SUNY University at Buffalo or IITs

Student Lounge International Students
41

<p>From the very basic level the indian education system sucks! Consider the selection procedure for getting into any good college, wanna get into IITs- write two exams: mains and advanced, wanna get into iisc write another, how about BITS or VIT- write two more exams. but not all of us are that brillan are we? so write CET for your state. </p>

<p>And what if you want to pursue medical ? well thats another hell hole all together !</p>

<p>What has the CBSE done? Oh glee and joy! thy decide that studying for entrance exams is just not enough so colleges must now consider 12th board marks. those brilliant minds up there decided to put two exams (Boards and cce) in 10th to"ease our hardship".</p>

42

<p>My ramblings might not make much fluid sense but they come from an anger deep rooted in me. Today I consider myself fortunate to have been accepted into Case, Rensselaer and UCSC ( case and UC honours with merit) but had I decided to try out for any Indian colleges i am daam sure that I would not have gotten into any IIT.</p>

<p>Why? Hyper inflation of marks by "tution classes"of course. consider this, the average ÏIT Base classes start at 8th Std.(some at 6th), almost every single student from an average CBSE school attends these. This god forsaken pits of stupidity have taken education to such a commercial level that few students actually know the true meaning of what they are learning. Heck, even schools follow similar systems, where in the word would you expect a teacher not to teach but to dictate “notes” to children instead of teaching them. No where else but India !
one might argue that these words are just Mumbo-Jumbo but let me provide proof, ask your parents as to how many in their school got grades above 80. you can also argue that inflation is bound to occur in any education system. True, but not that much. Take for example the humble subject of English, one of the few left untouched by dirty teachings of Tutorials, its bell curve still peaks at 55%.</p>

<p>Today Tutorial classes have become so rampant that they earn more than some well regarded government universities. All these monstrous institutions do nothing but harm, they take away the beauty that is science and bolster the impression that Indians are nothing more than uncreative human calculators who know nothing more than to provide theoretical data.</p>

43

<p>OK, I get it @BetterThanBest and @Tmadness‌
I understand your frustration, but it’s misguided and I’ll tell you why. They very fact that IITs and Brown are different facilitates their non comparison. Apples and Oranges buddy. I’ll just say that Brown is a LAC and IIT is a technical institute. You don’t need to go on rambling about the quality of education here in India, I know that it sucks altogether at different levels.
Now coming back to the topic, technical institutes are what they say they are - technical institutes, if you seek a plethora of course offerings, you should avoid going to one. There’s no tech institute in the world that would offer a course in Humanities/Arts and Social Sciences (except MIT). If you would’ve compared IIT to say, RPI that’d have made sense. tech institutes are known for their strict core requirements because you’d need that to study engineering in the first place. If you choose to study engg at a LAC, they would slap a core requirement on you too, just wait and watch. So, your “Zeal” point doesn’t make sense because if you opt to study Engineering, your’re supposed to embrace the core requirements whether it’s a LAC or a tech institute, no researching involved.</p>

<p>Now coming to the “Peer” point, here again you make a very strong case but again it’s misguided by the ‘apples and oranges’ fact. It’s true that diversity helps to create a dynamic environment, but Engineering is a very specialized major and suitable for a particular type of people, we don’t need diversity here, just a bunch of people with a particular set of skills. Think of Law schools and Business schools, do they seek to admit a diverse class? Of Course not! Because to succeed in Law or Business requires a particular set of skills and not everyone possesses those. Why should engineering schools be different? Engineering is not everyone’s cup of tea.</p>

<p>Gender Ratio: Good point but as usual misguided, Don’t get me wrong, I’d too love to see some hot chicks during my time at college, but it’s a universal fact that technical institutes have a shortage of girls (maybe they’re not interested in Engineering or just plain stupid, who can know?). MIT too has a sex ration of 60/40, RPI = 80/20 etc etc. Do you really think that it’d be different at Brown? No, absolutely not, I’ll admit that Brown would have more girls overall, but each Engineering course you’ll take, you’ll just find that there are almost no girls! because Brown has arts/humanities course with more girls and engineering courses with less girls, it just balances itself out to 50/50 overall. </p>

