<p>What if you dont qualify? What if you dont get into Harvard, but into another prestigious school?</p>
<p>OneThousandFists
Junior Member
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 47 </p>
<p>"Why is life so cruel? My stats makes me to believe I have a great chance at Ivys. My parents are so poor that CC or a state school seems to be my only option. All this work down the drain. I wonder if my depression will intensify as November approaches."</p>
<p>What you see as life's being "cruel" is simply reality. Life doesn't owe anyone anything. There are millions of people in the world who worked hard and have great stats , but because of where they were born, will not be able to have any kind of higher education. Indeed, such people would envy you for living in a country in which you can get high education if you work hard even if you are poor.</p>
<p>Instead of wringing your hands and complaining, since you see that $ will be a problem, then start searching for ways to make money. There are many scholarship competions as well as excellent books and web sites that tell how one can increase one's odds of winning excellent scholarships. If your stats and ECs are Ivy equivalent, then if you follow such advice, you would have a good chance of getting good scholarships.</p>
<p>What puts people ahead in many scholarship competitions is having excellent grades, ECs and being in need of money. Of course, one has to take the time to do a thoughtful application, including having the kind of relationships that result in excellent recommendation letters.</p>
<p>It also would be a smart thing to work during the school year and summer. Many scholarship committees (and I have served on a national one) are most happy to help low income students who obviously are doing what they can to help themselves.</p>
<p>Meanwhile, if you have excellent stats, there are many colleges that would be delighted to have you and would give you excellent need as well as merit-based aid.</p>
<p>Of course, Ivies guarantee financial aid up to one's level of need. Princeton and Harvard especially are generous. Keep in mind, however, that most people who apply to such colleges are well qualified for admission. Most people, however, will be rejected because of lack of space. Don't pin your hopes on Ivies. Apply, but have back-ups.</p>
<p>And take the time to do some research about colleges. Your gloom and doom about having only the option of community college is ridiculous and demonstrates that you have not been researching the possibilities. Don't rely on your GC or buddies to help you with this. If you want good 4-year college options, use the various guidebooks as well as sites like CC, where you can get advice, and then work your tail off to do the things that will get you the aid that you need.</p>
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**. My parents are so poor that CC or a state school seems to be my only option.
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<p>You are telling us that you are depressed about qualifying for what might be a loan free IVY degree? You seem to have the opportunity to go IVY for free......how is that a depressing situation?</p>
<p>^^ You advice is good, but I have absolutely no time to pursue such activituies. I am taking 9 AP courses at once, as well as 2 CC courses after school. The remaining time I have is spent over ECs. Time is a luxury I cannot afford.</p>
<p>If indeed the reason you have few if any ECs is that you need to work for family support then lack of ECs will not count against you. I am sure you will make your HS counselor and recommenders aware of your financial situation and that you work.</p>
<p>Well, I dont work, I pursue my passion for voulunteering. I absolutely have NO time to work, since of my courseload and use my remaining time over ECs.</p>
<p>IF you get into Harvard, you are only responsible for $5350/year.</p>
<p>"Undergraduates receiving grant assistance are expected to contribute to their expenses by meeting a self-help requirement during the school year ($3,500 for students entering next year). Students may use outside scholarship awards to meet this requirement, and last year 586 students used this option to erase it completely. Students may work about 12-15 hours per week at a variety of term-time jobs, including research positions, internships and career exploration opportunities to meet this obligation. Alternatively, they can secure a loan at favorable long-term interest rates. Students are also expected to contribute from their summer earnings ($1,850 for incoming students). Such flexible financial aid options contribute to Harvard's high graduation rate of 97%, among the highest in the nation,"</p>
<p>If you cannot get into "Big H", another IVY, Princeton is your best option. At princeton, you are only responsible for appriximately $5400/year. (The sum of the $2600 (summer work), and the $2800 ,self-help from campus work)</p>
<p>Now dont tell me that you cannot attend IVY college cuz ure poor! ! !
