Parental Support?

College Majors Musical Theater Major
1

<p>Hi, I am very new to these boards, first I will tell you a little bit about myself. I am in my junior year of high school, I live in Canada and if you haven’t guessed already I am interested in going to school for Musical Theatre or Theatre.</p>

<p>I have been reading this forum for a few days and I just want to say that everything has been very helpful. Now I am not used to boards and such, so I apologize if this is in the wrong place.
You see, I have always been involved with Drama at school, and had always dreamed of going to school for performing but never thought it was possible. It wasn't until this year that my director approached me and asked if I planned on going to school for acting when I thought "Why isn't it possible? Why can't I go?" then I asked myself, could I be happy without theatre, and the answer was no. So over the past month I realized I have exactly a year until I have to audition at Universities and I have a whole lot of catching up to do. </p>

<p>Now I read quite a few pages from the How to Prepare Thread at the top of the board, and I have picked the schools I want to audition for, I chose Sheridan, Windsor, St. Clair, Randolph, Capilano, Ryerson, Concordia, Brock, University of Ottawa, Kings College. This is a wide range of diploma programs, BFA, BA, and non-audition schools. </p>

<p>My Mother is a very logical person, and she does not see the logic in going to school for theatre, but she also doesn’t want me to regret missing out on something I love so she has agreed to support me. She is being great with driving me to practices, I have taken voice lessons for a year now and have just started dance lessons, along with the two musicals I am doing with my school. </p>

<p>Now my problem is that I don’t feel like I actually have her support, if the topic of school comes up she says that I should get into business, and when I tell her that it is an option in the future but for now I know what I want to do she doesn’t answer. Also I have asked her multiple times to come look at a schools website with me and she will glance over and say “oh yeah”. It is clear I will be unable to visit most of these schools since most are at least a 17 hour drive away so I would appreciate some help with researching them. She also doesn’t really understand that we may have to travel to these schools for me to audition. Whenever I bring up auditions she brushes it off. I am not sure if she just doesn’t realize how little time I have before I actually need to. Even little things like when I ask to go to the library so I can look at plays she just asks “why?” Basically anything I bring up that is theatre related she ignores. </p>

<p>Now I should be grateful she is not stopping me from doing this, but it is obvious I will have very little help. And to be honest, right now I am very overwhelmed at what I should be doing to prepare, and I am very scared, I come from a very small city and I don’t know anyone else who is planning on going to school for musical theatre. </p>

<p>I am sorry that this looks like a novel, and I realized I don’t even have a clear question. I am just very lost and would love any piece of guidance someone could offer me.</p>

2

<p>Hi MissTaylor, welcome to the MT board. You will find loads of parents, students and educational professionals here that are more than happy to answer questions and share their experience and knowledge. Let me offer a few comments in response to your post.</p>

<p>First, in the event your think it’s worth sharing this with your mother, let me put my comments in context. My daughter is a senior in a BFA MT program who will be graduating in May. She was an ultra high achieving honors/AP high school student at a very highly regarded college prep oriented public high school. My daughter always had a love for theater and performing and in 10th grade, decided that she wanted to seriously explore theater as a potential college major and career path and by the beginning of 11th grade had concluded that theater was indeed the college and career path for her. Our immediate family is filled with lawyers and doctors - parents, grandparents, aunts and uncles - the point of that being that our daughter comes from a family that puts great stock in obtaining a college education that prepares one for graduate training and employment of substance. Having said that, I can tell you that there is not a single lawyer or doctor in our family that feels that our daughter has sold herself short or or will emerge from college unprepared for the responsibilities of independent adult living because she has majored in MT in a BFA program. Here’s why.</p>

<p>There is often a general misconception that a degree in theater, especially a BFA, is somehow less legitimate an educational experience and leaves a student less prepared for adult life after college than a major in another more traditional field. This is simply not true. Even in a conservatory style BFA program, many of the departmental courses themselves require students to read, analyze, research and study the historical and societal settings and study the relationships of characters in dozens of serious works of dramatic literature each year. There is a serious academic component in this regard even with the performance track of the college departmental curriculum. In addition, many if not most, BFA programs today require theater majors to take non-departmental liberal arts classes. And if you happen to be in a BA theater program, more likely than not you are required to take the same liberal arts distribution and core courses as any other major. Also, in BA programs, there is usually plenty of opportunity to double major if that is important to a student. Furthermore, even the studio courses in a performing arts program require a tremendous amount of hard work of substance both in and outside of the classroom. Moreover, to be successful in a theater program, a student must develop excellent time management skills, develop self confidence and self reliance, learn to work cooperatively with others as part of a team on major productions and studio work, and quickly develop the ability to work very long hours reflecting a very strong work ethic. All of these are highly valued qualities in the work world.</p>

