<p>Hi, I am new here. A little background. My DD is a sophomore at a small, rural high school. She plays French Horn, Trumpet, and Flugelhorn. With the help of her Music Theory teacher she is learning the piano. She has been in All-County and Area All-State Band and Orchestra every year since 4th grade and hopefully will make All-State this year and attend NYSSSA Orchestral Program either this summer or next. She is in select choir, pit band, vocal ensemble, jazz band, school musical chorus and is a cheerleader. Her after school activities are numerous but include 13 years of dance and Big Brothers Big Sisters as well as various Honor Societies. Her GPA is roughly a 96.5 and she is enrolled in honors classes. However, due to our rural area and the fact that she has 2 siblings and parents who work we are unable to shuttle her several times a week to the nearest small city (45 min. away) for any big time music stuff like Jr Symphony (1.5 hrs away) or even the local Community College band. It is just not possible as my youngest daughter is heavily involved in dance (what are the odds I will get the 3rd to become a Dr). Her band instructor has told us there is no one within 3 hours of us that is advanced enough to give her private horn instruction and actually have something to teach her.</p>
<p>Her intention is to major in Instrumental MusicEducation. Eastman is her first choice followed by Crane, Ithaca, and SUNY Fredonia.</p>
<p>Now my big question is this, how does a school such as Eastman view this lack of extra experience. We have had only one other student from our school go to Eastman (her father is our JR High Band Director) and he told stories of driving her 3 hours one way every week for private lessons. He also said that when all was said and done he had about $35,000 into her pre-college music education. I cannot afford that. </p>
<p>Also, is Music Education a major that is more reliant on grades, SAT's, and school records? She took the PSAT's as a practice this fall and scored the highest of anyone in her school that took it. I know her GPA all the rest are definitely University of Rochester worthy but as we all know music school is another story entirely. I feel very apprehensive even now b/c I know she has her heart set on Eastman and U of R and I don't want her to be disappointed. TIA</p>
<p>I think that most of "what it takes" to get into a conservatory program (BM degree) is a great audition. Granted, being in extra demanding music activities will make a better prepared musician and then maybe a better audition.</p>
<p>To be accepted into a liberal arts program (BA degree) with a music ed major, the grades and extracurriculars will undoubtedly be more important than for the performance major.</p>
<p>I don't know anything about Eastman except I know a student who is studying composition there and transferred in after her first year in Canada.</p>
<p>I can see no reason why your daughter can't set her sites on Eastman as long as she is aware that for whatever reason she may not gain entrance. She has still some time to make up her mind about what she wants to do and when all is said and done, Eastman may not remain at the top of her list. Do a little research about what other programs are out there.</p>
<p>When my son was in 9th grade he was determined to go to LA/USC. When he gained entrance in his senior year his aspirations had been diverted by other things and he chose another school. </p>
<p>I don't know about Music Ed admissions. I think SATs and other things would be more important for liberal arts and BA degrees like Ikf725 said. And it seems with the wide variety of activities that your daughter is involved in, she may want to go that route in the end.</p>
<p>Perhaps I can help. My son is currently a senior performance major at Eastman in cello. For any performance based program, the most important thing is going to be the audition. Being involved in other things such as youth orchestra, honors band, etc. are very helpful to a young musician in developing skills, but lack of participation will not keep anyone out of music school. They are most interested in how she plays, not in her resume.</p>
<p>Eastman does have a highly regarded music ed major. I know students who have applied in both performance and education who were accepted into the education program but not the performance program. What that tells me is that the audition standards are not as high for the education majors as for the performance majors. However, for the education majors the high school transcript will be much more important than it is performance. </p>
<p>The third route to go is to do a BA in music at Rochester. However, Rochester does not have education as a undergrad program, only as a graduate program. She could complete her BA in music and then go for her masters in music education. If she is truly interested in becoming a music educator, Eastman is the better way to go because it is one of the best music education programs in the country. </p>
