*RANT*Feeling Disillusioned, Cheated, and Hopeless

Applying to College
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<p>Hey everyone. If you guys are easily offended or annoyed by rants than you don't have to read this.</p>

<p>So here's the thing. I feel....honestly....like ***** right now. I app'ed to many schools, and I got rejected by all my privates (Save 1 where I was waitlisted), even my safeties! I only got into UC's, but even at Cal I was a spring admit, which honestly feels like a slap in the face. I'm really angry and hopeless right now....I KNOW....many of you will probably say "There are people who would kill to be in your position," but honestly, I'm not one of them, so that really doesn't help me.</p>

<p>I've always wanted to go into the sciences and be one of the greats. Discover something really unique or groundbreaking. Now, I feel like crap because honestly, looking at all the truly revolutionary scientists of the past...they all seem to have gone to the very best schools in their countries.</p>

<p>Einstein: ETH
Newton: Cambridge
Hawking: Oxford and Cambridge
Feynman: MIT and Princeton
Oppenheimer: Harvard</p>

<p>etc...</p>

<p>Yes, I know you're going to say that its up to me, and that the school doesn't make the individual, but just looking at this track record makes me dejected, knowing I won't ever be in their ranks. And even if college is what I make of it, I'm REALLY REALLY worried about going to Berkeley. </p>

<p>I'll be honest, I don't know a great deal of what it takes for grad school, but from what I've heard it takes a lot of research experience to get into the top programs. How am I going to do that at a public school as competitive as Cal? So many undergrads....not enough research positions? This is precisely why I wanted to go to Princeton or MIT or Caltech etc..., b/c I could have the personal attention and the support necessary to thrive- something I think I'll be lacking at Berkeley. Plus, we've all heard about the private school grade inflation deal. You might call it selfish that I'm angry that I have to work harder at cutthroat Cal, but I honestly feel cheated that I have to work so much harder than people at the best privates, and yet when I graduate get much less recognition. Anyone else feel the same?</p>

<p>I feel like not even going to college anymore. I mean, I know I'll probably end up going, but my drive for the moment is totally dead. I ditched the last few days of school, just coming today cos i had an AP chem test, but life in general just sucks. I feel like everything I worked for was for nothing...and the adcoms didn't see that. I go to a relatively affluent public high school, but I myself am from a much harsher background. I've watched the kids around me enjoy a carefree life (I even heard people say things like "I just have to survive until I get my inheritance, and then I'm home free) while I've had to work my a** off knowing that if I didn't, I had nothing to fall back on like all these people.</p>

<p>And in the end, just as much as I wanted to great opportunities and education that come with schools like the ones I mentioned, I wanted to experience too. I wanted the "Harvard" or "Princeton" EXPERIENCE. In high school very few people seem to actually care. So many people here are grade-grubbers, cut-throat competitive, and just not at all friendly or interested in learning. Even my AP English classes are filled with people who never contribute to our discussions but rather just do the required essays/work/w.e. People will sabotage you to make themselves look better in front of teachers, or to get better grades on an assignment, or to create an easier curve. It was in college I was hoping to find an escape from all this. The seminars at Princeton are a perfect example. To me, it seems like going to a place like that just fosters a more intellectual atmosphere where people can enjoy learning and have opportunities that they just wouldn't have elsewhere. How's it going to be at Cal? I have friends there who say its just high school all over again. With such huge classes, mad grade deflation, and insane competition, I really doubt it fosters a cooperative atmosphere. I really wanted to get out of state, to break free of the life I've had to lead, and to experience something truly new and wondrous. It seems that my entire life I've been led to believe that my intelligence would give me opportunties and take me places....but it seems its just taken me an hour away, to a bigger, more competitive, and drearier place. What am I going to do?</p>

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<p>A lot of people are in your position feeling all their hard work have gone to waste . . . well live and learn. In life, the hardest working are not always the most successful. Work smarter, not harder</p>

