<p>It sounds like you have an open relationship with your daughter, and you've gotten great advice here--I agree most with the people who said how important it is that she begin to establish relationships with kids at her school--if she leaves every weekend, they will move on without her. I had a college roommate one year who pined over and visited her BF all the time, or he stayed in our room--argh!</p>
<p>Last year, friend of S1's would come home to visit GF (3 hour drive) unbeknownst to both sets of parents--on a regular basis. He would go to her small college and stay there, or they would meet and stay at a mutual friend's OR a motel... Because they used cell phones to talk to parents and assure them both that they were on their respective campuses, both parents assumed all was fine. That lasted about 9 months until they broke up....</p>
<p>A deal we have with our son (that my parents had with me) is if your child leaves the town in which school is located, they owe us the courtesy of telling us. They're not asking permission, but we like to know where he is--he's thousands of miles away anyway--and he thinks this is reasonable.</p>
<p>SJTH...I also have that deal with my kids. They don't have to tell me their coming and going around their area at college. But if they go on any trips further away, such as out of state, I have to know and they do call to tell me when they arrived and when they made it back to school. Neither has ever balked at that. For that matter, one of my D's has travelled alone many times all over the other half of the world, as well as 6000 miles across this country and has called at every juncture to let us know her arrivals.</p>
<p>I'm puzzled by those who say that their kids must have a car because there is no public transportation. Surely ALL the kids in these places don't have cars? I would venture to guess that MOST of them don't have cars! </p>
<p>Unless the kid has to drive to a job in order to afford school, or has some other extraordinary circumstance that I can't envision. I can't believe that any college student really has to have a car.</p>
<p>Of course, I also think that no college kid "must" have a minifridge and a microwave, unless they have a health condition that requires instant access to specific foods.</p>
<p>When D was in high school we paid all car expenses including gas. Once she left for college, gas became her responsibility. The only exceptions to the rule are these: 1) if she comes home to see us, we fill up the car before she leaves town 2) if we go see her we sometimes fill up the car. </p>
<p>She didn't take her car freshman 1st semester which forced her to stay on campus and get acquainted with the city and traffic first, but I understand the issue of the paid for parking sticker - those can be expensive.</p>
<p>I would tell her she's <em>absolutely</em> not going to visit BF every weekend on your dime. If she decides to try, all car expenses will be on her - including any deductibles if she has an accident (another agreement we have w/D if the accident is her fault) and any fines if she gets a ticket (which we would also never pay for)!</p>
<p>I would say that the vast majority of students at my daughter's school do have cars. Probably 1/3 of students live on campus and the rest off campus. She is off campus but close enough to use a bike or walk to get around campus. To get to school from here, to go to the nearest laundromat, to pay her rent, to go to the grocery store - none of which are withing walking distance - she drives. There is literally no public transportation and the towns round here are very spread out.</p>
<p>I am from the UK originally and never had a car there - there is such a vast public transportation system which I know exists in many parts of the USA. I also could not imagine a place where I had to have a car. Then I moved here to a small midwest town - it is impossible without a car.</p>
<p>I would like to clarify myself as I was misunderstood and I can see how that could happen. </p>
<p>I mean that there is NO public transportation where we live and so we had a kids' car when they were in HS because it was very difficult getting both kids to all of their activities in a wide geographical range in our region on a daily basis and it helped to have another driver and car when they were of age. </p>
<p>My kids do NOT NEED a car at college really, nope. But we had this kids' car and so we let the older D take it after her freshman year because her younger sister then left for her college (so didn't need it at home and her college was in Manhattan and so not needed there either) and while D1 doesn't HAVE to have a car, we chose to maintain the car we already had for the kids and let her use it and there wasn't really public transportation from her college to our home and so it as good for getting her to and from school. She is about to start grad school and again, could make do without the car but it will come in handy. We already own it. The only real expense for us now is the insurance for it. She has to pay gas at school and we pay for gas for her to come home or to visit any relatives.</p>
<p>maysixxmom....like you, we paid for gas in HS as having our kids be able to drive was a big benefit to us. But in college, having a car is a privilege, so she pays for her own gas but we pay for the gas for trips home or things we want her to do. Likewise, we pay for their trains and planes to visit us on breaks or to visit one another but not for any other trips they choose to take. They pay for those trips.</p>