<p>I would strongly encourage you to visit. They don't have a problem with younger students visiting. You can take the tour and learn about the difference between the performance and education programs and the recommended preparation for both. I also understand the the Crane School has an excellent music ed program as well.</p>
<p>Thanks for the input. We are planning on visiting Eastman this coming Columbus Day weekend and we will be visiting Crane that weekend as well. We will be visiting Ithaca sometime this spring. One of the big things she loves about Eastman is the program they have where you can do an accelerated Master's program. I think it is called the 3 + 2 program or the Forte program. </p>
<p>Truly, my daughter would love to ultimately perform professionally. I, however, have convinced her that it would be wise to have the teaching degree to fall back on. Her high school band teacher says she is by far the most talented musician he has come across in his career (he is ready to retire in the next few years). I feel like at Eastman she will get many opportunities to perform even though she is a Music Ed major.</p>
<p>For the person with the son at Eastman I would like to ask how he likes the living arrangements there. One of the things we also liked about U of R is that they boast about a wide variety of dorm options including community service dorms and private rooms.</p>
<p>I appreciate all of info everyone has supplied and please continue with any input and suggestions you might have.</p>
<p>I'm not sure what you mean by U of R's dorm options. Eastman students, obviously, do not live in U of R's dorms - the campuses are pretty far away. And I don't know anything about "community service dorms and private rooms." </p>
<p>I was staying overnight two weeks ago with a student host in U of R's River Campus (the main campus). The dorms are very nice (I haven't stayed overnight in any other colleges, so I cannot make comparison). Most of U of R's students live on campus, while some upperclassmen do live in apartments around the campus. I don't think you have the choice to choose your own dorm (although I think Early Decision applicants are given priorty in housing). You can request a single dorm, but I don't think you can get it very easily.</p>
<p>Eastman students live in the Eastman dorms which are located right downtown across the street from the school. The dorm houses dining facilities and student services. The only way that Eastman students can live on the main UR campus is if they are accepted into one of the other UR schools besides Eastman. The two campuses are about 15-20 minutes apart by bus shuttle. With all of the rehearsing and classes the music students are involved in, even those who are double degree students usually elect to live in the Eastman dorms. Eastman students are required to live in the dorm through junior year. The rooms are small but after freshman year, they are all singles. Practicing in the rooms is forbidden.</p>
<p>My youngest is a hs senior and is seriously considering attending UR. He has visited several times. But I am not familiar with the UR housing options that you talk about. I do know they have a theater house. They may have interest houses for other things as well. My understanding is that most students live in doubles.</p>
<p>Shennie: I'm a potential double degree student (ugh... who knows). it is true that double degree students stay on whatever campus give him/her the most money? I always thought that U of R gives more money than Eastman, so why is most DD students live in Eastman? </p>
<p>Momof3Stars, I wonder if it would be possible to afford to send your D to a summer camp to broaden her exposure? Specifically, I encourage you to look at Kendall Betts Horn Camp in New England. It's not too late to apply, but the deadline for scholarship applications has already passed this year. (Check out their nice website -- <a href="http://www.horncamp.org/kbhc06.htm%5B/url%5D">http://www.horncamp.org/kbhc06.htm</a> .) My S, a horn player at Juilliard, has gone 3 times -- twice in high school. All 3 times he has attended on full scholarship, so all we paid was plane fare. It's only a week long, but your D will have a chance to get excellent teaching and evaluation, and meet high quality teachers from all over, who can give her valuable advice. I can't recommend it highly enough.</p>
<p>Shennie: Thanks for all the info. We had just watched a U of R DVD tour the other night and they spent a lot of time touting their many housing options but left out the part about Eastman being 15 - 20 min away from the main campus and that they also have their own dorms. You were a wealth of info on this subject and I really appreciate it.</p>