If you have a stat, u can go to any IVY school almost free cuz ure poor ! ! !</p>
<p>"^^ You advice is good, but I have absolutely no time to pursue such activituies. I am taking 9 AP courses at once, as well as 2 CC courses after school. The remaining time I have is spent over ECs. Time is a luxury I cannot afford."</p>
<p>If you need $ to go to college, then working a job would be more important than taking 9 APs plus 2 CC college courses and doing ECs.</p>
<p>Colleges understand full well the importance of earning $ to students who are in low income homes. Indeed, if you check out how California public institutions rate ECs, you'll see that if a student earns $ to have to help support their family, that counts as a significant EC.</p>
<p>There is absolutely no college that expects students to take 9 APs plus 2 CC courses. It is a fallacy that doing something like that will get someone into Harvard or a similar college. What you actually may be risking is looking like someone who keeps nose to the grindstone to look good to colleges, but isn't really that self motivated.</p>
<p>What elite colleges want to see are students who take rigorous courseloads and do something major in addition to academics. For a low income student, working a job (any job, not just a prestigious job) to get $ for the family or for college would count as a major achievement. Similarly, if a student is low income and has family responsibilities such as having to take care of an ill relative or help with siblings, the college will count those responsibilites as significant ECs.</p>
<p>You are the one making the decision to perhaps trade your opportunity for college in order to take a boatload of APs and pursue ECs. If you are so worried about the $, then you need to do what's necessary to earn that $. </p>
<p>You would still have time to take a rigorous courseload, and your essays and GC report and recommendations can point out what else you're doing what your time, and what your reason for doing so is.</p>
<p>If you're taking courses to pursue intellectual passions, one doesn't need to take courses to do so. One can do lots of reading on one's own, for instance. Doing this actually can be more impressive than taking lots of APs. Colleges learn about such pursuits through one's essays and activity lists.</p>
<p>"Now dont tell me that you cannot attend IVY college cuz ure poor! ! !
If you have a stat, u can go to any IVY school almost free cuz ure poor ! ! !"</p>
<p>That's partially true. It's important to realize, however, that most people who apply Ivies have the stats, but do not get in for lack of space. The main reason that smart, but financially challenged, people can't go Ivy is that they aren't accepted.</p>
<p>"Well, I dont work, I pursue my passion for voulunteering. I absolutely have NO time to work, since of my courseload and use my remaining time over ECs."</p>
<p>You need to realize, then, that to some extent, your lack of $ is your choice. Stop blaming Life.</p>
<p>I took that many courses to raise my weighted gpa and hence my rank.</p>
<p>I thought colleges like candidates who pursue a passion, and this has been mentioned repeatedly in this forum. Flipping burgers at McDonalds isnt my idea of a "passionate EC." I personally feel that working on minimum wage and earn $200 per month is a waste of time. I feel like doing something more worthwhile, like volunteering, since I actyally enjoy doing this. Indeed earning $200 per month is not worth it, esp if its being used for college.</p>
<p>I aways thought Big Ivies were willing to bend over backwards for those few precious, " smart, but financially disadvantaged" URMs. =)</p>
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Now dont tell me that you cannot attend IVY college cuz ure poor! ! ! If you have a stat, u can go to any IVY school almost free cuz ure poor
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<p>I am not naive enough to have full confidence of getting a full ride at Harvard. I learned through experience that if something sounds too good to be true, then it really is.</p>
<p>Sounds too good to be true: you can read about these facts regarding financial aid in many places......why do you act as if what folks are telling here is "hear say" and not factual? We of course don't know the economic status of your family other than that you describe them as very poor.</p>
<p>"I thought colleges like candidates who pursue a passion, and this has been mentioned repeatedly in this forum. Flipping burgers at McDonalds isnt my idea of a "passionate EC." I personally feel that working on minimum wage and earn $200 per month is a waste of time. I feel like doing something more worthwhile, like volunteering, since I actyally enjoy doing this. Indeed earning $200 per month is not worth it, esp if its being used for college."</p>
<p>Colleges like students who are passionate about being able to pursue their intellectual passions by going to college. Consequently, someone poor who takes a job flipping burgers in order to help earn the $ for college would impress colleges.</p>
<p>One also can learn a lot about the world, about oneself, about business, sociology, economics and other things by doing jobs like flipping burgers.</p>
<p>I am convinced that a reason that Harvard accepted me was that I had worked as a house cleaner, store clerk and file clerk in order to earn $ for college. This was although I came from a middle class household. My dad was a dentist, but refused to pay for my education. I did everything I could to help earn the $ for that. I also documented those things on my college applications.</p>
<p>If I were an adcom, I certainly would look askance at someone who apparently is poor and fears not being able to afford college, but who apparently thought he was too good to work a job to earn the $ for college. I also would feel that way as a person on a merit scholarship committee (which I have been) and as a Harvard alum interviewer (which I am).</p>
<p>Life is not fair. One doesn't always get to do what one would prefer doing. It seems nonsensical to me for a person who is poor and is concerned about not being able to afford college to say that they won't work a job because volunteering is more fun. </p>
<p>"Indeed earning $200 per month is not worth it, esp if its being used for college."</p>
<p>I am absolutely dumbfounded by that statement. It's not worth it to work to invest in a college education that you allege to want? Why should any college invest in you if you apparently think you're too good to get your hands dirty working in order to get an education?</p>
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I am absolutely dumbfounded by that statement. It's not worth it to work to invest in a college education that you allege to want? Why should any college invest in you if you apparently think you're too good to get your hands dirty working in order to get an education?