<p>Faculty and research
Hmmmmm, now this is a point worth debating, I’m sure you’ll agree that above points ^ don’t matter.
This point would be rather interesting because it’d depend on whose side you’re on. Do you believe that it’s the professors or the students themselves that matter for the quality of education? Beacause here’s a equation:
■■■■■■ Professors + Bright Students = A Certain result [IIT]
Excellent Professors + ■■■■■■ Students = Same result ^ [Brown]
Now that it’s established, I’d like to say that students at IIT engineering are in general, brighter than students at Brown engineering, if you don’t think so, you’re just not giving compliments that Indians students genuinely deserve. Just go and ask any US professor what they think about their engineering students, they’d say what I’ve said above. A professor who was interviewed for Scientific American magazine told that if were not for Indians and Chinese students, most of the MTech classes would have been empty because the above 2 types of students contribute to over 90% of the strength of the class. It’s because the Americans who do engineering don’t make it to the MTech programs due to the lack of strong foundation of Math and Science courses in HS (don’t bash our primary education, it’s better than US and prepares us extensively for the world out there), what’s the use of such Engineers who are not competent enough, I ask you? Would you prefer their company? I sure as hell won’t.
Now, here comes research. Here again, endowments don’t do research, students do. Those students at Brown wouldn’t even know what to do with that huge endowment while those bright IITians will make the most out of the frugal research fund and will do better. It all depends on whether you see IITians as more intelligent than their Brown counterparts.</p>

<p>Infrastructure
No argument here, Brown wins fair and square. I don’t expect a university (IIT) of a developing country where more than 50% of population lives below the poverty line to have a better infrastructure than a university (Brown) of a developed country where people have no idea how lucky they are. </p>

<p>So here’s the final score
Infrastructure : Brown = 1 , IIT = 0
Sex ratio : Brown = N/A , IIT = N/A
Peer : Brown = 0 , IIT = 1
Faculty : Brown = 0 , IIT = 1 (IITs may have ■■■■■■ professors but they are there for you, NO TAs involved. Also many Indians teach at unis in US, but same can’t be said for US professors teaching here because they won’t qualify to get a job to teach at IIT. some that do have a branded degree and no skill)
Research : Brown = 1 , IIT = 1 (let’s consider them even, because you’ve never heard of some groundbreaking research from IITians and I’ve never heard the same from Brownies) </p>

<p>Overall Brown = 2, IIT = 3</p>

<p>Finally, coming to Dartmouth.
When I said other factors, I meant

  • small size (note it’s Dartmouth College and not Dartmouth University)
  • less research (again, due to small size)
  • less no of Nobel laureates (again, due to small size). Most of the rankings weight research significantly over the quality of teaching, the same reason due to which Brown ranks lower than Harvard for engineering even though it’s better
    It’s very easy to bash Dartmouth due to it’s booze culture which is nothing more than a hyperbole. Because if it were real, Dartmouth would’ve been ranked even lower because Booze does factor in rankings (surprising, yes!). See the US News and World Report method, booze and drug use come under campus safety and quality of life!
    When you apply to Dartmouth, you’ll know how exclusive it is, you can get into Columbia engineering but not in Dartmouth unless you’re very good. Dartmouth’s engineering is better than 7 ivies, the only one better is Princeton.
    Here’s my own ivy engineering ranking, I encourage cross verify from other sources and posting in forums.
  1. Princeton
  2. Dartmouth
  3. Columbia/Cornell (same rank)
  4. Brown/UPenn (same rank)
  5. Yale
  6. Harvard<br>
    But the rankings would tell you different because research is a factor which outweighs everything, no wonder Harvard almost tops the rankings due to plenty of published Professors and Nobel laureates and endowment that is the greatest in the world. Even Yale, who ranks second in endowment has only about the half of endowment Harvard has. Means is not only on the top, it’s on the top by a very large margin and even the second ranker cannot dream to defeat it! Even a bozo can get a research grant just like that at Harvard. Does that mean you would go study Engineering at Harvard?</p>
44

<p>and @BetterThanBest‌
No Offense, but the link you posted was from Quora, a website known for masala gossip, so how is that any better than the link posted by @Robots156‌. At least, it included some valuable info i.e. contribution of alums towards the nation’s GDP. I just observed it now, you said that you don’t want some rant but that’s exactly what you posted i.e. pissed off professors and students bashing their institution.
Also, as far as Raghuram Rajan goes, he did not stop at IMF, he was the one who predicted the market crash of 2008 for which he was vehemently condemned. Those who based him at an international symposium regretted it so much later when their economies suffered. Larry Summers called him a Luddite. His prediction came out to be untrue while Raghuram was proved correct. Larry summers went to MIT for economics, then Harvard while Raghuram went to IIT for engineering, then MIT. Hope this story will teach you to respect our pain in the a** but useful curriculum. Sure you can point out 1000 for every Raghuram, but conversely, I can point another 2000 who couldn’t even complete their engineering degree. and BTW, Larry Summers intended to study Physics, but later changed his major to Economics, while Raghuram studied Engineering at IIT and still kicked his a**. </p>

