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<p>And yet that’s how taxes work. Funny.</p>
<p>Go government basics!</p>
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<p>No it would not. The purpose of the government is not to establish morality for the people—that is the purpose of the Church/religion. As we live in a society where there is separation of church and state, the government should not be establishing morality for the people. Certain crimes, such as murder, are illegal because the government’s job is to establish order in society. With crimes such as murder, thievery, etc legal, there would be no order. THAT is why you cannot go off and murder your brother. Murdering your brother does more than simply affect you; it affects your parents, it sets a precedent that murder is okay. It is NOT a moral issue.</p>
<p>Abortion does not affect order in our society. It is a private issue. Therefore, it is a personal issue. The government does not get to play “Church” or establish moral standards for individuals; it establishes laws to prevent disorder.</p>
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<p>The key difference is that this law is saying “people who want healthcare should be able to get it without paying for it”.</p>
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<p>That’s not how insurance is supposed to work. How insurance works is you pay a company to take on a risk for you, because your would rather pay a small amount than risk having to pay a very large amount. If, on the other hand, you have savings and/or do not use health care services as much as the average person does, then there is no reason why an insurance company should be able to force you to buy their service.</p>
<p>It would be like a car mechanic coming to your house and giving your car a tune-up, oil change, and new tires and expecting you to pay full price, even though you know a guy who will do a tune-up for less, you can change your own oil, and you are willing to push your current tires for a few more months.</p>
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<p>So, if I privately kill my little brother, with my parents’ consent, and don’t tell anybody, then that is ok? Because that wouldn’t affect order in our society either.</p>
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<p>I’m fully aware that the government hasn’t been within its rights for over a century. That doesn’t mean I won’t try to keep it from getting worse.</p>
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<p>And it doesn’t mean the guy on the street yelling for a proletarian revolution is going to stop trying either. But people really don’t care.</p>
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<p>It doesn’t say that. They have to pay for insurance; that’s the whole point of the provision you say allows the insurance company to rob consumers.</p>
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<p>It is indeed how insurance works - the point is to pool risk. A bunch of people take out individual plans and pay into a communal pot. When one person gets needs a payment, instead of being responsible for the full payment, it comes out of the communal pot. No insurance company can force you to buy their service. The government can make you buy someone’s service.</p>
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<p>No, it’s not.</p>
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<p>Apparently enough of them care to swing this year’s elections massively to the right.</p>
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<p>Insurance =/= healthcare. If people who use more healthcare pay the same price as people who use much less, then that’s the same as them getting it without paying for it.</p>
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<p>What you are describing is a non profit co-op, most of which are now illegal.</p>
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<p>I see no reason why it should be allowed to. If I would rather pay for minimal coverage and live a healthy life, I should be allowed to do so. And if I would rather risk my health to save money for college, I should be allowed to do that also.</p>
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<p>It is very much like that. I suppose the exact analogy would be if everyone was required to buy a service plan that covered all of the above things, even if they can get a much better deal by doing work themselves/shopping around/going without repairs.</p>
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<p>Well, if you didn’t tell anybody and no one ever found out—the government wouldn’t be able to punish you, now would they? That is a moral dilemma of your own. Of course all of us know how wrong it would be because we all have morals. However, this knowledge is from our own personal culture and the way we were raised. It is not a result of the government.</p>
<p>If the government were to find out, they would have to take action. Allowing such a thing to pass is setting a precedent that such behavior is acceptable.</p>
<p>… Well, ok then. From my point of view it’s the government’s job to “protect innocent lives”, not “preserve order”, and the reason murder is a crime is that it ends a precious human life, not that it’s disorderly.</p>
<p>Mosby- Pro-choice is not Pro-death. The brother killing example is completely irrelevant because nobody does that therefore it is neither comparable to anything nor a relevant issue. Your morals are your morals but you have no right to push them on anyone else. Abortion is not considered murder in this country so you should not use the two terms interchangeably.</p>
<p>Abortion is murder (or at least manslaughter, since many people don’t realize what they are doing/are under extenuating circumstances) as best as I can understand it. Obviously I know that many other people in this country think differently: that is the problem that I am trying to solve.</p>
<p>Since, as best as I can tell, allowing abortion is allowing the mass death of human beings, I will do everything I can to have it recognized as such and given the same legal status as killing a born human.</p>
<p>Since I am a law-abiding citizen, I won’t go out and bomb abortion clinics, but instead will try to convince people with words.</p>
<p>In YOUR opinion, based on a religious factor.</p>
<p>It’s not like leaving the option just means whenever you get pregnant you’re just going to have an abortion, that’s just ■■■■■■■■.</p>
<p>And you can’t outlaw all abortions. That’s ■■■■■■■■.</p>
<p>At the end of the day you’re simply trying to push your morals on everyone else and you have no right to do that.
If you think it is a problem that people think differently than you, you’re in for a rude awakening in the coming years.</p>
<p>^^ It’s not based on a religious factor, other than the idea that human life is sacred (which is shared by pretty much all religions).</p>
<p>It’s based on the belief that an unborn human is still a human.</p>
<p>I don’t advocate outlawing all abortions. I just argue that an abortion should be considered with the same weight as killing a born human. Sometimes hard choices have to be made, like when one of a pair of conjoined twins must be killed or they will both die.</p>
<p>My views on abortion is that it should never be allowed simply as birth control. If the life of the mother is in danger, then you have to make a hard choice. I don’t pass judgement on cases of rape and incest because neither me nor those close to me have ever been in that situation so I cannot know whether it is enough to justify an abortion.</p>
<p>@jkauf: I do not understand how I am forcing my morals on other people.</p>
<p>Forcing my morals on others would be if I went up to you and said “become pro-life or else”.</p>
<p>What I am saying is “become pro-life because it is true”.</p>
<p>You are saying that I should just accept your view and shut up, because apparently according to your morals no one should be allowed to voice a different belief.</p>
<p>The problem is, I at least, do not consider murder=abortion.</p>
<p>Of course, murdering your brother is a heinous act that is completely unacceptable and deserving of punishment. Abortion, on the other hand, is not black and white.</p>
<p>At the same time, it’s not to say I’m “pro-abortion”. I’m not saying you should go out and have abortions just to prove a point or that even I, personally, would choose an abortion. However, I do not believe that the government has a right to tell me that I cannot choose to have an abortion, if I so wish. I do not believe that what a woman chooses to do with her own body should be regulated by the government.</p>
<p>Personally, however horrible this is, I do not consider having an abortion to be grossly immoral and I would not judge others if they choose such a path. I have my own reservations about abortion for myself, but they are similar to my opinion about smoking— I do not smoke personally, but I would not judge others for doing so if they so wish.</p>
<p>You are forcing your morals on everyone else because you think it should be illegal to have an abortion. If that were so, people that don’t morally have a problem with it would still not be allowed to have an abortion. It’s very simple.</p>
<p>^^ And that is your belief, which you are theoretically entitled to in this country. But I’m also allowed to disagree and to try to convince you to change your mind.</p>
<p>^^ But it’s ok to outlaw infanticide, even if some people don’t think anyone under 3 years old is human?</p>