<p>From what I gather, in Colorado, and I have one son who went to college there, it isn’t the medical marijuana that is the hot commodity. I’m no expert in this field and don’t want to become one either. </p>
<p>Can one now go buy pot to smoke in CO? Who’s selling it? More crap to run through your lungs and bother those with smoke allergies too.</p>
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Cannabis doesn’t work that way. For someone who is sensitized to it, a little bit will get the person high. Smoking more won’t get the person significantly higher - and too much over time will tend to de-sensitize the person. So there is a different pattern of usage. People don’t “binge” smoke. </p>
<p>It may be a little different when ingested, such as eaten in brownies. But there is also no known lethal quantity.</p>
<p>It does impair driving ability and legalization could potentially create greater problems on the road. Though the pattern of impaired driving is a little different --rather than speeding or swerving around the road, cannabis users tend to drive far too slowly – but their reflexes are also impaired which could still cause serious injuries or fatalities.</p>
<p>Yes, and they also tend to forget they wanted to go anywhere on the way to the car. ;)</p>
<p>I have a kid in Colorado. She says nobody ever uses anything that doesn’t come from a dispensary, ever. There’s no street market for it.</p>
<p>Also, while Marijuana can be psychologically addicting, there is no chemical physical addiction to the drug. </p>
<p>I don’t use mood altering substances. Well, not true. I use coffee. But, it seems as if humans have always had and will always have mood altering substances that are a part of the acceptable culture. As far as they go, pot is less dangerous than alcohol, which is as dangerous as any opiate we currently sell.</p>
<p>Calmom, stats are my specialty, but not in the drug abuse field, and see the numbers in my job as the raw stats not after all the spin is put in them. One can put out the risk factors for those who get into drug/alcohol addiction, and then take the poll in just about any given setting and they fit pretty danged closely. Take a control group, and it doesn’t work that way at all. So Mini’s numbers are pretty accurate from what I have been told.</p>
<p>The only thing that I don’t quite get is that the stats for young adults in college vs out of college. The numbers are skewd towards college students, but when I look at what the stats for court records and just plain old eyeballing, they don’t jive for me. I have a strong suspicion that those young adults who don’t go off to college escape a lot of the counts because they come from families that simply do not run them through the centers and paces where the headcounts are done. Nearly everyone I have seen in the centers I have visited that are young people are college bound or were in college. Yet I know the problem is a big deal among the non college young crowd too, to a point that it blows whole communities, not to mention families apart.</p>
<p>“I’d also be curious about the survey methodology. If a child is allowed an occasional half-glass of of wine at the dinner table on special occasions at age 13 or 14, but starts drinking socially with peers at age 16 – which counts as the first drink?”</p>
<p>Most of the time, the question usually says something like “more than a sip”. Some also say not in a religious context (remember: communion). </p>
<p>As regards heroin, a study published in Lancet a few years ago, compared regular heroin users (with “controlled” heroin provided by the government) with the rest of the population, controlled for age, race, income, domestic situation, etc. The study found virtually no health differences between heroin users and everyone else except for one: heroin users lived one year longer.</p>
<p>Hard liquor is indeed a more dangerous drug. What is dangerous about heroin is lack of control over circumstances of use, dosage, impurities, criminality, etc. </p>
<p>As regards non-college-bound youth: Lots of non-college bound youth are military bound. AND a higher percentage of non-college bound youth are non-Caucasian.</p>
<p>Two studies I’ve seen suggest that marijuana-using youth have lower mortality than non-users, mainly because they usually use at home (rather than drrivng to and from bars, events, etc.) We have seen an increase in auto crashes where mairjuana is found, but usually in combination with prescription opiates.</p>
<p>(If I were king…No one would be allowed in the military - male or female - who wasn’t at least 40 and hadn’t had a child.)</p>
<p>One thing that was a severe blow to me was that the schools, the principals and those that you have to deal with when your kid gets into trouble, is that there is more emphasis on punishment and showing how tough the school is on this sort of thing than truly addressing the issues. It’s like Groundhog Day (the movie) in that they often act like this is the first time this has happened, when you know danged well it wasn’t and they are not forthcoming, at least in my case, in giving out any info on prior situation and helpful ideas. I ended up in a huge fight with the school, and they were out for blood, mine and my kid’s. And then the next year and the next and the next, the same danged things happened, just as they had the year’s before. OP’s school seems to be more proactive in working with his son and the family on this. That was not the case for me at all, and was a huge shock to me on top of everything else.</p>