<p>Binx: Thanks for the info on Horn camp. I will certainly consider it for next year. My DD has already submitted an audition for NYSSSA Orchestral Camp which is a month-long program sponsored by NY state. It is a bargain at around $1500 for a whole month residential and the Philadelphia Orchestra is headquartered there for the summer as is the NYC Ballet. I have a friend whose daughter participated in their summer theater program and she said it was considered very prestigious when her daughter went to theater school auditions it was always mentioned. If she should make it into NYSSSA this summer I know she would LOVE to audition for the horn camp next year so I am excited to get this info. </p>
<p>I am so happy and grateful for this board. I cannot explain how much getting this input has made me a little less stressed. I don't know how I am going to handle the next 2 years!!! I am more worried about her getting into her first choice than she is!</p>
<p>thzxycl - It is my understanding that students who are accepted to both the College of Letters and Science and Eastman can choose which campus to on. In terms of merit aid, I believe that all students admitted to Eastman receive merit aid of some kind. I have no idea what percentage of UR students receive it as well. If you look at the costs of attendance, you will notice that the tuition at Eastman is lower than it is at the other schools. I think that Eastman is already subsidizing its students at a certain level by lowering the tuition. Financial aid for Eastman is seperate from the rest of the school. Since all the other programs are more expensive than Eastman, if you are accepted to both programs you will have to pay the higher tuition amount. You will have to contact one of the FA departments to find out how it works for double degree students.</p>
<p>Why do most double degree students choose to live at Eastman? Probably because they have to spend so much time there that it is easier if you just live across the street. It is not unusual for my son to be playing his instrument 7 - 8 hours a day between practicing, orchestra rehearsals, chamber group rehearsals, lessons and studio class. As a result of all the time performance majors spend on their musical studies, their social lives develop more at Eastman than they do at the main campus. The shuttle bus runs pretty frequently between the 2, but the timing is not always right. I imagine that the double degree students just find it easier to live and build their lives at Eastman. </p>
<p>While Eastman is a school at the UR, it is a pretty seperate entity. Students from each campus visit the other, but as a double degree student you are likely to only feel fully integrated in one of the 2 environments. Since Eastman is so time consuming, Eastman becomes the main sphere.</p>
<p>The problem with me is - I'm still waiting for the result back from the Renaissance Scholarship from the College of Letters and Science, and if I get it, I probably don't need to pay anything. I actually did not get into Eastman because of my ill-prepared prescreening tape, but if I go to U of R I'll be studying with one of Eastman's major piano teachers who is willing to take me into his studio after hearing me. So with that said, I'll apply to Eastman next year and should get in if nothing horrible happen during that first year. </p>
<p>So, assuming I'll become a double degree student eventually, I don't believe Eastman will give me a better deal than the College, and therefore I will have live in the River Campus if such a policy (of living in whichever campus gives the most aid) exists. </p>
<p>I'm a pianist, so I don't really now how much ensemble work I need to do as a BM student beside accompanying. I'm kind of worried about how the transportation will work out. The College does have piano practice room with (hopefully great) grand pianos, but if the ensembles require such type of time commitment as you described, I really do not know how everything will end up. </p>
<p>Do you know any double degree piano students, or just BM piano students? How do their time schedules work? </p>
<p>Thank you for all your helpful informations! I wish I have a parent who help me out in all of this terribly complex applying-auditioning stuff - but I'm also glad I did it all by myself. It's not fun but it's rewarding.</p>
<p>Does anyone know if you can do two instruments as a double major at Eastman (collaborative piano and jazz studies)? I don't find theirs to be the most user friendly website, but that could be my lack of technical savvy, not the website's problem.</p>
<p>Are there people who begin at U of R and transfer into Eastman if they don't get in as Freshmen? Anyone know percentages? Is it easier if you are already at U or R? What percent of kids get into Eastman?</p>
<p>thzxcyl - Sorry to hear about your audition but you are very fortunate that one of the piano professors is willing to take you on. I think that is very rare. As far as Renaissance goes, my younger son was a candidate and found out he did NOT get it. He got his letter 2 days ago. You should be hearing soon. As far as the dorms go, you will have to live on the UR campus in any case at least for your first year.</p>
