Russian Educational System and U.S. Colleges

<p>Dear posters,
I'd like to create this thread to help each other, who is from the former USSR.
So, my first question: how well is russian educational system understood by american top schools?</p>

<p>Just saying privet! ;)</p>

<p>Don't know about how well the educational systen is understood but my guess is they know it well enough.</p>

<p>Privet Ria! </p>

<p>Why do you speak Russian, Ria? Isn't you immigrant or not?</p>

<p>I was born in Russia But my dad is Swedish and I live in Sweden now... :)</p>

<p>I just want to add that I believe it was wrong to edit the title. Why can there be a Indian post and a Canadian post but the Russian one gets changed into Russian Educational System and U.S. Colleges?</p>

<p>Diskriminacia eh? :p</p>

<p>Stardragon: What do you mean by "understood"? Do they understand how people are taught in Russia or something else?</p>

<p>My guess from the experience of applying to quite a decent number of American schools is that "it depends". If your are applying and are worried whether they'll be able to give the full value to your achievements, just e-mail the admission committee and ask how comfortable they are with Russian Transcripts. For example, Yale is very good at that. But other schools (probably those, who had never had a student from Russia) might ask you to send an explanation of our fabulous educational system.</p>

<p>Yes, editing the tite is wrong.
When I said understood I meant not to how many classes we study, what kind of curriculum and etc. But I meant the situation behind official system. For example, although I have oficially only one accelerated course Informatics, I also have extracurricular unofficial courses in Math, Biology, Geography, Englishand so on. It can be considered as an enriched courses, so-called "uglublennie". </p>

<p>Another point - Olympiad. I think (may be I'm wrong?) in America Olympiad is not very famous award, and not very prestigious. But in Russia it's one of the main extracurricular accomplishment. I have many regional victories and some state ones. Maybe they will be taken into account, but not so much as in Russia, here victory in the state olympiad lets to be admitted without any exams in any university of this state, and with great chances to enter such univs as MSU and other.</p>

<p>In Russia, to take recs from the teachers and counselors(who doesn't exist in Russia) is a rather hard task. They will think I'm a traitor if I apply to USA.</p>

<p>Manyzhka: Znachit moi transcript budet takov:
1) 9-klassnii attestat s pod****im perevodom. Neuzheli original?
2) vipiska ocenok za 9-11 klass s perevodom.
A transcript v tom vide, v kakom delaut ego amerikanci posilat' ne nado?
Naschet Gpa, ti vischitivala gpa za 9-11? vkluchala li chetvertnie ocenki?</p>

<p>Stardragon,
1) Bozhe ypasi original - ti chto? Kopija, konechno. Ti zhe ne v odin universitet sobiraesh'sya podavat', ili?
A v kakom vide delajut ego Amerikanci?? Ya ponyatija ne imeju. Ne zamorachivajsya s etim. Sdelaj tablicy v Excel gde stolbci budut 9,10,11 c chetvertyami/ polygodujami, a stroki s predmetami i vse. Naschet moego GPA, ummmm - ya nichego ne vischitivala, potomy chto y menya nachinaja s 9 klassa vse bili 5:) DA! Ne zabud' ykazat' (ili poprosi klassnuju v rekomendacii napisat'), esli ti "pretenduesh' " na medal' - eto vazhno. </p>

<p>Also, don't worry about Olympiads - I'm pretty sure that at Yale they do know the importance of Olympiads. I wrote on my application that I participated in a bunch of Olympiads, including the one for English, where I won the first place (eto bila vse lish' rajonnaja, no ya ee vse ravno ykazala:)) And also the "school" one for Physics. I really didn't have much of that. If you do, make sure you write all of them there. You can also ask your klassnij rukovoditel' to explain the meaning of these Olympiads, becaus they're really a big deal in Russia.</p>

<p>Thank VERY much manyzhka!!</p>

<p>1) u meny v devytom klasse za chetverti mnogo chetverok, a za god odni peterki; v 10 klasse vse legche - chistie peterki vezde. Tak chto I pretenduu na zolotuu medal'.</p>

<p>2)I zanyl 1 mesto (takzhe 2, i eshe raz prosto uchactvoval) v oblastnoi Olympiade, i 8-10 pervih mest na rajonnih. Nadeus' eto mne zachtetsy.
Spasibo!</p>

<p>Instead of making a new thread - I'll just bump this one.</p>

<p>Do you think it's necessary to send all the grades from 9-11 or is the school-leaving transcript enough? The school-leaving transcript is usually the final (11th grade) exams + rounded up 10-11 grade scores. </p>

<p>9th grade is considered secondary school and the exam for it is required to get into high school, so you guys think I should include it? I got a bunch of 4's in 9th grade and mostly 5's in 10-11th, so that's why I'm asking.</p>

<p>if you have participated at any international olimpiads it is good plus for you.(maybe national).and remember that you are not a number.<br>
tell them about your personal and academical achievments as well as possible</p>