45

<p>LOL! You say that IIT’s have better professors! And who told you that TA’s teach at Brown? I asked about it in my interview (with Ishan Singh_Electrical engineering UG at Brown) and here’s the reply:
All the classes are taught by profs. TA’s only role at Brown are to help students if they need any help the prof can’t cover. I was taught only once by a TA and that too in the introductory course of Physics.</p>

<p>That point is unsubstantiated. No way in the blue hell can you rank the profs at Brown below IIT. Seriously.
Peer point is subjective and it will be better if we leave it… (as I mentioned in my previous post)
And research: I’ll ask you to go through this for Brown <a href=“Research | Research at Brown | Brown University”>Research | Research at Brown | Brown University; and compare it with IIT’s. Your oblivion to Brown or IIT’s doesn’t cover up anything. So
infra: Brown 1, IIT’s 0
Profs: Brown 2, IIT’s 0___<strong><em>Your point about TA thing is false and again your “opinion which is unfounded” doesn’t suffice
Research: Brown 3, IIT’s 0</em></strong>__ Go through the links
Brown overpowers IIT’s everywhere. I still don’t see what you or I am missing.</p>

<p>And now coming to peers, here’s what I think:</p>

<p>The close interaction with non-techies gives engineers the perspective, context and ability to work together to solve problems. The world’s most important problems, be it human genomics or climate change, are not technical problems alone.
Being in a mixed environment with proportionate rewards allows people to retain the feeling of unique contribution to hard tech problems that they reveled in during their JEE days and tend to lose when lumped together with 3000 others with similar tech skills, exam scores and other such mundane metrics.
And I don’t know how I missed this point in my original post but another metric which I feel is useful to list is:</p>

<p>Emphasis on teamwork. You cannot build a rocket, fly it to the moon, land a human and bring him safely back on your own. While creativity and analytics are of great importance, the most complex engineering projects in human history from the International Space Station to the Deepwater Horizon oil rig have critically hinged on team dynamics and leadership. Top schools in the US have a lot of team-based classwork and projects to instill these capabilities (e.g. communication, work splitting+combining, team diversity, etc.). The IITs, sailing on blind competition, severely hinder students’ abilities to cooperate and collaborate effectively.</p>

<p>Brown 4, IIT’s 0 (leaving behind the peer part).
Phew!</p>

46

<p>That link you posted about Brown is self advertised. You just tell me the best contribution of Brown undergrad towards engineering and I’ll do the same for IIT, then we can compare the research factor too. I never said that professors are better at IIT, you definitely misread my post, on the contrary I said "The professors at IITs may be s*<em>y but at least they’re available"** and it’s a well known fact. Your interviewer told you that and you just believed him! That’s really credible, I think that you haven’t gotten the fact that private universities like Brown like to self advertise. I meant that academics not only depends on Professors but also on students, so we should be comparing students+professors to get the “whole” academic thing-y. And when we consider that equation, the bright students at IITs overshadow those at Brown to that extent that even the excellent professors don’t matter. Therefore equation would finally be,
Infra: Brown 1 IIT 0
Academics: Brown 1 IIT 1
If anything, they rank equal. Only when we have a distinct yardstick to measure the quality of research, we can reach a conclusion of Win or Lose. But even after all these debating, the main thing (i.e Academics) skews the result in IIT’s favor. No one gives a sh</em>t about infrastructure.
Finally, as I’ve said and you admitted, you’re a fanatic, and I make it a point not to argue with a fanatics because they tend be very opinionated people. Just tell me, Is there anything I can say or do or show you that’ll make you believe that IITs are better?
If your answer is No to the above^, then I guess you’ve already made up your mind and there’s nothing I or anyone can do.</p>

47

<p>Okay then lets compare apples with apples then! How about RPI/Purdue/UCSD vs IITB/IITK/IITD</p>