<p>What does amaze me is what nice cars some of these kids have. Her car is old and you have to pull a piece of string to open the hood and the trunk is held closed with bunjee cords (well it was till we fixed the lock) and her turn signal lever broke off so we stuck a piece of pvc piping in its place. She is the poor kid on the block. Her ex b/f drives a $30k new truck (but expected her drive her POS car because he was too cheap to pay for gas).</p>
<p>Blossom, that was a very wise post, and I agree with many others as well. My D is a senior and we're butting heads about having a car even before the applications are going out. In fact, selecting those schools has been thwarted by her stubborn position on staying in state with the assumption that we'd cave in on the car business. Her world needs to center on campus life, and then (down the line) we'll re-evaluate the car depending on her needs (not whims). Who knows whether the BF issue will be present when it's time to head out to school, but I can easily imagine it. So I'm reading all these responses very carefully.</p>
<p>My point was not to set off a debate about car vs no car- some families decide it's important to have in HS for many reasons, and they can afford it- so go for it. My point was that to change the rules suddenly on your daughter will be perceived by her (and rightly so, in my opinion) as manipulative. It lacks opacity in my opinion to have her driving the car you own and paid for, and insure, and presumably fix if the brakes start to go, or whatever... and then announce because you don't like her boyfriend, that you no longer intend to pay for the car. You can either afford the car/gas/associated expenses or not, and whether she's using the car to visit the BF whose living with mom, or visiting her elderly aunt who is a nun and doesn't have a car, or whatever-- it doesn't seem fair to me to decide that sometimes using the car is something you'll pay for and otherwise not, unless that was part of the deal when she got the car. (Assuming your financial situation hasn't changed.... if it has, then just sell the car!)</p>
<p>I'm all for encouraging kids to make good choices. Spending weekends exploring the campus, going to a string quartet concert that she'd never consider going to, but since the roommate is performing she'll go to be a good friend, attending poetry readings because her RA is running it-- these are all the wonderful things that happen for kids who stay at college on weekends. Her horizons will no doubt be stretched more than by having a pizza with the old BF or watching movies on his Mom's TV. My point was that perhaps your discussions with her should revolve around what she gives up by coming home every weekend, and not make this a control issue using the gas money as a club.</p>
<p>You might also consider that if the BF's financial situation changes it might put your daughter in an even more uncomfortable position. Do you want her accepting money from this guy to cover her expenses???? Do you want her feeling financially obligated to him???? Do you want this guy subsidizing your car????</p>
<p>My kids' lives are so centered at their colleges that they never come home including in summers. So, having a car has had no bearing on that. They don't wish to come home as they are heavily engaged in activities all weekend at their schools in their extracurriculars and social lives and schoolwork. They have no time to come home! </p>
<p>swimcatsmom....our kids' car is not an old clunker only because we wanted a good four wheel drive car that was reliable and would also last many years given where we live. We live in the mountains in a rural area with dirt roads and a LOT of snow and ice and also mud season. The roads are two lane and very dark (no lights) and isolated. The car they use is a Jeep Liberty. I would not call it a luxury car but we did want them to have a small SUV given the conditions where we live. As it is, when my younger one had only been driving two months, she was in a death defying car crash in another small SUV. I have no idea how she is alive today given the nature of the crash but perhaps being in that SUV helped. I'll never know. She was very seriously injured but made a full (long) recovery. That car was totalled and this Jeep is a replacement.</p>
<p>I happen to disagree with you blossom because I don't see it as changing the rules or even related to the BF. When my kids were in HS, I paid for gas because their driving was helping me as it was hard to get them to all their activities and having another driver helped. Once the car went to college, I saw it as a privilege to have at college and so the gas was on them except for trips home to visit us. I don't think I was manipulating anything. It has nothing to do with BFs (that child doesn't have a BF even). It has nothing to do with her comings and goings. She is free to go on as many trips in the car as she wants and to spend her money doing anything she wants. If she wanted to visit a BF all the time, she could and I would have no control over that. I just don't fund pleasure trips.</p>