<p>Pavel - that is a hard question. Since you will be applying as an international student, the US schools cannot really regulate how your transcript should look like exactly. However, they do mention 3-4 last years of your secondary school as a requirement. On the other hand, you do not want to send the 9th grade grades if you have more 4s there than in the 10-11. To be safe - I would e-mail them asking this question. Put it like this : " Our high school is only two years, so may I send only my high school grades." Also mention the 9th grade exams (btw, if you happen to have good grades for the 9th grade exams - send only them and the issue would be resolved) " </p>

<p>Do not forget to include your EGE in the transcript.</p>

<p><a href="btw,%20if%20you%20happen%20to%20have%20good%20grades%20for%20the%209th%20grade%20exams%20-%20send%20only%20them%20and%20the%20issue%20would%20be%20resolved">quote</a>

[/quote]

Good, it's resolved then, thanks.</p>

<p>
[quote]

Do not forget to include your EGE in the transcript.

[/quote]

Pardon my ignorance, but what the heck is an EGE?</p>

<p>Did you guys/girls also mention the rigor of Russian academics compared to those in America? I'm in kind of a pickle here, cuz I went to a small school at the Russian Embassy in Bangkok. Basically, it's like a private school in Russia, except with 3-10 people in a class and it just so happens to be in Thailand. Now I know that most colleges in the U.S. have had applicants from Russia and are familiar with the system, but they might be skeptical about someone applying from Southeast Asia as a European. Plus, I studied at an accelerated pace and graduated early, which will probably be mentioned in my letters of recommendation.</p>

<p>Privet! Prijatno vstretit` nakonec liudei iz Rossii ozabochennih temi je problemami chto i ja sam!

Vo-pervih, mne interesno primet li priemnaja komisiija vo vnimanie moi shkolnii attestat zolotogo medalista bez edinoi chetvertnoi ozenki, otlichnoi ot piaterki? i kak nam, rossijanam poschitat gpa?

Nashet rekomendatelnih pisem - dolzhni li oni bit vse na angliiskom? V moei shkole tolko moja uchitelniza govorit i pishet po angliiski i ja somnevajus, chto ostalnii uchitelia i direktor u kotorih ja hochu vziat rekomendatelnii pisma sochtut moju popitki postupit v us college dostatochnim osnovaniem dlia togo chtobi im nachat uchit angliiskii...

Po povodu SAT - kto-nibud sdaval, kakie rezultati? Ja tak ponimaju chto pri postuplenii v college sopernichestvo budet idti eche i mezhdu liudmi iz odnoi strani, tak vot mnogo li russkih idet postupat v undergraduate school ili sravnitelno menshe chem kitaicev, indusov i rumin kotorih zdes na forume ochen mnogo i konkurencija u nih ochen zhestkaja?

ps Vi rasschitivaete na polnuju finansovuju pomoch? Ved pri stoimosti horochego college $35,000 rossiiskii godovoi dohod k primeru moei semii v $5,000 dostatochno nelepo vigliadit;)) Slozhno li v rossii sobrat` neobhodimii dokumenti dlia fin.aid?</p>

<p>manyzhka, ja vpechatlen tvoim postupleniem v Yale, pozdravliaju!!!
Mojech perechislit svoi rezultati SAT, extracurriculars, mojet bit u tebia bili mejdunarodnie nagradi(hotia bez nih navernoe i ne prinimajut)? Mne ochen interesno kak vigliadet russkii student v takom college.</p>

<p>
[quote]
i kak nam, rossijanam poschitat gpa?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Vce petierki = 4.0</p>

<p>
[quote]

Nashet rekomendatelnih pisem - dolzhni li oni bit vse na angliiskom? V moei shkole tolko moja uchitelniza govorit i pishet po angliiski i ja somnevajus, chto ostalnii uchitelia i direktor u kotorih ja hochu vziat rekomendatelnii pisma sochtut moju popitki postupit v us college dostatochnim osnovaniem dlia togo chtobi im nachat uchit angliiskii...

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Da, obichno hyjno original + perevod. Perevod nado cdelat y officialnogo perevodchika (dymyu ix polno).</p>

<p>
[quote]

Po povodu SAT - kto-nibud sdaval, kakie rezultati? Ja tak ponimaju chto pri postuplenii v college sopernichestvo budet idti eche i mezhdu liudmi iz odnoi strani, tak vot mnogo li russkih idet postupat v undergraduate school ili sravnitelno menshe chem kitaicev, indusov i rumin kotorih zdes na forume ochen mnogo i konkurencija u nih ochen zhestkaja?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>SAT ochen otlichaetsia ot togo chto mi ychem v shkole, tak chto nado gotovitsia i eche nado TOEFL.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Vi rasschitivaete na polnuju finansovuju pomoch?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Slojno bydet na polnyu, no nekotorie mogyt dat.</p>

<p>Dear all, I suggest that we switch to English, since there were incidents
of deleting russian-language posts....quite unfortunately</p>

