</p>

<p>When they got to high school, they found that academically, they were at the top of their class. They liked that. It became an important part of how they related to themselves. So, we didn’t have to push them very hard, as they pushed themselves exceedingly hard. In fact, my wife and I sometimes had to moderate their academic ambitions, as they would have gotten in way over their heads without an occasional nudge here and there to let up off the accelerator.</p>

<p>Because my wife and I homeschooled, we were always involved with their academics. When they first went to high school, my sons found it difficult to deal with a lot of the logistics of being in a traditional school - a rotating schedule that was different each day of the week, the need to copy down homework assignments to do later (they didn’t really do “homework,” per se, when they homeschooled), etc. For the first couple of years, I’d close the loop with them every day to make sure they were doing all the things that needed to get done, teaching them how to keep a calendar, going over it with them daily to reinforce the use of it. But eventually, they mastered these things, as well, and for each of them, the last couple of years of high school, we’d discuss course selection, different higher-level topics, but really were no longer involved in the day-to-day academic stuff.</p>

<p>When it came to college, they wanted to know what were realistic colleges to which they could apply. We did research together. Their grades and test scores were sufficient that they could realistically apply to wherever they wished. They picked some schools (mostly most-selective), we picked some schools (mostly mid-range and safeties), we all talked about the lists and came to consensus. In the case of our younger son, after much, much haggling (he didn’t want to bother with most of the safeties). They applied. They got into to some nice schools.</p>

<p>Over-parented? Under-parented? I don’t know. We just sorta did what came natural. Just didn’t think about it in these terms.</p>

<p>I’ve seen the nicest lowest key people get trashed as being pushy and overbearing for no reason other than people are jealous of their kids success. </p>

<p>I am grateful I don’t live in a soap opera it’s certainly there if I wanted to no thanks. </p>

<p>When my daughter was young I did get caught up in the competive craziness of athletics and I do regret that and haven’t done that in a long time. I am glad I have avoided for the most part the behaviors in the article but I do understand them. </p>

<p>“I’ve seen the nicest lowest key people get trashed as being pushy and overbearing for no reason other than people are jealous of their kids success.”</p>

<p>If you don’t respect the source, what does it matter? </p>

<p>I didn’t say it did. </p>

<p>some kids raise themselves. I had one of those. Kid basically needed protein, clean sheets on the bed occasionally, and a reminder here and there to brush twice a day, call grandma, take out the trash. Everything else happened entirely without parental involvement.</p>

<p>I also had one who was an entirely different story. A different book in fact. I had visions of that running scene in “Chariots of Fire” except it was my spouse running like crazy with a 30 year old kid wrapped around his neck pulling him down.</p>

<p>Didn’t happen. Kid grew up. Doing great. So independent. But it didn’t happen overnight and it wasn’t always easy.</p>

<p>These stories never concede that some kids can thrive in a crack in a sidewalk.</p>