<p>Moreover, the reality is that with very few exceptions (a degree in theater being one of them), an undergrad degree does not prepare one to enter the work world and obtain a meaningful job in the student’s major. Most undergrad degrees are designed to prepare a student for graduate studies and it is the grad degree that prepares the student for employment of substance in the student’s field of study. In this regard, a degree in theater is every bit as credible as any liberal arts type major. I know loads of theater majors who went on to law school, teaching certifications and various other graduate programs and their degree in theater did not in any manner serve as an impediment to their post graduate educational endeavors. At the same time, a degree in theater, particularly a BFA program, prepares a student to in fact enter the job market with the skill sets and training to pursue employment in the student’s area of study.</p>

<p>Keep in mind that an undergrad degree is not the end of the process but just the first phase of your post high school journey into independent adult living. Some theater majors go on to professional performing. Some seek post grad education or training in other areas. Far more important than what you major in during college is that you pursue your chosen course of study fully invested and dedicated to sucking every drop out of the experience that you can. If you have a passion for theater, now is the time to pursue that passion. At the end of four years, you will have a legitimate degree and will have had a rich and rewarding educational experience. There’s plenty of time from there to determine what you want to do with the rest of your life and hopefully the adults in your life will realize this.</p>

<p>Good luck.</p>

3

<p>I am a parent who believes in supporting her children to achieve their dreams, but even this mom gets worried about her D’s MT plans, privately. Not that I doubt her talent and work ethic for a second, but I worry about the economy and the premature closings of so many shows on Broadway this month.
Perhaps a “logical” mom might support your plans if they included a double major or a minor in theatre and a major in “something practical” or the reverse. Could she get behind you on that?<br>
Also, before we launched this venture, I had a NYC pro evaluate my D’s potential. I wanted to know that an outsider saw the same promise in her that those who loved her did. Parents are often too blinded by love to know if their child has exceptional ability or not. Do you know a pro who can tell you and your mom that this is a good path for you? Make sure this is somebody who isn’t needing you to follow this path for their regular income.
We are in the middle of the audition process. It’s a huge, complicated undertaking and you need your family along side of you. It’s also a financial sacrifice for the family - driving from hotel to hotel and touring colleges will be my last “vacation” I think for many years to come! :slight_smile: I hope you can work things out. Best wishes to you.</p>

4

<p>Thank you both a lot, It is so comforting to here from people who are going through the same thing. </p>

<p>To tried to tell my mother that after I got my undergrad degree, if i was struggling with work then I could always take a year and get my entertainment management diploma, which could open up many more opertunities for me. She seemed to agree with me.</p>

<p>But how do I get her support with the audition/application process? Also money worries me, my family is not struggling we are living comfortably but I feel guilty demanding so much. There are some schools where you HAVE to audition in person, which I completelty understand. But on some at school theyre website says that you can audition by either Video or in Person. </p>

<p>How much worse is it to audition by video?</p>

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<p>audition by video: my daughter’s school list ranges from:</p>

<p>*video being, actually, the ONLY way they audition (specifically, Stephens, a private woman’s college that is consistently listed in the top ten theater schools in the country by Princeton Review; so even though that is unusual, it doesn’t mean that a very good program doesn’t do it)
*requiring a video prescreen and then possibly being invited to audition (very competitive programs at Texas State and U of Oklahoma)
*to allowing them because they do understand how it is (U of Tampa)
*to allowing them but stating emphatically they prefer in person (Texas Christian)
*to not doing them at all. (St Edwards)</p>

<p>You say most of the schools you are looking at are 17 hours away. There are plenty of schools we could be looking at that are 17 hours away, too, that everyone would have heard of if my daughter went to them, but we decided early on that we didn’t have the resources to go visit all of those and that we’d have to find what good, even if less nationally known, programs were closer.</p>

<p>It turns out there are a handful of excellent and nationally known programs close to us; of course all of those are the “lottery” variety that are hard to get into. It turns out there are also a lot of very good programs that are more well known regionally but we feel that our D could be just as successful with an education there, if she has the talent and drive (and LUCK) which a school can’t give you anyway. And, we have some nice safeties on the list that are close by and that we can afford and no, it’s not Carnegie Mellon or someplace everyone knows, but that is okay. She will end up someplace she loves and she will be able to pursue her passion and we will be able to afford it and that is what matters.</p>