48

<p>Well sir can you provide us witha source that says that ta teach at Brown?
Oh please. I at least stand by my point that I am a fanatic. You say that you don’t argue with fanatics and you’ve already posted a lot of threads arguing with me.
And yes you can convince me that iit are better if you add some substance to your post and your points. Add some link. Show us some proof and don’t go gaga over anything.
Fwiw, opinionated is not same as being stubborn. Just adding to your already vast knowledge sir. </p>

49

<p>And the point that IITs have brilliant students is beyond misleading(I should know, I worked there) </p>

50

<p>IMHO, a good comparison of the quality of education + that of students at an institute is reflected in the feats achieved by its alumni. Insofar as engineering goes, you yourself can compare alums of Brown vis a vis IIT and you would get your answer. Of course, if you claim that the quality of students at intake in IIT is great already, then i say that, if a particular student is not good enough/cannot attend a particular college, then such comparisons are meaningless.</p>

<p>My $0.02</p>

51

<p>@BetterThanBest I don’t need source to verify that TAs teach at Brown, I can infer that from the data readily available on the internet. Brown has almost 6000 UG students and about 2000 graduate students and it offers more than 250 courses in an average semester (fall/spring), and finally, it has a full time faculty of about 700ish. Do the Math.
But let’s assume for a second that TAs don’t teach at Brown and it’s just Professors. Now just answer this question, which of the college do you think is strong academically
College 1: Excellent Professors + Dumb Students
College 2: Mediocre Professors + Brilliant Students?
The only thing that matters is Academics, because know that a College is an institution of higher learning, not an institution to participate in co curricular activities or bang chicks. You argued for the sake of arguing and introduced factors which don’t mean sh*t like infrastructure, zeal, no. of girls at college and whatnot.<br>
And this’ll be my last post, and BTW, I only posted twice. I’m not even arguing, just having a healthy discussion and it’s you that turning this into an argument. </p>

<p>@Tmadness
How many Brown Engineering students do you think can crack JEE advanced?
They study AP courses and get college credit for it, what a joke. We study the same and a lot more just in our secondary schools. Do you know that an American kid won’t be offered admission at an institute like Cambridge, Oxford or even Imperial if he’s not taken at least 5 APs? Because they don’t even consider a simple high school diploma from an American highschool sufficient preparation for college. and yes, those 5 APs need to be in subjects they rate Tier 1 (like Physics C, not Statistics or Psychology). No offer is made to them on high school diplomas, conversely, they consider ISC boards subjects equivalent to A levels. </p>

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<p>@Robots156: I couldn’t get your post. Can you please explain? If you’re talking about comparing the alumni’s success, it will depend on how you define success: monetary success or R&D success? There are many more.
Anyway, you can see these links for your answer:
<a href=“Brown University - Wikipedia”>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brown_University&lt;/a&gt;
<a href=“IIT Bombay - Wikipedia”>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Institute_of_Technology_Bombay&lt;/a&gt;
I quote something for Brown from this page

I suggest you to repeat the exercise with IIT’s. I couldn’t find ANYTHING notable coming out of IIT’s So, @Robots156, if this is what you mean, we have clear winner-Brown
@Peepingtom: you’re free to not post if you don’t want. And BTW who are you to say that Brown students are DUMB? You surely haven’t met many of the students; both of IIT’s and Brown. See the above links.
And you surely have weak mathematics skill. The numbers you posted include ALL the students; not only engineering students. Compare those if you can. i couldn’t find the no. on faculty memebers in IIT Bombay. So i won’t compare. I’ll just ask you one more question, CAN YOU EXPLAIN WHY IIT BOMBAY HAS NOT PRODUCED ANYTHING “NOTABLE” IN ENGINEERING since its inception? I hope it drives away your misconception that IIT students are “oh-so smart”
And somehow I missed that you wrote that booze parties factor into rankings. I suggest you to go through the QS ranking methodology, which is most venerated rankings. It doesn’t factor whatever crap Dartmouth does. In fact, when you say that Dartmouth>Cornell for Engineering, you lose all your credibility. I still don’t understand what makes you think that IIT’s students are out of this world good. This is just what you <em>think</em> (which is wrong btw, see the links I posted above).
And the thing, “you-won’t post here again” is actually a tactic developed by people who really can’t have a discussion and run away when things get out of you control. Good day sir!</p>