<p>The high school that the OP’s son is attending is a large one, so they have had to gone through this before, and so questions as to how this affected college should easily be answered. It’s not like that wheel was not yet invented.</p>
<p>HA mini!! All countries should use those rules to fill their military!!</p>
<p>Cptofthehouse, I just want to add my thanks for all your posts on this thread to everyone else’s. I wish that there were more parents who took your “zero tolerance” approach to underage drinking and hope that by sharing your experience in this area, you may have helped some other parents to take this topic more seriously.</p>
<p>Sadly, I do agree that the schools who are trying to keep alcohol out of their events (and their student’s hands) are fighting a losing battle as long as parents continue to be tolerant of underage drinking. Whether it’s because they don’t agree with the current law or they are afraid of being “mean” or jeopardizing their kids’ social status, they really make it harder for other parents to guide and protect their kids.</p>
<p>I don’t have a “zero tolerance” as I see it defined in the law. I just believe firmly that parents, regardless of how they personally feel about this law, should enforce it and make it clear that it is important that it is enforced. As I said before, there are too many parents who don’t feel that way, and actually abet the drinking feeling it is a rite of passage. The problem is that those parents affect our kids as well. </p>
<p>All parents need to be on alert for signs and opportunities for drinking and drug use. I don’t care how trust worthy your kid is, and how much you believe this. Social pressures are such that any kid can get caught up in this. Yes, it’s something that a lot of kids do, and most get through unscathed, but this is not a lottery you want to enter. Believe me, trusting what a teenager tells you is not a good idea. They can be honest the instant they tell you something but things can change in an instant and full disclosure is not likely to happen. </p>
<p>Do be aware that the earlier you catch these issues, the better your chances are by far of being able to curb many of the consequences. So vigilence starts pretty early. My younger kids’ had a classmate who had pot in his backpack during middle school that I found. Big to do, and the mother who was a psychologist dealing with adolescent problems stuck her head right in the sand. Her older son was providing pot to the younger one. Right in their own house, and this kid brought the stuff to my place. It was a very rough 4-6 years, but I think some major disasters were averted with the younger son, though the older one seems to have been in pretty deep by then. So, yes, early intervention in these things can really avert some huge problems, and I swear to you there are ever so many parents who never suspected, expected would have sworn on their sweet chidren’s lives, that this could not be. </p>
<p>One of mine was high risk by nature. Fit the risk taking, social creature profile, and has addictive characteristics. I swear that if he had had any opportunity in elementary or middle school, he would have taken it, something I did not know, but I was right on top of the kids for other reasons, and so the opportunities did not arise until much later. Those intervening years when I was just always around, may have made a crucial difference as it seems that the “taste” for some of these things, from cigarette smoking to alcohol to drug use seem to “set” pretty early. My son’s exposure was relatively late, and the pros dealing with this could not emphasize enough how good that was. Very strong correlation between early onset and strong addiction. So the longer you can keep them away, the better. </p>
<p>The other piece of advice is to know what you should do if you should get a phone call. Yeah, I never had a criminal attorney, and no idea as to how to find one. You get the wrong guy, and you pay through the nose and he trades your kid on a deal with the DA for some other case where the personal interest is stronger. Yep, seen it happen. Not to me. I was ever so lucky to get the exact right attorney. The next year, the father of a kid at my son’s school called me when his son got into similar trouble and because the attorney was not one who was a agile and aware about these cases, things were already a problem by the time he called us. The school who well knew how these things worked, were NO help to them at all, ZERO, in fact were pounding on them when the family was falling a apart with these issues. Knowing a good criminal attorney is a very good idea when you have kids who are getting well into their teens. When your kid gets into trouble, you have to move fast, and it usually happens in the wee hours of the morning and on a Friday or Saturday night, and unless you know someone to reach, you are stuck till Monday.</p>