<p>I don't feel I changed any rules. The paying of gas changed once she left home because she didn't NEED a car at college and so having one was a special privilege. She needed it in HS and so I paid for gas. That is reasonable to me and what I suggest the OP could do as she would not be changing rules due to a BF but because her D's situation is changing and she is going to be at college and doesn't need to go on three hour weekly trips but if she wants to, she can pay for that. The situation has changed and not so much the rules. I don't see why a parent of a college student needs to pay for their pleasure trips. I see that different than visiting a relative or their own parents because I would not want money to keep them from seeing us or their own sister and I am willing to pay for transportation home on breaks or to her sibling on breaks. I am not willing to pay for pleasure trips and that has nothing to do with BFs at all. That is not controlling the child because the child is still free to visit BFs or do anything else as long as they pay for their own activities. A parent cannot disallow the kid to go visit the BF. That's the girl's decision. I don't see why parents need to fund all of the kids' recreational activities with no limit. I don't see announcing that gas money except for school breaks to come home is their responsibility in college and that it should not be tied in anyway to whether they can or can't see a BF. Seeing the BF is her choice to do and she can but parents don't need to fund these extra trips. I would say the same thing if NO boyfriend were involved. I'd suggest setting this up and never even mentioning the BF. She can visit him as much as she wants.</p>
<p>How is not paying gas for pleasure trips manipulating what the D can do? My D is making a train reservation right now to go to a party this weekend in the Hamptons. She will fund that. She is also making a train reservation for next week to get from NYC to Boston to start grad school (she can't come home and we'll be bringing her her car and her belongings/furnishings later). I will be paying for that train as it is to go to school. I fully approve of her going to the party in the Hamptons that the parents of one of her college pals is holding. My not payinig has NOTHING to do with approval or manipulation. I don't send money for their pleasure trips. She is free to come and go as she likes and to spend her money in any way that she likes.</p>
<p>Soozie, happy your situation has worked out.</p>
<p>What bugs me here is that the presumption that in the absence of THIS BF no change in the rules was being contemplated. The kid is not a dope- the parents have had months to discuss so many issues related to the change in lifestyle and it appears that the use and expenses of the car were never on the table. It's only now that the parents realize the kid may be using the car to visit the BF who is living with mom that the car has become problematic.</p>
<p>I fund virtually none of my kid's recreation--- so believe me, nobody takes a tougher line than I do on discretionary vs. mandatory expenses. But that works if you've been consistent, not changing the rules a week before college starts because loser BF hasn't managed to disappear over the summer. THAT's being manipulative in my book. I don't understand why the parents can't have an open discussion about why staying at college on weekends is important-- why not be honest here, instead of deciding that they'll pay gas for certain trip and not others.</p>
<p>My experience in virtually every instance is that kids come to a good and mature decision when they're treated like adults. They decide to act out and be oppositional, do stupid or short-sighted things, or whatever, when they're treated like kids. I have no problem telling my kids that I'm not paying for X because I can't afford it. However- if I'm not paying for it because X is contrary to my values, or isn't important to me, or is a trivial use of hard earned dollars, I tell them the reason why. It's disengenous to trot out the money card if there are other issues involved.</p>
<p>There were many things growing up that they didn't have because I saw no need for them. I could have bought them without bankrupting us- but felt that explaining to the kids why they either fit or didn't into our budget was part of parenting. Now that they're financially independent they get to decide which trade-offs to make.</p>
<p>It seems a bit unfair to take away the car days before she leaves on the basis of an overheard conversation. I would give her a set amount of money per month for gas, tell her any additional gas, tickets/deductibles, etc are on her and let her take it.</p>
<p>Chances are she will get tired of the 3 hour drive twice a week very quickly, especially when she has to pay for most of it. Chances are also good that they will break up, but don't count on that.</p>
<p>If she is determined to see him, she will find a way with or without a car. Would you rather her driving herself or bumming rides with whomever?</p>
<p>I do agree that it is odd that this would come up at the last minute. It would have been easier to have just offered to pay for gas for trips home for the regular breaks and left all other trips up to her to fund. </p>
<p>In any case, I also agree with you that a discussion should be had as to why they think it is beneficial to her to spend weekends at college, paritcularly as a freshman and that was part of what they felt they were sending her away to college to do. So, talking about the pros and cons of that IS important! My D and I even talked about her letting go of the HS BF so that she could fully engage in the college scene. I didn't make her do that but she discussed it with me and made the choice on her own to do that. But we did discuss it. </p>
<p>The OP could discuss why they want her to stay on campus for its own benefits. </p>