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<p>Earning $200 dollars per month on minimum wage wont make much of a difference if college costs are over $30k per year.</p>
<p>actually minimum wage is well over $200 - if you worked 40 hrs a week and made the minimumwage your before tax salary would be over $1000.</p>
<p>If you attend an instate school, your costs will be much lower than 30K, but it is really immaterial what they would be, because you are either someone who decides to find their way around difficulties and make things happen or you are a whiner who works hard to make excuses for why things aren't working out for them.
Only you can decide who you are going to be.</p>
<p>Fists,
It would make a big difference in that:
1. Colleges would see that you are passionate about your education and that will help you get acceptances.</p>
<p>Every adcom knows that a person smart enough to be applying to an Ivy would much prefer doing intellectual or volunteer work to a minimum wage job. Consequently, a low income student who works at McDonalds is demonstrating their passion about getting an education and would stand out more than would a person who is poor, but apparently unwilling to dirty their hands to earn $ for an education.</p>
<ol>
<li>As I mentioned before, merit scholarship committees are far more likely to give $ to students who have major financial need and have demonstrated that they are willing to take minimum wage and similar jobs to earn $ to get their education. Smart low income students can manage to do this while also take rigorous course loads and doing volunteer work. </li>
</ol>
<p>For instance, a student whom I know who got a Gates scholarship was taking a very tough course load, had a high rank, was volunteering wi as an advisor to a middle school academic club, was a class officer and was doing all of the cooking/cleaning in his single parent home plus earning $ by cooking for other people. He's now pursuing his doctorate at an Ivy. </p>
<ol>
<li>Believe it or not, even the most generous colleges will not give you all of the $ that you will need for college. You will have to either take out some loans or work in order to pay for some of your expenses.</li>
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<p>For instance, more than likely, you'll want things like a laptop, $ for academic conferences, some new clothes, money for trips home (typically, the scholarship budget is for one trip home a year) or trips to your friends' homes. Since you like to study, you may wish to get some supplemental books or other resources. </p>
<p>Even Harvard and Princeton's generous scholarships for low income students aren't going to cover things like laptops, academic conferences, etc.</p>
<p>Repeating Emeraldkity's sage words:
"you are either someone who decides to find their way around difficulties and make things happen or you are a whiner who works hard to make excuses for why things aren't working out for them.
Only you can decide who you are going to be."</p>
<p>Adding to them Henry Ford's sage words:</p>
<p>"There are 2 kinds of people in the world. Those who say, 'I can' and those who say, 'I can't.'</p>
<p>They're both right."</p>
<p>I'm just reading this thread today and thought I would tell about my daughter. My husband and I might be considered as those unwilling to finance their children's education at an expensive private college. We have made a lot of bad financial decisions along the way and so are in a position of having a lot of debt. We have saved 20,000 for each of them for college--not much. We can't write a check for our EFC nor would be able to pay back a loan for the amount considering our current debt. I'm an employee at a state university and my children could have tuition waivers because of my employment should they decide to attend our local university. My daughter applied to 8 colleges (from Dartmouth and Williams to Michigan Tech and Montana State) and was accepted at all of them. I didn't think there was any chance of her going to a college like Dartmouth or Williams because of costs but I didn't discourage her from applying. She was accepted to Williams as a Early Write and for several weeks reused to open the FA letter as she thought it would end her chances of being able to attend due to lack of FA and she wanted to dream a little longer. She applied for nearly every local scholarship that she heard about and was awarded a good percentage of them. She had a nearly full ride to one state university as an out of state student and could attend another at in-state tuition. When she did open the Williams FA letter they gave her a minimal amount of FA, but then when her other acceptances came in Williams sent her another FA letter with a greater award. She then negotiated with them and they gave her an even larger award. Dartmouth gave her nothing except a Stafford loan. She decided to take out a state loan plus thought that she would work two jobs over the summer to earn more money. She had a terrible time deciding where to attend. In the end she decided on Williams. One of her teachers went to a private college and ended up with 50,000 in loans and told her it was definitely worth it. My husband didn't understand that she was considering turning down a near full-ride to a state university. He has a associate degree from a CC and doesn't place a high value on an education from a top college. She ended up getting a well-paying summer job working 80 hours a week. She ended choosing Williams and is paying for it herself with loans, her summer job earnings, and her scholarships, both Williams and outside. We're contributing savings plus travel costs, medical care, clothing and other incidental costs. She wanted to go to a college like Williams as she wanted to be surrounded by students that are as serious and driven as she is and didn't think she'd find that at a state university. This is her first year at Williams and she is very happy and satisfied there. Just wanted to share of story a student who made her dreams come true. I'm visiting this forum to figure out the consequences of her summer job plus the fact that she has paid for about half of her expenses through her jobs and loans, on her FA for next year. But that's a topic for another thread.</p>