<p>What I am saying is, you don’t say where it is you live, but without your parents being able to drive you for auditions (and wouldn’t they have to take you for visits even if you were going into business or something anyway???) or even if they were willing but couldn’t go that far, you’d need to look into closer options.</p>

<p>I advise you do that and don’t feel like just because they aren’t the big famous ones that you won’t end up “making it.” If we lived on the east coast of COURSE we’d be looking at those ourselves, but we don’t, but there are plenty of actors who come from schools that aren’t so famous. </p>

<p>I second the advice about getting some objective feedback as to your potential, for starters.</p>

<p>Then show your mom the excellent information from MichaelNKat (and isn’t he great? Can we all just give him a big ol cyber kiss on the cheek, he is SO WONDERFUL, always, and everyone else here is also just kind and helpful beyond description) and get her to understand that</p>

<p>a- a theatre degree in no way dooms you to unemployment, and, also very importantly:</p>

<p>b- a degree in something else IN NO WAY GUARANTEES employment. There’s a big article out now about a brewing scandal with law schools who are misleading students about the job prospects and it turns out that a horrifying number of them are NOT getting those big fat juicy well paying jobs they thought they’d use to pay off those horrifying student loans. Something well under 20 percent of graduates, if I remember correctly. The majority of them are getting low paid clerky type jobs or…wait for it…WAITING TABLES.</p>

<p>If you are going to wait tables, wouldn’t you rather at least be unable to get the work you love rather than unable to get work you don’t like that much in the first place?</p>

<p>Okay wait, maybe don’t use that last one on her. lol.</p>

<p>But my point is, nowadays, except maybe for nurses, I don’t know ANY degree that guarantees a job. Or even has all that great of a shot at it, based simply on the degree alone. The number of undergrads with degrees in business, English, communications - basically, any liberal arts type of degree- who aren’t finding a lot of jobs in their field, are way outnumbering those who do.</p>

<p>Even the long hallowed tech fields, who were pretty much promised job security a few years ago, are finding the market is tanking for them now. And anyway, it’s not like you can just say “Oh, I’ll be an engineer cause they make good money”, because that is an ability either you have or you don’t. (My daughter does NOT. She’d flunk. Period.)</p>

<p>Get started researching schools close by and programs and remind her that no matter what your major, even a BFA in art, you will have to take some core classes and who knows, you MIGHT find out you want to major in something else. (I doubt that will happen to my daughter, despite all the hopeful and “helpful” comments from people trying to “reassure” me of that fact, lol). But it’s not like if you switch to being a History major that you are going to have some kind of “job security” or a better education than you would with theater.</p>

<p>Theater IS a very intellectual and rigorous degree. I have yet to personally meet an actor who struck me as not all that bright. (can’t say that about a lot of other job fields…they might know how to do their job but they aren’t much in the way of THINKERS, you know?) You have to be able to think, to reason, to research, to intellectualize, in order to figure out HOW TO ACT, you really do. If people really understood the course of study involved in a theater degree, we wouldn’t have to deal with this “so how are you going to make a LIVING” issue.</p>

<p>And all that’s assuming you need a “backup”. You don’t have to end up famous on Broadway to make a living in this craft, either. There’s lots of other ways to make a living in this field.</p>

<p>Okay, that was long, but I hope some of it helps you. My suggestion is to start looking at schools close enough that you could get there on your own: perhaps friends of yours will be visiting (for other programs, but that doesn’t matter) and you could ask if they could take you? Many parents are glad to have another kid along for company for their kid once in a while.</p>

<p>Also to repeat, no matter what your major, your parents SHOULD understand that college visits are a really important part of selecting a college and they ought to be willing to take you to a few local ones at the very least. You could perhaps agree to go and look at two programs: the acting, and one other “backup” one, just to say you’ve looked at it; it can’t hurt. Personally, we finally quit pretending there was any backup for my D a while ago and just deal with the flak, but sometimes you have to just compromise and it’s not like it will kill you to look at something else. You might end up liking it. I’m not trying to talk you out of acting, mind you. That’s something for you to decide when you know more about everything. But if it takes looking at another program to get a college visit, then I’d do it.</p>

<p>Hope that helps some. Where are you located if you don’t mind saying?</p>

6

<p>Maybe your mom is also trying to gauge how “serious” you are about this fairly risky path? Maybe she suspects this is a current obsession, but may pass in favor of something else. </p>

<p>I was a bit of a doubting Thomas about this myself at first. I know my son had always enjoyed performing as a hobby, but it wasn’t until his senior year that HE even decided that whether as a performer, director, teacher, agent, whatever…he NEEDED to be involved in theatre in some way. He just can’t see himself doing ANYTHING else. We had no choice but to be swept up in his passion.</p>