<p><a href=“If%20I%20were%20king…No%20one%20would%20be%20allowed%20in%20the%20military%20-%20male%20or%20female%20-%20who%20wasn’t%20at%20least%2040%20and%20hadn’t%20had%20a%20child.”>quote</a>
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<p>You wouldn’t be king for too long then. </p>
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<p>Apparently someone did a study, and found out that it was several hundred pounds in a day or something like that. Simply an amount that no one could smoke even if they tried. </p>
<p>In terms of drinking, I personally don’t support underaged drinking, however I would make an exception for special celebrations. I was at an “ethnic” wedding a few years ago and it was open bar, with some kids several years younger than me drinking with drinks their parents got for them (I was 18 at the time, so a lot of these kids were in the range of 12-14). It was all in the presence of family with the approval of their parents for a single celebration. There were a few celebrations (turn of the millenium was one I remember) where my parents gave me and my younger sister champaign (or bubbly white wine - you know what I mean) at a party attended by much of our family and family-friends. I personally don’t think underaged drinking on special occasions like that are especially problematic.</p>
<p>I’ve found a lot of drunk kids at wedding, bar/bat mitzvahs and other celebrations where the attention is focused on adult guests. Ironic that in some cases, there are folks looking out for old drunk Uncle Joe, or the lush, Aunt Floe and ignoring the fact that the kids are imbibing. Many kids started drinking from such occasions is what I have heard. In fact, I averted such an opportunity at such a wedding that I am sure my sons would have joined in on the drinking. I still remember clearly, making sure my kids were within arms reach. Two kids threw up, it was not a good situation. In some cases, no immediate and hopefully no long term consequences. The fact of the matter is that we don’t know what harm it does. The stats are very clear, that the first drinks at the earlier ages are a huge risk factor for hard core problems. Why take that risk? </p>
<p>I prefer to provide a sparkling cider drink for toasts for anyone underage and anyone who prefers it to the champagne.</p>
<p>Oh, I wasn’t trying to say that you should give your kids alcohol at weddings. Just that I think it’s okay for a parent to do so on their own judgement. Absolutely if you don’t think it’s right for your kid to be drinking at a celebration like that it’s totally reasonable to not let them drink.</p>
<p>I think it’s important to remember that drinking laws vary state to state. Some states do allow minors to drink with a parent. As a parent all you can do is model behavior and support the local laws whether you believe in them or not. Kids aren’t stupid they can understand that some things you can do in one place but not in another…speed laws, pot consumption…lots of issues that kids deal with vary from place to place. They need to be “adult” about their behaviors and understand that it can be a relative thing. They break the law where they are…they get busted.</p>
<p>A lot of states d permit minors to drink with a parent, and a champagne toast or wine with a meal is considered fine if the parent is right there. I don’t permit it, but most of my friends and parents of my kids’ friends do. If the wedding hosts do not object, and i would if I were hosting; I’d make it clear that minors get the sparkling cider,then that is up to the parents. </p>
<p>More important is making sure your kids are running around finishing off drinks from other guest’s glasses. That, apparently is how a lot of kids got their first buzzes from alcohol, I kid you not.</p>
<p>Well, this has turned into a good conversation in youth drinking in general, but to update you with what’s going on here:</p>
<p>We settled on a lawyer who has a good history of negotiating plea deals. I took my son down to see him today and they talked for a while about all the legal elements that are in play here. He didn’t really know much about the legal process or how much was at stake here, so although the meeting scared him pretty deeply I think it was good for him to hear now. </p>
<p>The judge in our county (and it’s a small enough county that one judge handles just about all of the traffic cases) is known to be tough on DUI. The lawyer told us that jail is a very real possibility here but that we’re going to do everything we can to avoid it. The other bit of bad news was that the case will likely be resolved at his June 18 appearance, so there goes any chance of keeping the DUI off his college apps.</p>
<p>College talk has been therapeutic for him the last couple days, since I think it’s reminding him that there is a light at the end of the tunnel. Do any of you have opinions on how much we should tell colleges about this (obviously we’ll disclose, but how much do we make it part of his narrative)? Also, is it a good idea to contact these schools to see how much a DUI would affect an otherwise qualified candidate?</p>