53

<p>You really are a dumb a**. Sure I included all students, but I also included the whole faculty (go see it on the website).
AS far as Wikipedia is concerned, I don’t believe it! It’s just an article by random internet users, anyone can post anything on Wikipedia, it only shows that Brown alums are more proud of their universities and are contributing to articles which IITians are not.
I know many people from Brown, and one of them happens to be Thane Richard, how many do you know? Let me guess some Indian like you who’s now at Brown in Elct Engg. Oh Sorry, you DON’T know him, you just happened to have an interview with him.
When you say Dartmouth>Cornell takes away my credibility, you’re just being shallow and giving in to the commonly accepted convention and rankings, so it’s like heads you win, and tails logic loses. Well played.
I vowed to not post anything, but your ignorance has somehow kindled my spark and now I vow to see this to the end.
BRING IT ON
and yes, If Dartmouth is such crap and beneath you, why did you get rejected?</p>

54

<p>And give me one proof why you think IIT students are better than those of Brown. And please don’t tell just because they cleared JEE advance they’re better. Clearing JEE advance doesn’t mean ■■■■. It’s all over hyped just because of the massive population of India. The difficulty of JEE is over-hyped just like IIT’s. Any person with above average intellect and little smart work can crack JEE. In my coaching center, FIITJEE, there are many students
who are rote learners and will get an under 1000 rank in JEE advance. Hell, I am getting 302 marks in JEE mains and let me tell you, all this is over hyped misinformation spread by people like you who over estimate the difficulty of JEE. And really, if you are preparing for JEE advance nicely and think that it’s tough, you’re really dumb.</p>

55

<p>In a research it was really proven that around 40% of Americans (could be higher) couldn’t point out their country on an Atlas, so if we Indians are dumb, those Americans are dumber. I’ll search that article/post and will get back to you soon.
and guess what, 90% of American Engineering jobs are outsourced to those rote learners (Indians and Chinese) because they’re too under qualified and stupid to do them themselves!
Suck on that for a while, get your facts straight and then we’ll talk.</p>

56

<p>Here, this is from Huffington Post:</p>

<p>Poll: 37% of Americans Unable to Locate America on Map of America</p>

<p>…Washington, D.C. – According to a Gallup/Harris poll released Monday, a full 37 percent of American citizens
are incapable of identifying their home country on a map of the United States.</p>

<p>Of the 1,400 residents surveyed, the most common incorrect responses placed the more than 230-year-old territory in the Atlantic or Pacific Oceans (19 percent), the space where Mexico would appear were it in fact included on the map (10 percent), and inside the word “America” written just above the northernmost states (6 percent).</p>

<p>“On the whole, these figures should be construed as somewhat disappointing,” Gallup spokesman Keith Ventner said. “Especially the two percent that believed the United States was located on the map’s color-coded inset legend. I think we as a nation likely could have done without seeing that.”</p>

<p>When asked to reveal the identity of the giant America-shaped landmass found on the map, several of those polled were decidedly varied in their answers.</p>

<p>“That thing definitely looked familiar,” said autoworker and father of three Ed McConnell. “And my gut told me there were probably a whole bunch of Americans there. So I had to go with ‘Iraq.’”</p>

<p>Other guesses as to the nature of the mystery country included “Hollywood,” “Palestine,” “The Shire,” and “Club Med Punta Cana.”…</p>

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<p>Oops, sorry I forgot to mention that you should have taken into account ONLY Engineering Faculty and students. No need to get ballistic over that. I just missed mentioning that. Even if you’ve included both faculty and students, it’s still wrong comparison as most of the faculty at Brown is of Arts. IIT’s are engineering institutes ONLY And the point of about IIT’s not publicizing, it’s not anybody’s fault. You may not trust wikipedia, but then you should have something else to corroborate your stance. Here, I present you with links: <a href=“http://bastilleweb.techhouse.org/”>http://bastilleweb.techhouse.org/&lt;/a&gt;
<a href=“1010! for iOS is Fun, Addictive, and Just Enough Like Tetris to Love - The Mac Observer”>http://www.macobserver.com/news/00/april/000425/wozontetris.shtml&lt;/a&gt;
You know what, both of your posts are a desperate attempt to show your point right. I am comparing students of Brown and IIT’s and you’re comparing the citizens. This is ridiculous at best. When a similar study would be conducted in India and the results will be out, we’ll then talk. We Indians are still a country who believe in feeding milk to statues thinking that god comes in them.
Can you tell me WHY Dartmouth’s better than Cornell at Engineering? Why IIT’s students are better than Brown’s? You don’t have anything to prove your wrong points. You don’t have any solid answer to these questions. Grow up and make a point by adding some mettle to it.
And why I didn’t get into Dartmouth isn’t relevant at all with the topic of discussion
PS. I NEVER said Dartmouth is crap. I, however, still say that it isn’t upto the mark of the other ivies as of yet. If it’s your fit with Dartmouth, you should choose Dartmouth over any college. But if you think you want to go to Dartmouth simply because it has got a better Engineering school, you’re gravely mistaken (as is quite apparent for you have absolutely no reasoning behind your opinions.) You have the right to have your opinion, but that doesn’t count as a fact.
PPS. Call me ignorant or whatever, that doesn’t change the fact you’re wrong.
PPPS. About the outsourcing point, I concur! Simply because those indians can’t work on their dreams and are hired by others to make the recruiter’s dream come true. Indian college students can only be employees, not engineers with creativity. They’re incompetent when it comes to creatively solve a problem. THANK YOU FOR PROVING MY POINT.</p>