<p>And if you really have talent and genius, then it will pour out and show no matter where you go. Trust me, if you have what it takes professors will recognize you.</p>

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<p>It was a lot easier to get into great schools back when Oppenheimer and such were going to school...</p>

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<p>who is Feynman? was he that crazy guy from A Beautiful Mind?</p>

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<p>Go to Berkeley as a Spring admit. Take 8 months off to travel or work or volunteer!</p>

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<p>the guy in A Beautiful Mind is John Nash</p>

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<p>your post is funny because i'm in the exact same position. I was rejected by all my private schools except for a waitlist by Harvey Mudd. the only difference is that I'm not a spring admit to Berkeley. </p>

<p>i believe that you're expectations were too high and you should have looked at yourself and your goals realistically. being a spring admit means you are at the bottom end of the Berkeley admit pool, and so how could you expect to get into MIT or Caltech.</p>

<p>i try not to think about my private school rejections too much. it might actually be a blessing in disguise because i've heard countless stories of even more exceptional people than you get burnt out at places like Harvard and MIT, and because of the rigorous competition and course work, they end up going to a mediocre grad school like Davis. </p>

<p>i believe it is better to excel as an undergrad at berkeley, and then get admitted to whatever grad school you want, than have to go through torture at harvard as an undergrad, barely make it alive, and then go to a mediocre grad school. </p>

<p>it's not the end, the whole process starts again and you could end up at a great school four years from now.</p>

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<p>^ I think that's exactly what he didn't want to hear. </p>

<p>I know how you feel. I really really wanted to go to a top school as well (pomona, specifically) and i feel like i won't have the same experience or education without it. I thought i was qualified to get in there, but i guess not. I did get accepted into BU, BC honors, and CMU, and everyone gives me death glares when I complain about goingn there, but it's just not what i wanted to do with my next four years. </p>

<p>so yeah, i feel you. Sorry, that was terribly unhelpful.</p>

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<p>Look, Princeton, MIT, Caltech are wonderful schools. They're also reaches for everyone except the Intel Science winner. And I agree with you that the UC schools can be large/impersonal, and I'm a proud UC grad. </p>

<p>That said, and knowing that what you've written comes out of anger and resentment at what events have handed you, there's still something else to be said in reply. It's about taking responsibility for your actions, for your life. MIT/Caltech/Princeton and the other elites do not have the monopoly on the good college experience, small classes and seminars, on undergrad accessibility to research, on the intellectual atmosphere. You can find it at a lot of other schools if you do a little digging. And with the PhD glut the profs are from the top schools, not some backwater U. Maybe not all of them are the household names like the ones you mentioned, but then the chances of being accepted are a lot higher too. Had you devoted more time to finding matches and safeties that you really WANTED to attend the outcome could have been much different.</p>

<p>There is some good that can come out of your experience, if you find yourself in an altruistic mode next fall. Post this again with some advice to next year's kids to find safeties and matches that are right for them.</p>

<p>
[quote]
You might call it selfish that I'm angry that I have to work harder at cutthroat Cal, but I honestly feel cheated that I have to work so much harder than people at the best privates, and yet when I graduate get much less recognition.

[/quote]
You have misunderstood the undergrad experience at schools like MIT or Caltech. The kids there work harder than anyone I know. See, for example, a blog by a current MIT student who writes
[quote]
Hard work is a virtue at MIT. In fact, I don't think I'd be exaggerating if I said hard work is the virtue at MIT. MIT is often said to be more egalitarian than our peer institutions; students here are less impressed by your granddaddy's yacht than we are by people who take 100 units in one term. (Sidenote, for reference: "normal" courseload is 48 units, and one unit is supposed to equal one hour per week spent on the class. 100 units is absurd and awe-inspiring.) The blog is at <a href="http://mollie.mitblogs.com/archives/mit/index.html%5B/url%5D%5B/quote%5D"&gt;http://mollie.mitblogs.com/archives/mit/index.html