<p>I don't know what the time constraints are for pianists. I know that every BM in piano is required to collaborate with 2 students each semester. After you meet that requirement, you can charge for accompanying. There are more students looking for collaborators than there are piano students available. I also think that the pianists are required to sing in one of the choirs and are in demand for chamber music. My son tells me that most of the double degree students are either majoring in theory or voice and that the piano students practice all the time.</p>
<p>Allmusic - I don't know about double majoring as you describe. Might be possible. You should contact Eastman with that question. They are pretty friendly and helpful. In terms of auditioning, approximately 1100 students audition each year for about 140 spaces for freshmen and maybe 50 -60 grad slots. This is across all departments including jazz, musicology and music education. I don't know what their acceptance or yield rates are. As for starting UR and then transfering to Eastman, my guess is that UR students are given the same consideration for transfer as everyone else - no more and no less. My sons says there are a number of students who transfer in every year, but I think most of these students are students who have been pursuing the BM at another institution. If you complete your freshman year at UR in another program and successfully are admitted to Eastman, I think you will still need 4 years to complete the program and will essentially be considered a freshman as far as Eastman is concerned.</p>
<p>Shennie, I wonder if there is a way of finding out whether auditioning on two instruments would be a benefit or liability. Everyone who knows him musically, all directors and teachers, love and appreciate his multi-faceted talent across genres, but all caution that a college/conservatory will either love that, or not...it's worked well in high school, and it would be great for him if that could continue in college.</p>
<p>Eastman is his first choice (still two years away), and he wants to be decently positioned, but those are some kind of tough odds you presented. As much as he has done, I have no way of comparing him to kids nationwide either. This is so different than a normal college application process. </p>
<p>I am just grateful to have found this site, to help navigate these next two years.</p>
<p>Shennie, thanks so much! Yes, piano requires SO much practice, but who knows, I might pull it through. I'm sorry that you son did not get the scholarship, but will he still go to U of R? Did he get financial aid information along with the decision about the scholarship? </p>
<p>Allmusic: As a pianist, I cannot imagine taking on another instrument seriously at the same time - one is demanding enough. Even with similiar instruments, say, violin and viola, one have limited attention and energy, and doing one instrument at conservatory level really requires all of one's focus. I don't know about collaborative piano and jazz studies, but I'll imagine that audition preparation for either of them will require A LOT of time and energy. </p>
<p>I think you son should think this over and over again - he has plenty of time to do so - because, not mentioning if the conservatories like it or not, trying to prepare auditions for two instruments can very easily split his valuable time and energy, and he might end up not doing well on either of them. He should try to seek a lot of advices, perhaps also summer camps? </p>
<p>With that said, there are some extraordinarily rare people in the world who are so talented that he/she can handle multiple instruments at a very high level. But, again, very rare. If you son is one of them, sky's the limit! Again, lots of advices will help, self-confidence will help, great work ethics and discipline will definitely help. Good luck to your son!</p>
<p>Allmusic - I really don't know how a conservatory would view auditioning on 2 instruments. I would urge you call the admissions offices of several schools and see what they think. My guess is that they will tell you they want students to concentrate in one area, in your son's case either piano or jazz, but I think there is enough cross over that even if he majors in one area he could minor in the other. </p>
<p>thzxcyl - thank you for your comments. We were very surprised when he got invited to be interviewed for the scholarship and did not really expect him to get it. The letter he got telling him he had not been selected also told him that he had been awarded a 1/2 tuition scholarship, which is quite nice. Rochester is really his 2nd choice but he hasn't heard anything from any of his other schools so we are in wait and see mode. If he gets accepted and a decent FA package to Swarthmore, I think it is likely he will go there.</p>