<p>Hello all--Is anyone aware of a ranking of undergraduate nursing programs?</p>
<p>Nope. We have to do the hard work ourselves, based on researching NCLEX pass rates, facilities, hospital affiliations for clinicals, competitiveness of admissions, etc. You can look at the nursing grad school ratings, but they are reportedly weighted very heavily by research funding. </p>
<p>If you ask questions of medical practitioners in the area where you intend to practice nursing, certain schools in that area will come up over & over again. </p>
<p>If a school isn’t where you want to live, it may not be as good as a lesser known school that has connections with the hospitals where you would want to work. If a school’s curriculum has courses that you know will be tough, that program might not be as good for you as one with some different classes (if you want to go to grad school after getting nursing experience, you’ll want to consider where your GPA would be high). If you hate the atmosphere of a school when you visit or its facilities feel out-dated, you might want to go somewhere else. If a school constantly changes its curriculum or you discover it has weed out classes, you might not want to go there. If a school is really expensive, you may choose to get your BSN elsewhere to save money for grad school or to reduce loans. And that’s in addition to the hard choice of a 0-4 program or a 2+2 school. </p>
<p>My kid started her research by drawing a circle on a map for her acceptable distance from home. She then researched all of the BSN programs within that circle that fed students into the NCLEX. She eliminated the 2+2 programs, the nursing programs on probation, and the ones wih marginal NCLEX ratings for more than 1 year. There were a few that she eliminated based on size or because their admissions profiles were either too low or too high (keeping in mind that the SATs and GPAs for the nursing programs are usually higher than for freshmen generally since nursing programs are more competitive). We then started the college visit process.</p>
<p>She asked nursing students at each school to tell her the best and the worst things about their schools. After a few visits she learned enough to ask comparative questions. For example, she was able to compare lab technologies and simulcrums (were they shared by students in other majors, are they available for practice outside of class hours, etc.). She looked at courses and electives. It didn’t take long for her to figure out which schools were fits, and which ones wouldn’t be good choices. The one she picked at the end of the day wasn’t in her top 5 going into the process, so it ended up being a surprise to both of us.</p>
<p>Neonzeus: That is some of the best advice I have seen on this website. You are a Greek God.</p>
<p>To reinforce a couple points: Don’t worry about the overall prestige of the college. What matters is the quality of the nursing program. It actually may be better to go to a college where the admissions are not extremely competitive for the general population, so you are not taking classes with ultracompetitive pre-meds. If your non-nursing classes are not extremely diffficult and competitive, it makes it easier to handle the nursing workload. </p>
<p>Also, if you aim for a college that is one tier lower in admissions competitiveness than you normally would aim towards, you will greatly increase your chances for merit aid.</p>
<p>Don’t waste money on an extremely expensive private college for nursing. There are plenty of affordable and mid-priced schools with quality nursing programs. </p>
<p>Try to avoid colleges that are so expensive that you will need to work during the school year. You may have difficulty handling the college workload if you have to work.</p>
<p>You only forgot one thing Neonzeus: a good plug for the big D!
