<p>I understand your position, but 18 is not 21 and that means it is still illegal and punishable by law to both the 18 year old and those who provided it (in many states).</p>
<p>GRinNE,</p>
<p>I hope you realize I am not being critical of you. I can understand and empathize with your feelings and your thoughts, I really can. I was just responding to your initial question and I happen to share your wife’s views. It is more likely than not that my husband might share YOUR views. I posed questions for you to consider, not to make you feel badly. The conversation turned when another poster prompted me to defend my position and point out the law in my state which were not accurately reported in some posts. I’m not judging your decision.</p>
<p>And…on that you and I will disagree. And…as an 19 year old his D could also face charges as could the underage teens who consumed the alcohol…and they could have left his home and gotten killed, injured, or killed themselves. And…I wouldn’t want that to happen and neither would anyone else. And…this is a discussion of opinions and facts and that is the end of the story there since neither of us is likely to change our minds.</p>
<p>Bamagirls – Please do not worry, I did not think you were being critical of me. I am conflicted myself, which is why I posted the question in the first place! I wanted to see what other parents would do, so I appreciate the honesty. For me this is a terribly difficult question. What I think I really want to do is talk directly to the kids, not the parents. I’m feeling that that’s the way to treat them as adults, just as if one of my adult friends behaved in my house in a way I did not approve of I would speak to him directly (not, say, to his wife).</p>
<p>Brine. Im certainly not a lawyer but I would certainly read the social hosting of minors law in your state. I posted a bit of it up thread. That along with a .02 bac for an under 21 driver leaves you and your d in a vulnerable position. </p>
<p>Again I just share for the future. Teach yourself and your kids about legal consequences of this stuff.</p>
<p>I would not be calling anybody’s parents but I would read the riot act to my kid along with the laws</p>
<p>Very interesting. I would struggle with this as well. I would not call the other parents, but make it abundantly clear (with the research paper Sax mentioned!) to my child how she put her family at great risk by hosting. I would also have the child specifically tell each attendee that the parents did not tacitly approve, are very disappointed, and that it will not happen again. This thread is a wonderful reminder to us parents about our responsibilities. We, too, became the less popular hang out home as the kids got older due the the higher expectations about behavior. It made me very sad because I liked the kids (mine included) here. And, I would not allow my kids to go to some homes where laws were not enforced. The kids are going to grow up and gain independence. They are adults at 18. We cannot be naive about drinking at parties (in school or other homes). All that being said, no minor is going to get alcohol at my house with my knowledge.</p>
<p>We just had a similar debate about pending legislation regarding late teens returning from the military and whether the law should be amended to allow them to carry certain weapons that are now illegal until they turn 21. My family has varying opinions since these soldiers are trained and carry these weapons for our country every day.</p>
<p>I’ll tell you where I’m coming from although it has nothing to do with alcohol or whether or not someone is of the age of an adult. We found ourselves in a situation where a trusted family invited our youngest over to play a few years back. It turns out they had a cat who was known to bite and several children have been bitten unprovoked and several children were injured. My daughter was attacked and bitten severely, let’s say mauled because that is exactly what it was. Although the family knew of its history they not only hid it, they hid the fact that my daughter was attacked and seriously injured for over 6 hours while they fabricated a story and falsified a rabies vaccination record. The cat lived outdoors and had recently suffered serious injuries including losing an ear to a raccoon. The cat had never in its five years of life received any vaccination although the law requires the rabies vaccination. They broke the law again by taking the cat to the vet the next day, not reporting the incident to the vet or Animal Control, and had the cat vaccinated. The vet didn’t know which is a good thing because it is illegal to vaccinate an animal who has bitten until after a quarantine period and the vet could have lost his license.</p>
<p>My daughter’s injuries were severe enough, in part due to the nature and location of the bite and multiplied greatly by the fact that medical treatment was withheld by these former “friends” for eight hours…over six plus the drive to one hospital and being sent from the local hospital to a major Children’s Hospital. The bites were painful…the treatment was worse, and the complications they caused by their choice not to tell us and to withhold medical treatment and also to lie were horrific. My little girl spent several nights in the hospital, underwent numerous painful treatments, suffered emotionally and physically, and then required 18 months of followup with a plastic surgeon and immunologist. </p>
<p>I realize these two things are not the same, but they risked my child’s life by making a choice not to tell me and withholding both medical treatment and the truth. She could have died because of their lies. I would have been upset about the bite, yes. I was furious about their decision to put their own welfare first and ignore the risks to my child. It would have been much better all around if they had been adults and been honest…simply admit they messed up, notify me immediately so I could make decisions for my daughter’s best interest, and perhaps avoid the infection at a minimum. I didn’t sue because taking care of her took up all of my time and I am not a litigious person. In hindsight it may have been what it took to teach them a lesson about doing the right thing.</p>
<p>Again, I’m not judging you with those statements, I’m just explaining where my passion is rooted about parents being informed.</p>
<p>Good luck to you in making your decision. Parenting is tough.</p>