<p>To Pavel: First, forget about EGE. It is a new standardized examination
system in Russia, which they most probably did not use in your school.
Second, I do not think it is possible to indicate any substantial rigor of
Russian academics. It is impossible to generaalize an idea of "academic
rigor" in any particular country - school in the US vary a lot and they do
have school that have extremely rigourous curriculum. Moreover, I do not know how it is with youur school, but in Russia that "myth" about our strong
school education is dying with the schools themselves. The problem is
especially critical "v regionah", where everything is corrupted, teachers
are old and new do not come to the schools, etc, etc, etc. Anyway...</p>

<p>To weisenheimer: Gold medal is a very good thing. It indicates that you
are in the top 1% of all school graduates in Russia in your year. You can
call it "with Honors" for the US colleges. Your GPA in the case of a gold
medal is 4.0 . (However, you should write 5.0 everywhere where you are
allowed to use your own system )
Recommmendation letters - Russian + english translation
SAT - depends on your English background. If you are a "standard" Russian
student, who went to a russian secondary school from the first to the last
grade, have never lived in the US and had little experience with the native
speakers - it will be very hard for you to prepare for SAT I Verbal. You
will need to learn app.. 3000 hard words - after that you will be fine:)
Math will be quite easy for you. Looks like ther are not so many people
applying to undergrad and even fewer of those taking SAT. (at least, definitely fewer than from many other countries) </p>

<p>Full financial aid is possible , but hard to get, because in most cases you need to get into a top school to get full finaid. The only way to determine
whether you will get it or not is to apply and see.:( Documents are not
hard to collect at all.</p>

<p>Also - thanks for the congratualtions. My SAT results are not spectacular
at all (well, for Yale, at least) so I would really prefer to not list
them here, since they are not an indicator for anything. Moreso, I never participated in any international olympiads, on the contrary my list of olympiads' achievments is really REALLY small and unimpressive. The thing about the US and the top schools is that they are looking for your personal motivation and specialness as much as for your academics. Well...i might be wrong , of course , but that's what it looks like to me. I did have a gold medal and particiapted in a couple of local university academic conferences (mind it - I am not from Moscow or St. Petersburg, so it is nothing special...) I did have some special volunteer activity, but I do not know how important that is. </p>

<p>Anyway - if you have any questions, I would be more than happy to help if I can.</p>

<p>Woah, thanks a lot for the detailed info.</p>

<p>manyzhka, thanks for your reply!</p>

<p>
[quote]
Recommmendation letters - Russian + english translation

[/quote]

should I translate them into English on my own? Did you send copies of recommendation letters or asked your teachers to use a tremendous amount of paper up? With copies, do I have to "zaveriat ih u notariusa"?</p>

<p>
[quote]
SAT - depends on your English background. If you are a "standard" Russian student, who went to a russian secondary school from the first to the last grade, have never lived in the US and had little experience with the native speakers - it will be very hard for you to prepare for SAT I Verbal.

[/quote]

well, currently i<code>ve finished my preparation with TOEFL(strange test:)), so in a couple of weeks I</code>m going to start my preparation for SAT, planning to take it in January. Few days ago I did my first SAT Test(March Test, available now for free download) just in order to know how difficult it is and I was rather surprised to score 790MAth, 680Verbal, 700-800Writing. I<code>m aiming at 2300-2350 with all that formidable heap of unexplored preparation materials dumped in the corner of my room:), do you think it</code>s enough for Ivy League or other top colleges taking into consideration that I don<code>t have spectacular EC</code>s? Do admission officers draw attention to the fact that I<code>m a foreigner and it</code>s obviously several times harder for me to score good on SAT rather than for US citizens?</p>

<p>
[quote]
Looks like ther are not so many people applying to undergrad and even fewer of those taking SAT. (at least, definitely fewer than from many other countries)

[/quote]

Sorry, I didn`t understand your thought, are you talking about Russian undergraduate students? Is it an advantage for me?</p>

<p>
[quote]
Moreso, I never participated in any international olympiads, on the contrary my list of olympiads' achievments is really REALLY small and unimpressive. The thing about the US and the top schools is that they are looking for your personal motivation and specialness as much as for your academics. Well...i might be wrong , of course , but that's what it looks like to me. I did have a gold medal and particiapted in a couple of local university academic conferences (mind it - I am not from Moscow or St. Petersburg, so it is nothing special...) I did have some special volunteer activity, but I do not know how important that is.

[/quote]

so, what do you think was your strong point responsible for your admission and how did you show personal motivation and specialness in the application?
Concerning extracurriculars, i had some volunteer work with children(teaching maths)-by the way how did you prove your vol.activity, i don<code>t have any documents proving this. At the same time, currently I</code>m a student at "mehmat"(but I won<code>t let the admission officers know about this), so we have some "kursovie raboti" which look like researches, so is it a good idea to send this my researches as my extracurricular activity in maths? I know some people send their music tapes, photographs or paintings, but is scientific research albeit without any honors a good extracurricular? Also I will mention my "igra na rossiskom fondovom rinke" with slightly adorned financial results as an extracurricular. Don</code>t you think this is not enough for top schools, or maybe I<code>m wrong in my perception of EC</code>s as the main and conclusive factor in admission process?</p>