<p>Thanks all. Your replies have been very helpful to my wife and I as we’ve worked through this.</p>
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<p>Jail for a first time offense on a college bound kid with no criminal record? I’m not an expert but it sounds like the lawyer is trying to play up the consequences so that when he gets a revoked license and a lot of community service it’ll sound great. I guess I could just be talking out of my ass though. </p>
<p>Good luck.</p>
<p>NCDad, your son goes to a large high school, does he not? He cannot possibly be the first student to get into this sort of trouble over the years from there. Can the GCs there, the principal, give you some idea as to how the various colleges will react, and how this should be handled? If they truly have never encountered this issue, can they call colleagues at other schools for advice as to how to best handle this?</p>
<p>Yes, I had to go through this, and my son’s school was not helpful in the least, and in fact was an impediment. His problems which we handled with full disclosure, did not seem to affect his college admissions, however, no NC schools on the list Only one college contacted the school counselor for details. </p>
<p>However, at about that time the NYT was following a number of kids through the selective college process, and one young man who was expelled from a private school after junior year for drinking violations was one of those followed. He had very high test scores and was a top student. He was turned down at every school that asked for reporting of such situations and was accepted only to the one highly selective school that did not, which at the time, I believe, was UVA. Due to the lottery ticket nature of admissions of the other schools, it was impossible to say whether the disclosure affected the decisions or not.</p>
<p>At my daughter’s bat mitzvah, I hired a bartender just to prevent any teen drinking since there were many kids there without their parents. No problem there, but several girls (3 that I know of) drank the leftover wine from many different glasses after the blessing and got pretty drunk. They were all there with parents. Two 13-year-olds and a 12-year-old.</p>
<p>Something important, also in terms of getting stopped when drinking, sometimes it is smarter to refuse the breathalyzer test and ask for an attorney first. The attorney can then gauge whether a test should be allowed or not. Though the DMV consequences can be severe when you refuse the test, it can make it more difficult for a criminal conviction so that a felony or misdemeanor is not on the record. A DUI stays on for life. Yes, even 30 years later, a second such offence can land you in jail for while. A big change in policy from the days when VP Cheney got off with slaps on the wrists and fines for not one, but two DUIs. It is important to know ones rights and the consequences of a lot of these things when you have teen agers. It can make a huge difference in your options, consequences and costs. The police these days will tend to throw the book at people and it can all come down luck of the draw, who you know, who your judge is, who the DA is and what he will deal, who your attorney is and what he can and will deal. It seems to me that who the asst DA is in these cases determines whether a deal can be made or not. You get one who is reving for the win stats and it’s a problem. The judges tend to go with whatever the DA wants when it comes to the deals. Also ask the attorney if any testimonials from teachers, school officials are useful. They can be. I would have also asked specifically if that attorney has handled young high school first offenders before, how many times, and what the outcomes were. Through sheer luck, we got an attorney who got a lot of those cases, and he could rattle off exactly what the story was in the last dozen or so he handled in that court–but the issue was always the DA.</p>
<p>I am surprised the case will resolved so fast. It usually drags out for months, here in NY, and from what I have heard in other states too, including NC. If the DA gets switched while the case drags on, the chances for a good deal go up. </p>
<p>I wish I did not know all of these things.</p>
<p>Just a note about state laws – I found a web site that lists the circumstances in which it is legal for teenagers to drink in various states here:
[Most</a> States in U.S. Permit Drinking Under the Age of 21 (the “Legal” Drinking Age)](<a href=“http://www2.potsdam.edu/hansondj/YouthIssues/Most-States-in-US-Permit-Drinking-Under-the-Age-of-21.html]Most”>http://www2.potsdam.edu/hansondj/YouthIssues/Most-States-in-US-Permit-Drinking-Under-the-Age-of-21.html) </p>
<p>(I don’t know how current that site is – so I’d double check before actually relying on it in a real-world setting. I haven’t kept up with things as my kids are both well over 21. My son is old enough that I told him he should take it as a compliment if he is carded.)</p>