58

<p>Say what you must, but I think that you’re still sour over the fact that you didn’t get accepted by any of the colleges that you applied to, and that is making you believe that somehow IITs are inferior to engineering offered at ivies, more specifically Brown, and unless you let that feeling go, we can’t have a healthy discussion.
You may have been led to believe that JEEs are easier but you should speak only for yourself, did it ever occur to you that you’re just smart? Sure I also got 2300+ on the SAT, but it was hard work (35 prep tests total).</p>

<p>As far as outsourcing goes, it says nothing about creativity, it only implies that the demand for engineers in USA far exceeds the supply and they’re forced to send their jobs abroad. and Why is that? It’s either because there aren’t enough competent engineers due to their stupidity or due to poor university education but whatever the case may be, you stand corrected. </p>

<p>Now, I’d not like to get in Debate in Dartmouth vs Cornell or Dartmouth vs Brown, because this thread is not about it, but if you still insist, just go to these links. Now I’ll admit that these are self advertised and I’d like you to know that I don’t believe them but apparently, you do, so you can visit and see.
<a href=“http://engineering.dartmouth.edu/people/faculty/core/”>Dartmouth Engineering | Faculty;
<a href=“http://www.engineering.cornell.edu/research/faculty/new.cfm?year=all”>http://www.engineering.cornell.edu/research/faculty/new.cfm?year=all&lt;/a&gt;
<a href=“http://www.brown.edu/academics/engineering/people/school-engineering-faculty-directory”>http://www.brown.edu/academics/engineering/people/school-engineering-faculty-directory&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>I’ll also admit that you didn’t say Dartmouth is crap, but you did say something along the lines of …rankings don’t factor whatever crap Dartmouth does… Now I’ve seen people having the same belief that Dartmouth is the worst of the ivies, but it’s not true, each year thousands of Indians apply to all the ivies except Dartmouth because they think it’s not good enough. I can’t say how wrong they are, it’s not a traditional school, but still ranks #10 on US News and World report, above than Brown and Cornell, and for teaching it ranks #01. So, I won’t argue any more because it’s just a common misconception which even the rankings don’t corroborate. Finally, it’s you challenging Dartmouth <a href=“Don’t%20Deny%20it,%20you%20said%20that%20only%20ivy%20not%20good%20for%20engineering%20is%20Dartmouth%20while%20debating%20for%20Brown”>b</a>**, so you’re the one who should prove that Dartmouth is inferior to the rest of ivies, not me proving otherwise. </p>

<p>Finally, My last advice to you would be find a college that suits you here, just because you’d have had a lot of activity to do in the US doesn’t mean that college here sucks but if you still want a US like education, you can always apply to unis like Ashoka, Shiv Nadar, Symbiosis School of Liberal Arts. Because college is what you make out of it,
wanna to get into a top graduate program - research the hell out during your UG years
wanna get into a top law school - ace all your classes, have a high GPA and kill your LSATs.
wanna get into a top B school - just find any internship that’ll lead to a job, work hard and get promoted there and kill your GMATs.</p>

<p>You made a mistake of applying to only top schools, and got rejected by all of them (and BTW only if you applied to a lower ranked school and gotten in at a good scholarship, you could’ve transferred later) but it’s not the time to be a sour puss but rather looking forward to your UG education. You’ll see that graduate admissions are more predictable than UG admissions. I guess I don’t have anything more to say to you.</p>