[/quote]
</a></p>

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<p>Since when do all the great scientists go only to top schools? James Watson, Nobel laureate and co-discoverer of the structure of DNA earned his doctorate at Indiana U. Linus Pauling, perhaps the greatest chemist who ever lived and the only winner of two unshared Nobel prizes got his education at Oregon State. </p>

<p>And do you know what the Spring admit means? It means they WANTED you. They worked out way to make space for you. I know a girl who enrolled Spring semester and had the same great experience as everyone else. They didn't stamp "Spring Admit" on her forehead nor on her diploma.</p>

<p>You think you can't hit the bigtime coming out of Berkeley? Check out this list:</p>

<p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_University_of_California%2C_Berkeley_alumni#Nobel_laureates%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_University_of_California%2C_Berkeley_alumni#Nobel_laureates&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>It's all good!</p>

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<p>You realize all these scientists harken from the old days when there were far fewer colleges and universities, right?</p>

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<p>Gee, so you're not the next Einstein. Boohoo.</p>

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<p>I'd say take a year off and try again for your top school, but next time apply to some less competitive privates. Also, saying that being a sping admit to Cal is a slap in the face is pretty cruel to the people that are excited about being admitted, spring or otherwise, and makes you look pretty arrogant. You should feel lucky you even got in. You were obviously very close to not getting in.</p>

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<p>Man, if I had a dime for every time someone got into Berkeley and complained I'd be really, really, really poor. And you want to go into science? What is wrong with you? No, I'm kidding. You obviously should have applied to more safeties, but no matter. You can always transfer. It sucks that you're a spring admit, but at least you're in, which few people can say. Everything happens for a reason (I know how frustrating it sounds); maybe Berkeley is the right place for you. Who knows? Just give it a shot and go in there with a positive attitude. You'll be surprised.</p>

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<p>"Gee, so you're not the next Einstein. Boohoo."</p>

<p>LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLLOLOLOLOL</p>

<p>that is all.</p>

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<p>Okay, let's take a look at some of the other ground-breaking mathematicians and physicists of our time.</p>

<p>Donald Knuth-Case Western
John Nash-Carnegie Mellon (then Carnegie Institute of Technolgy)
Julian Schwinger, who shared the Nobel Prize for Physics with Feynman-CUNY, then Columbia</p>

<p>You're using a data pool that just has far too many outliers. Oppenheimer was allowed to enter Harvard at some ridiculously young age like 15 because he was just too brilliant. Feynman won the New York City math competition before MIT-which is kind of the equivalent of winning the USAMO now. The short of it is that these people would have been stars anywhere. They gild Harvard and MIT's lilies rather than the other way around. Also, there were much smaller applicant pools and admissions was far more of a meritocracy back then than it is now. Different universities were more prestigious as well. Back then, CUNY was more prestigious than Columbia. Imagine that.</p>

<p>What will hold you back from becoming a great physicist is not your Berkeley degree, which will come from one of the most renowned physics departments in the world, but your incredibly shallow and defeatist attitude. Although a lot of these people hold glitzy degrees, they are largely self-taught. They made it to legend status because of hard work, determination and ingenuity. Nothing could hold them back. Read Feynman's biographies and see how he never let anything become an obstacle. I know that it totally sucks to be rejected. It hurts and it feels like you've been judged on no real basis. It's fine to be down for a few days over the inherent unfairness and randomness that plagues college admissions. But if you feel that BERKELEY isn't going to hold you back, most physicists would tell you to get your head examined. </p>

<p>I also disagree with the poster below who said that it's better to go to Berkeley for undergrad than MIT or Harvard because of rigor. MIT and CalTech are known for having two of the most rigorous physics programs in the country but Harvard most certainly is not. Their honors physics track has fewer requirements than the minimal requirements to receive an SB from MIT in physics. If the OP is worried about rigor, Berkeley will provide that and and the opportunity to work with many of the best physicists in the country. A strong physics undergrad at Berkeley will also make you extremely attractive to any grad school in the country, maybe even Berkeley grad if you're lucky! You will have to work hard everywhere. Just know that at Berkeley, the dividends will be just as big as HMC or bigger.</p>