<p>As a long time lurker on CC, I am compelled to make my first post on this thread. I am not sure what I would do in this case (leaning toward talking to the parents) but I am baffled by the many posts that characterize 18 and 19 year olds as “adults”. As someone with more than a passing knowledge of the law (I’ll say no more :)), I know that at least in my state, there is no blanket age for when a person becomes an adult. A person may be a “minor” under the law at one age for one purpose, but not a “minor” under the law for another purpose. The real issue here is whether the drinkers were drinking illegally and whether there is any potential that the parents could be held liable for the actions of the drinkers. Finally, I would want to read my homeowner’s insurance policy very carefully. Not every policy is the same. And finally, given the many, many posts on CC about the actions and decisions made by our college-age or college bound kids, I have grave misgivings about characterizing most of them as “adults”. I adore my college aged daughter. She is intelligent and wise in many ways. Adult? Not so much.</p>
<p>Haven’t read the whole thread, but if it were me, I would be inclined not to call the parents of the other kids, but I might have a brief chat with my own attorney and get some guidance.</p>
<p>I wouldn’t call the parents. The point about them being adults is that their parents aren’t responsible for their behavior–they themselves are. Even though they are underage to drink, they aren’t really “minors.” Thus, as somebody else noted, their parents couldn’t sue you for giving them alcohol–unless they got hurt, in which case they might be able to sue you for negligence, etc.</p>
<p>I don’t see any legal liability in this particular situation, except the potential (but highly unlikely) potential for criminal liability for the OP’s daughter. The parents didn’t know until after the fact, so they don’t have criminal liability. Nobody got hurt or sick, so there isn’t any civil liability. OP, one reason not to call the other parents is that if one of them is a nut, they could try to have your daughter arrested for providing alcohol to their “child.” You might mention that to your daughter to emphasize why it’s not a good idea to provide alcohol to underage people.</p>
<p>I also have to say that we are living in a weird fantasy world when we are going to call parents about 18 and 19-year-olds drinking, and then send those same kids off to college, where…</p>
<p>The kids are legally adults in a lot of situations. They are also adults in the penallties often imposed when they are caught illegally drinking and not of age which is a contradiction in terms. We have many threshholds for eligibility and legality of things, but legally, above 18, most courts will hold them liable as adults for breaking the law. </p>
<p>However, it is also a crime furnishing minors with alcohol and if the drinking happened at your house, even if you did not provide the booze, or condone it, it is not a good thing that it happened there and that there is some feeling that you might have condoned it, from what your DD’s reaction was when confronted with the situation. I think you need to make it clear what your stance is, so there is not a sentiment or reputation out there that you condone underage drinking. You were not there, so you don’t know who was drinking and you should not even try to identify who was and wasn’t. Enough to let all parents of those there and directly to those who were there, that what happened was without your permission and alcohol is not permitted there when it comes to those underage. I would make this clear as there is some ambiguity on this subject and you. You do not want the word “on the street” to be that you will cast a blind eye to this sort of thing. Young adults are always looking for places where they can drink with impunity and if you don’t want to be “on that list” as a place to go for drinking, you should make that clear. Some adults do permit it or just ignore it or don’t address it. </p>
<p>I have to be particularly vigilant about this sort of thing because we have a basement rec room that is a gathering place for alot of my kids and their friends. More than half of my kids, and their friends are of age for dirinking legally, That does not mean I want my house to be their “bar”. It was a hard lesson to get through some of my kids’ heads that just because they were legally allowed to drink did not mean they could drink all they wanted when they wanted where they wanted.</p>
<p>*I wouldn’t call the parents. The point about them being adults is that their parents aren’t responsible for their behavior–they themselves are. Even though they are underage to drink, they aren’t really “minors.” Thus, as somebody else noted, their parents couldn’t sue you for giving them alcohol–unless they got hurt, in which case they might be able to sue you for negligence, etc.</p>
<p>I also have to say that we are living in a weird fantasy world when we are going to call parents about 18 and 19-year-olds drinking, and then send those same kids off to college, where…*</p>
<p>Just to clarify: my point here is that to characterize an 18 or 19 year old as an “adult” strikes me as beside the point. These are the same “adults” who we nag about filling out college applications, doing their laundry, getting a summer job, etc. In these instances we treat our kids like kids but somehow they are “adult” when it comes to decisions like drinking? I mean no disrespect here at all. I struggle with this issue mightily. Aside from the purely legal issues, when should we treat our (and other’s) kids as adults and when shoud we treat them as kids? There are no easy answers.</p>
<p>And some are living in a weird fantasy world if they believe the mantra “everyone” does it…it is simply not true, but I guess it makes some parents feel better to say it. The other fact is that try as we might, we don’t decide which laws are just by breaking them or denying they pertain to our own lives and the choices we make. The law specifically says we cannot make these decisions for other people’s children…like it or not.</p>
<p>Ok, so dinner, if an 18 year old doesn’t fit that stereotype then their parents don’t have to be contacted? How could you know what they’re like at home for you to decide whether or not they’re adults? </p>
<p>Imo, how you treat your kid is your business but other 18 year olds should be treated like adults… because they are…</p>