59

<p>You couldn’t be more wrong. There would not be any person happier than me if IIT’s>Brown for I couldn’t get into Brown and I’ll get into IIT for sure. So, there isn’t any sourness here.</p>

<p>Outsourcing: it has lot do with creativity! Have you ever seen IITians established Fortune 500 company? That explains a lot that they’re are job users not job creators. Americans are more bent on entrepreneurship. Has it ever occurred to you why all the Fortune 500 companies are out of major power houses like the ivies, MIT, etc? Cause they create companies, which requires creativity, and IITians are hired to work there. just a little tid bit on why IItians make such excellent employees- Do you know that there is 85% attendance rule in IIT’s? Do you know that there is LAN ban after 12 PM in IIT_Delhi? IITians are not built to challenge authorities. They do whatever the authority asks them to do. That’s why they’re not creative; the environment doesn’t foster that.</p>

<p>And about the wordings of mine “whatever the crap Dartmouth does”. I’m sorry if this has been misinterpreted. i was referring to the negative things like drinkings etc. that happen in dartmouth for which it’s been a lot in the press lately. i was not referring to Academics. I’m sorry, again.</p>

<p>Now coming to the links you gave: I’m sorry but I found the faculty equally competent. If anything, I’d be nit-picking if i were to differentiate among the quality of faculty at all these schools. let’s not water down all these great teachers by comparing them (just a small note- the best prof among all these-john Hopcroft- is a turing award winner and is at cornell. there aren’t any turing award winners wither at Dartmouth/brown) I’d be much more interested in the quality research output each of these colleges produce. I’ll be giving you the links that dartmouth lacks a lot when it comes to Research output they produce.
Dartmouth: (<a href=“http://www.topuniversities.com/node/2305/ranking-details/university-subject-rankings/2011/computer-science-and-information-systems”>http://www.topuniversities.com/node/2305/ranking-details/university-subject-rankings/2011/computer-science-and-information-systems&lt;/a&gt;) Citations Per Paper 53.30
Brown (<a href=“http://www.topuniversities.com/node/2226/ranking-details/university-subject-rankings/2014/computer-science-and-information-systems):”>http://www.topuniversities.com/node/2226/ranking-details/university-subject-rankings/2014/computer-science-and-information-systems):</a> Citations per Paper 93.70
Cornell (<a href=“http://www.topuniversities.com/node/2296/ranking-details/university-subject-rankings/2014/computer-science-and-information-systems):”>http://www.topuniversities.com/node/2296/ranking-details/university-subject-rankings/2014/computer-science-and-information-systems):</a> Citations per Paper 94.20</p>

<p>You can clearly see that quality of research at Dartmouth<<Brown~Cornell. (This isn’t even self advertised!).** I have proved that Dartmouth is worse than any other ivy when it comes to Engineering**
Your turn to prove that Dartmouth’s better than others
And thanks for the advice you gave to me :slight_smile: The rejections still hurt :(</p>

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<p>Comparing US universities to IIT is essentially like comparing apples with mangoes. On an average, you might say mangoes are superior to apples, but a specific apple (or even a basket of apples) might end up far better than rotten mangoes (or the other way around). [If you are US centric, you’d say apples and vice versa for Indians.]</p>

<p>There are mind boggling smart students in the IITs, especially the older IITs. It’s hard to get that density anywhere, in any college. These guys and women are extraordinarily gifted – and not just in academics. This is simply because of the large number of people in India, a tradition of learning (as opposed to sports), the filtering process and the lack of opportunities in other colleges in India. Density is the key word, although better would be “local density”. You probably won’t get that elsewhere (peepingtom probably means this, although he is mistaken about “stupid girls”).</p>

<p>Of course, you will also get a lot of average students (but extraordinarily hardworking) students in the IITs. They may be as bright as the average Brown, but these students have one thing in their DNA – if they want to get something, the will work their banians off. As an example, consider the Performing Arts Festival <a href=“Performing Arts Festival - Wikipedia”>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Performing_Arts_Festival&lt;/a&gt; – something totally alien to a FIITJEE cram schooler. This trait in the IITians is an outcome of the way they got in.</p>

<p>My guess is that Brown is more likely to take you to higher places (whatever that means) if you are below average (whatever that means). If true, to me, that makes Brown a better university.</p>