<p>Maybe your mom is assessing your level of commitment based on whether you will pursue this with or without her active involvement.</p>

7

<p>snapdragonfly, thank you for your kind words. I also had to laugh over your comment about the “law school scandal”. My son is in his second semester at law school and I’m not sure if I’m worried more about him or my daughter finding a job in their chosen field upon graduation! He’s also in a band that just finished recording their first album. Maybe I should tell him to stick to music? ;)</p>

<p>MissTaylor, in addition to the great advice offered by snapdragonfly,here are some additional thoughts:</p>

<p>1) First, do you think there is a way to recruit your mother to be invested in your school application and audition process? Sometimes, parents don’t understand how much more complicated, difficult and time consuming applying to audition based programs is as compared to typical liberal arts programs. Also, many parents aren’t knowledgeable about what a theater curriculum entails. If you printed out the various application, admissions and audition requirements and curricula you would be taking at your various schools of choice as a theater/MT major, do you think you could corral your mother into sitting down with you and letting you review all of that with her? Once she sees all of that, perhaps she would have a better understanding that your intended area of study is demanding and one of substance.</p>

<p>Then, once she sees all of that, lay out for her a timeline of what you need to do to prepare for your applications and auditions, from the current voice lessons, dance lessons, shows and theater experience you need to get now, up through the process of searching for and preparing audition materials, then finally the application and audition timeline itself. Help her to understand the amount of time that is required and the logistics of keeping everything organized and moving forward. You describe her as a “logical” person. Perhaps you can appeal to that side of her and explain that you need and want her help in putting together a game plan and even having her assist you with all the administrative and logistical details. And instead of simply asking her to drop you off at the library to look at plays, ask her to come with you and keep you company while do it, even ask her to read plays with you. Some of the best times I had with my daughter when she was at the point you are at was sitting on the floor of our local bookstore with piles of plays next to us, reading monologs each other. Maybe you can make it a mother daughter literary activity and not just a chauffeuring chore.</p>

<p>Finally, talk to your mother about your long range goals and plans. While it is very important to share your immediate passion and excitement about theater, it is equally important to show her that this is not simply a sudden impulse but something about which you have given serious thought as you start mapping out the directions of your adult life. Talk to her about options that you are considering over the next four years and where you thing this will all lead you upon graduation. Talk about what options you think you will have upon graduation. Solicit her thoughts and input.</p>

<p>Perhaps coming from these directions your mother will better understand that your desire to major in theater is of serious purpose and intent and that you are approaching this in a responsible thought out manner. Perhaps she will end up more invested in this for you as a result.</p>

<p>2) You state that you live 17 hours from the schools on your list. Without knowing more about where you live, how you chose the schools on your list and other considerations, it’s hard to suggest whether there are other worthwhile schools closer to you. However, most schools have auditions and/or info sessions with reps in various cities away from their main campus. Check the school websites - both the departmental and general admissions sites - to find whether your schools offer such satellite location opportunities. Often times, schools do these kinds of things in the same cities and often on overlapping dates. Many schools participate in Unified or regional auditions. Many schools send their admissions reps to a broad variety of cities. These can be a way to limit the travel time and costs for students. Again, scour the school websites for information of this type if you have not already done so.</p>

<p>3) Now is also the time to start thinking about your audition materials. Your voice teacher can be a good source for guidance as can the directors of shows you are in. Department websites can often have a lot of good suggestions to assist you in narrowing the scope of material you will want to look at.</p>

<p>Hope this is helpful.</p>

8

<p>Regarding finding schools that are closer to me, I live in New Brunswick, a very small province on the east coast. In Canada there are far less performing art schools than in the USA, There are quite a few BA in theatre, very few focus on performance, and there are probably less than 10 schools that teach musical theatre. </p>

<p>There is only one school that offers a BA in theatre in my province, it is a really good school, and I have been to the campus multiple times since I go to an acting competition there once a year but it is just not what I am looking for. 50% of the kids from my highschool will end up going there for different majors and I would like to experience something new. </p>

<p>The closest Musical Theatre school is about 6 hours away, and again is a good program, but the focus is on classical voice, where I would like to focus on acting. </p>

<p>The next <code>closest</code> you could say is in Newfoundland but you can only get to it by plane and the flights are not cheap. </p>

<p>Other than that all of the other schools are 10hours-3days drives away. Since 98% of performing art schools in Canada are in British Columbia, Ontario, and Quebec, with a few in Alberta. </p>