<p>The decision whether to visit the BF frequently is the D's decision to make in the end, as an adult. The mom can't stop that. She can offer to give a certain amount of money toward gas per month and it is reasonable that she did not predict weekly trips home and so that was not in their plan when they said they'd pay for gas. So, the D can decide how she wants to use her gas money and her spending money and that is reasonable. </p>
<p>While it may seem last minute, it is reasonable that the parents had no idea the child would plan to make long trips on a weekly basis and had not planned for that. So, it is reasonable to have a limit on how much gas they will fund per month and let the D plan how to use it. The parents can't keep the girl from seeing her BF. They can have a limit on how much they are willing to give toward travel expenses per month. I don't think the parents are changing the "deal" at the last moment but it is fair to assume that they did not assume the girl would be making weekly trips.</p>
<p>Sorry, I didn't mean to derail the thread with my comment about whether cars were really needed! :) </p>
<p>I would agree with soozievt that it is perfectly reasonable for there to be a rules change about what parents pay for when a kid goes off to college. (We certainly have been making it clear to S that many things are going to be his financial responsibility now.) I also agree that it is absolutely key to NOT mention the boyfriend AT ALL when instituting this rule change. The last thing you want is to set up a Romeo and Juliet situation. The larger point is that you don't want her coming home every weekend for any reason: you want her to spend most of her weekends on campus and develop relationships there.</p>
<p>Blossom and Cap, i understand what you are saying. I got myself caught in similar situations when I wanted to be generous to our kids given only to find that the result was that we were subsidizing activities we did not want encourage. It's really tough when you have good kids that you want to help and reward, then you find out that their plans include things you don't like. We over subsidized our oldest two and ended up in that situation. We are much more careful now.</p>
<p>I find it somewhat intriguing that while on this issue most seem to be of the take the car away (or take it away by default by taking away the money), we wanted to force our kid to stay at college instead of coming home to visit, have friends there, get a social life at college, have them do what we want them to do, etc, there is a thread about 10 questions to ask your kid and most are digusted at the thought of getting involved in their kids academic lives at college.</p>
<p>Just from observing these 2 threads, it seems like controlling the social aspects are more important than assisting in the education?</p>
<p>I don't see not enabling your child to come home every weekend by giving them oodles of gas money to do so as controlling their college social life. I have no say in my kids' college social life. I do have a say in giving them spending money and travel funds. How they use those is up to them. I do not control their activities at all. For that matter, I have no say in their choice of college major or courses and would not want to either. Same idea on both counts....social and academic lives in college. I do have a limit in how much funding I will give them per month. How they use it is up to them.</p>
<p>PS, those of us who advocated a limit on gas money did not mean to take away the car but simply that parents would not fund weekly trips home irregardless of any BF. If I am funding a college away from home, I'd expect my student to spend most of their time at college and not at home and I also would not fund EXTRA travel money to enable them to come home weekly. I would give them a normal travel allowance to come home on breaks. I don't see that as controlling because there has to be some boundary as to funds. How they use those funds is up to them. This is a nonissue in my family as my kids do not come home....not even that much on breaks, LOL.</p>
<p>No car for any freshman would be our rule, if they are not going to join in the campus lifestyle and are merely going to commute and not bond with people, then why should I pay for living expenses for the "going away to school" experience (which I never got and am really encouraging my kids to pursue)</p>
<p>I commuted, had a BF and an off campus job, and never was involved with anything. I got a Bachelors, but no "college experience"</p>
<p>If my kids were to want a car at campus after the first year, I would pay for parking, but they would pay for all gas & insurance. I would pay for maintenance.</p>
<p>Absolutely no way to the coming home every weekend- both for financial reasons and for the college experience and also for studying and extra rest. These kids work hard, or should be, and need weekends for time to get to know friends better, time to sleep all day if they are exhausted, time to study and write papers and work on long term projects. </p>
<p>My DD is a total CC kid, fitting so much into her life, but having a long distance BF for 4 years has been great, all the college friend making, without being joined at the hip to a guy (like some of her friends with BFs on campus), and they each visit once a term and even that is tough. Sometimes D does not have time for us to visit, term is too busy with commitments, so I would totally put my foot down about visits home.</p>
<p>No visits whatsover for at least 6-8 weeks and limited ones thereafter.</p>