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<p>Here are some quotes:</p>

<p>"If you got it, you got it. If you don't, you don't."</p>

<p>"Man, if you have to ask, you ain't never gonna know."</p>

<p>So, regardless of where you go to school, if you're a physics genius and destined to win the nobel prize, you probably will (or get close to it, at least).</p>

<p>However, the nobel isn't exactly all about merit...there's a lot of politics involved in selecting the winner each year. So if a great scientist doesn't win the nobel, it's not a reflection of their (lack of) accomplishments.</p>

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<p>dude. i didnt get into any of the schools that i seriously applied to. including a state school thats incredibly easy to get into. but instead of being down (which of course i was) im looking to the future and coming up w/ a plan next year. w/ positivity im bound to do well next year and transfer. just take a deep breath. who knows maybe you'll be taken off of the waitlist...if not there are more things in life to stress over.</p>

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<p>FYI, there was a time when what it took to get in Harvard was knowing how to conjugate Latin and Greek verbs;)</p>

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<p>Thanks for the replies everyone. Yea, it was rant mikemac, but I thank everyone for being so kind. I honestly thought I was going to get flamed a bit more. hehe, but everyone has been so nice.</p>

<p>Mikemac- I was referring to the grade inflation at Harvard. From what I hear, at schools like Harvard most of the students easily pull A's. I agree that MIT and Caltech are a bit different, but they seem to have one big thing that Cal doesn't- support. As sakky always points out in the Berkeley forums, @ MIT and Caltech, if you fall behind there will be people to help you out. The system is designed to give every student the necessary opportunities to succeed. Both MIT and Caltech for example have the concept of shadow grades, where failing grades aren't reported on the transcript, and MIT grades freshman on a P/NP basis to help them transition. MIT also allows "exploratory" courses, which basically allow you to take a class and then decide to take it P/NP. Cal on the other hand has none of this, and that is what scares me. If you fall behind at Cal, no one cares, and no one will go out of their way to help you. The fact that average engineering GPA's fall below 3.0 should be ample evidence of this.</p>

<p>Whatiscollege and GS- So UCLA Honors vs. Cal spring means I'm not qualified? (I'm not disagreeing, just asking cos I thought it was kinda weird) On the website they said the spring thing had nothing to do with my academic qualifications? <em>sigh</em> maybe i just wanted to believe that. I did suspect that wasn't exactly true....I mean, they probably don't just randomly assign spring admits, right? arghh...that just makes me feel even worse that I <em>barely</em> got into Cal.</p>

<p>On a tangent- for spring admits does anyone know how the housing thing works? I have some friends going in the fall...am I allowed to room with them? I'd really like to be in a building with friends instead of a triple w/ ppl I've never met. Anyone have an idea how to go about this? Do I just have to request a specific roomate?</p>

<p>MichWoman- I really appreciate your comments, I do. I did see a post of yours the other day though (I can't find it atm) where I believe you were saying how these days it was such an advantage to go to a "name brand" school, and that it would provide you with connections later on? I think this was the gist, correct me if I'm wrong (I very well could be, since I can't seem to find the post, heh. Imagining things? :)) I can't shake the feeling that from now on whenever I meet someone from Stanford or MIT or Caltech etc...I'm going to have this feeling that "This person made it and I didn't, and therefore they are better than me". Forever. And I really would rather not feel that way. Also, you say doing well at Cal will make me really attractive to grad schools...but again, isn't it much harder to succeed at Cal than it is at grade inflated private schools? Besides, whose going to look more attractive, me or the Stanford undergrad?</p>

<p>I guess I've accepted that I'm going to Cal, and I'm getting a bit more excited about it.</p>