That school deserves the praise.</p>
<p>Yikes - thanks so much! Hard to believe my nursing kid is a Junior, since this process seems like it happened yesterday. </p>
<p>Her only complaint about nursing school is that she wants more & more clinicals. If she gets assigned to neurology, she worries about missing ob/gyn. If she gets assigned to oncology, she worries about what she would have learned on orthopedics. She lives and breathes nursing now, from 5:00 am (when she gets up to go to her clinicals) to midnight (when she and her roommate finally crash after studying pharmacology). I bet she’ll sleep through Christmas break.</p>
<p>She says that she no longer has any time to participate in school social activities as a Junior. She also has mentioned that all of her friends are now calling her with their medical questions…it’s started!</p>
<p>Thank heavens she loves nursing.</p>
<p>I have visited many colleges and tried to review the nursing programs my D has applied to and EVERYTHING you shared is true, EXCEPT that we still feel unsure of how to pick the right school. You would think after visiting that many schools, there would have been a favorite! I know so much about nursing school now, that I am actually so invested in the “happy outcome”, that I am losing sleep. We applied to 10+ schools, thinking we could narrow it down when the merit aid comes in. Using the strategy to apply to a school in the lower tier from my D’s scores and good merit aid is coming in! BUT…we still haven’t been able to choose as the offers are not all here (and won’t be for a bit). Maybe we should have reached higher? We won’t throw darts at a map, but we did jokingly consider it! UGH… Thanks for your post…Of course…I am very curious where your D is so happy! I would PM you, but I am not enough of a “CC user” to have that privilege. I will be happy to share my experiences with anyone. I am glad we started last fall in our search!</p>
<p>I agree with all the excellent suggestions presented on this thread. IMHO overall you need to look for a Nursing Program that has unsanctioned accreditation, provides good clinicals, has a high NCLEX pass rate, and one you can afford, especially if you plan on going to Grad School. I also feel that once these things are addressed that the quality of Nursing Education you will receive is more highly correlated with the effort you put into it, as compared to the “ranking” of the Program. I know of students who attended highly “ranked” Nursing Programs (one was Penn), did not really apply themselves, were able to graduate, but struggled to pass the NCLEX exam. I know many students who worked their tails off and obtained Associate Degrees in Nursing, and had no problem passing the NCLEX exam. The NCLEX exam does not care where you went to school.</p>
<p>I can also support this perspective as well by my D’s experience. She graduated with her BSN in 2010. She worked her tail off and did very well. As a result of this she passed the NCLEX exam on her her first try (with the minimal questions required) and was able to land a highly competitve entry level RN position at Cornell Presbyterian Medical Center in NYC on one of Cornell’s ICU units. Other new Nursing Grads hired along with her included individuals who graduated from such prestigious Nursing Programs as Penn, BC, NYU, and UConn (to name a few). She found that the Nursing Education she received at her college was at least equal to, and in some ares even exceeded, that received by the Nurses from these other highly “ranked” schools. She subsequently was one of the first from this grouping of students that passed the CCRN exam (Critical Care RN exam-makes the NCLEX exam look like a grade school exam when you compare them) and ended up supervising RN’s who graduated from these other schools. She also was accepted by Penn for Nursing Grad School. So I feel her experiences support the perspective that a student’s motivation and the degree they apply themselves is more important than the “ranking” of the School in obtaining the finest nursing education possible (assuming the other parameters I mentioned above are met).</p>
<p>Marybee333: It is difficult to provide you with any additional criteria to utilize in helping your D to choose the “right” Nursing Program for her. She is lucky if she is accepted by a number of Nursing Programs. Based upon my comments above the only suggestion that I have is that your D would probably do better at a Program where she feels she “fits in” with as compared to electing to attend another Program based solely on a Program’s “rank”. I know this is largely subjective in nature but I suspect that once your D has all the info she needs (i.e. merit offers, etc.) that she should be able to narrow down the choices significantly(combined with the suggestions from the previous posts on this thread). This is at least what happened to my D in making her decision. She decided to attend the University of Delaware and feels she received an excellent Nursing Education there. Best wishes to your D in making her decision.</p>
<p>Marybee: </p>
<p>For most colleges you can wait until May 1 to make a decision. That provides time to attend the accepted student day events, do an overnight stay, etc. However, I’ve seen 2 colleges where they said the May 1 date only was for acceptance to the college, and if you wanted a place in the nursing program, you needed to put down a deposit ASAP. </p>
<p>If everything else is equal, a student should choose a college that is close to where they think they will want to work.</p>