<p>So sadly looking closer to home isn`t really an option. One break I might get in the visiting schools situation is my Theatre Arts class in highschool may be taking a trip to Toronto (where 3 of the schools I am thinking about are) for the soul purpose of touring performing arts schools.</p>

<p>I really apreciate all the help and advice.</p>

9

<p>MichealNKat, I tell my husband that at least my daughter isn’t expecting a big paying full time job as soon as she graduates and won’t be disappointed! lol! You know Gerard Butler was a lawyer, don’t you? He left it to act! (and he too had a band!) I wonder what his mum thought of that one!</p>

<p>My D had thought about law school at one point. I wouldn’t tell anyone who loved the idea not to go to law school just because the market is soft right now (after all, it always comes back eventually), but, if someone (I’m not specifically thinking of your son as I am sure he got the wisest guidance from you) is going to law school primarily because they think they are guaranteed a high paying job immediately, then I hope they can change their attitude to something more like our acting kids have: that they know they will have to work really hard to find a job, and that they love this more than anything and that, not a promise of good pay, is why they are pursuing it. I think persistence and hard work always pay off eventually but I think the vast majority of graduating kids in the next few years, no matter what their field, are not going to find jobs begging for applicants. It’s tough all over no matter what field. Times get better eventually, they always do, but it’s become a joke in our family that times are never going to be tougher for our daughter because they were never going to be all that great in the first place. /gallows humor/ </p>

<p>(actually I think the job market for actors doesn’t fluctuate that much…I’d have to research it, but people actually spend more for entertainment when times are bad. As well as on booze. lol.)</p>

<p>So if it’s something you are meant to do, do it, but going into a field just for the job security, while there is nothing immoral or foolish at all about doing that - there is nothing wrong with pragmatism in my book -they might be left with a big disappointment and also won’t at have least the joy of pursuing their passion to give those beans and rice some savor.</p>

<p>Just some big ol thoughts for the kiddos to ponder…or, since we none of us have a crystal ball wherein they can come up with the flawless plan for the next 60 years of their lives, they can just pursue what it is they want to.</p>

10

<p>Ah, you really don’t seem to have many close options.</p>

<p>I second what MichaelNKat said - research and look for the big audition events, like Unifieds and such, where you can be seen by a lot of schools with just one trip. It’s possible your school theater department might even be able to sponsor some of them. Schools don’t do the Unifieds but there is one close to us that our state educational agency is involved in and the school takes and pays for that one, I don’t know if there is something like that where you are. And definitely start working on your material now. I wish we’d realized about that when my D was still a junior! We had to get really busy over her summer and get caught up.</p>

11

<p>MichaelNKat</p>

<p>I just read your latest post and that is a very good idea, Over the next day or so I will print off all the information and scheduals I have saved on my labtop and give her a copy. </p>

<p>I have never thought that she would be interested in reading through plays with me because she never seems to listen whenever I start rambling on about a script of show I just found out about.
But my sister is off to university, and my step father travels all the time for work (I have considered asking to tag along with him but he is usually gone for about 2 weeks at a time) and my mother works from home. She often complains about how I am <code>never here</code>or how I am <code>always busy</code> so maybe she would enjoy it if I asked to spend more time with her, even if it is theatre related.</p>

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<p>This is an interesting thread for me as I am from Canada (living in the US) and my daughter was born in Canada. I spent many hours with my daughter trying to find a BFA in MT anywhere in Canada because as citizens we get to pay a fraction of the cost of international students. It also a fraction of the cost of most American Universities. There is not one single BFA MT program offered in Canada. There are a number of college programs (colleges in Canada are more technical training and Universities grant degrees) offering certificates in MT for 3 years of study (Sheridan) - but you will not have a degree - nor could I find any bridge programs that would grant a degree with further study at a University. It seems that you may be willing to do theater - what about Dalhousie in Nova Scotia? It seemed like quite a good program when I was doing my research. </p>

<p>My understanding is that most of the college certificate programs are very competitive (Sheridan, Randolph Academy) and you would do well to have a live rather than a recorded audition. I have a lot more information for you if you need it as I have gone in circles and done a lot of research on this issue. Just private message me and we can discuss it further if you would like. </p>

<p>I would also try to direct your mom to this website and have her read what the other parents are going through - it can be quite an eye-opener as a parent (also a little addictive). I know that I have had quite a metamorphosis over the years of reading and learning on CC. Best of luck to you
Alison
ps take a closer look at Dal</p>

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<p>Thank you very much!</p>

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<p>Miss Taylor - Let me know if you got my message.</p>

15

<p>Yep! I replied</p>