<p>Thank you everyone for your help and support! At least I know that I am not the only person who has done the research and found it hard to compare everything for BSN progams. Sometimes, it is hard to actually visit the actual nursing departments and see the simulation labs unless there is a special nursing open house (maybe once a semester, or once per year) and we could not always attend. I do not know if this is really true, but it seemed to me… after several visits, that the nursing programs were not as well represented at some colleges because they do not have to recruit due to demand for nursing spaces and lack of nursing professors to teach classes, let alone speak with applicants. And the nursing departments are usually small. The schools that were eager to meet with prospective nursing students stood out. We actually visited a special open house at SUNY Brockport and I called specifically to make sure we could tour the nursing department and simulation labs and meet nursing professors. They advised there would be tables set up with nursing program information and faculty at a certain time. When we arrived, there was no nursing table and no tours. They did one short presentation at another building which we missed. When we spoke to someone from the nursing department after explaining we specifically came to see the nursing program, she said…well…you missed it and turned away. SUNY Brockport was a safety school for us and after that, we didn’t bother to apply. Could have been an off day, but having called to double check the day before and to have been given incorrect info, made us cross the school off our list. We did meet the Dean of a few nursing programs and felt very fortunate when we actually spoke to nursing professors and students. If anyone is reading this, and is applying for the Fall of 2014, my suggestion would be to just make interview appointments at every college NOW and request a meeting with a nursing faculty and just walk around the campus on any tour to get a feel for the campus life. This was the first time doing this college process and I am very tired and anxious. I only wish I found this site sooner.</p>
<p>What schools do you recommend as generally “lower tier” and what are the range of stats for admissions to nursing programs? Do SAT scores matter greatly, or do they consider college credits already complete (3.7 in college courses, high school gpa 3.3 and SAT does not demonstrate ability - have tried to retake, isn’t representative of my proven success in college courses, including nursing courses - do college admissions look at this - still a high school student).</p>
<p>There are hundreds of 4 yr. BSN Programs so it is difficult to answer your first question without knowing what area of the country you are interested in going to school. If you look at college web site stats for past admitted students stats you probably have to increase the numbers by 15 to 20% to get a more accurate picture of the stats for students admitted to nursing at the college. There is no simple answer to your last question. Some schools screen applicants by their SAT/ACT scores (often large schools that get a high number of applicants). Other colleges place a greater emphasis on HS rigor of classes and grades in advanced courses (Honors, AP, and college courses). You should be able to find out what emphasis various schools place on these factors by viewing the admission web sites of the schools. Some (at least) will clearly state which of these two factors they give greater emphasis to-some may indicate that they give equal emphasis to both. It varies by school. I’m sorry I could not give you more definitive answers to your questions. Best of luck to you.</p>
<p>Spring: If you are better at science than math, definitely take the ACT. My daughter did much better on the ACT than the SAT.</p>
<p>Neonzeus- I just finished writing you a lVERY ong personal message in “reply” to your PM. After submitting it, I was advised that I do not have that privilege, even though I used the link that was sent to me. Not only that…but my entire long letter is gone forever. I would love to respond to your kind PM, but I am not sure how to do so. Thanks!</p>
<p>MWallenmd - Thank you also for your encouraging words and sound advice. I know that we did the best search we could with the limited experience and time we had, so now we just “turn it over” and wait to be guided to the best “fit”.</p>
<p>neonzeus- I rewrote my letter and would send it to you, but I am not sure how to do so.</p>
<p>I think there is one other issue that I think Nursing Program applicants should keep in mind when choosing which Nursing Program to attend. It relates to the fact that the Nursing Discipline has been evolving over the last 5-10 years to establish itself as a distinct Healthcare Discipline separate from its historical position as a subdivision of the Medical Discipline. In order to progress in this endeavor quality Nursing Programs have begun to make changes in their curriculums to support this evolution with educational programs focusing much more on things like critical thinking/clinical decision making; differential diagnosis; the development of leadership skillls; research; and the identification and evaluation of Nursing Best Practices and Standards of Care. To appropriately teach these things a degree of didactic training is required so that these concepts can be best applied in clinical settings (where they can be integrated with clinical training for maximal educational benefit). Many applicants tend to have the belief that Nursing Programs that provide early entry into clinical experiences and have larger number of total clinical hours are “better” Programs. This might not necessarily be the case as it does take some time to provide the needed didactic training in the areas noted above. “On the job” training (without adequate preparation) is not usually the most efficacious way to teach/learn something. The best approach is a progressive and well planned curriculum that provides progressive involvement in clinical training once a student has been taught and learned, at least to an initial degree, the basic concepts noted above. This will allow for a maximal educational experience. IMHO Nursing Program applicants should aspire to attend a Program whose curriculum is designed as such.</p>