<p>I got into both Williams and Swarthmore, and they are my top two choices right now. For more information, I want to double major in cognitive science/neurology and a social science (though I don't know which one yet). I'm also interested in doing creative writing if I have time. Which school do you think is better?</p>
<p>As a second question, would I be able to get a job after going to either of these colleges?</p>
<p>Listen, they are both great schools. This is a decision you need to make. Neither one of them is a cookie cutter school. If you can make it to both the accepted students’ days, I think it would be a good idea. It really depends on what you are looking for. </p>
<p>As far as jobs go, I think you will be equally successful. Both are recognized schools and both have great alumni support as well. Good luck!</p>
<p>The vibe’s are really different. Williams is jocky-er and preppier while Swarthmore is intellectual and “weirder” –– while usual social norms persist at Williams, Swatties outright reject all social norms that fail to have obvious intrinsic good. Also, more of your Swarthmore classmates will head to academia, while Williams friends will more often head to industry.</p>
<p>You’ve been admitted to two absolutely outstanding schools. Congratulations and best of luck to you.</p>
<p>GvaMom is right; it really depends on what you’re looking for. One isn’t better than the other, but one may be a better fit for you, and visiting could help sort that out. You may very well feel more comfortable at one school than the other. There are different vibes to some extent. Still, to put it as nicely as possible, this is a whale of an overstatement:</p>
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<p>I’m an alum, and a parent of both a recent alum and a current student, so I’m basing that certainty on more than just my own perspective (and more than my own plus that of my cohort).</p>
<p>I’m not sure what is sufficient to qualify as a “whale of an overstatement”, but I seriously cannot think of any social norm that is easily accepted at swat without prior consideration. I’m am alum too (a recent one) – perhaps even if my claim is false in some sense, that I perceived it to be true is probably good.</p>
<p>fhimas88888888, I guess it could certainly be taken in a good light, and I’m not out to argue with the value of your own perception to you.</p>
<p>I do think that if you meant it to say something positive about students’ earnestness (or something of that nature), directly linking it to the adjective “weirder” muddies the water.</p>
<p>Swatties aren’t inherently weird people who ponder the ethics and implications of, say, greeting someone on the path to Sharples or saying “bless you” when someone sneezes. “Social norms” covers an awful lot of ground, and I think it does a disservice to somebody trying to learn about the school to paint with such a broad brush. </p>
<p>There are a lot of wonderfully deep, sensitive thinkers at Swat, but there are plenty at Williams, too.</p>
<p>I don’t know – I think Swat is a pretty “weird” place, in the way, perhaps, that Chicago is “weird”. Specifically enumerating traits sufficient for “weird” is tough, so I stick to the broad brush strokes. </p>
<p>I note that my friends and I actually discussed the origin of “bless you” at Sharples once and whether we ought to continue saying it. Also I contend this broad brush is useful for intuiting a “vibe” of the school. Indeed, Swat is a place where these discussions tend to happen (people talk about that which they’re studying over lunch, a rare thing, it seems, relative to other colleges) whereas Williams is not, it seems.</p>
<p>Well, I’d say I’m a fairly “weird” person, so it sounds to me like I’d fit in at Swarthmore a little more than at Williams. In any case, I’m not sure I’d be able to visit, so (as someone with tons of experience with that particular school), would you be able to offer any more advice/info on the matter? Thanks.</p>
<p>(Directed at Harriet, but really anyone can elaborate.)</p>
<p>briannanic,
I have one son who graduated from Swat and one who is a current junior. The current junior is far from a “weird” kid, by any definition. Very bright, but quite “normal” socially. So are many of his friends. By contrast, you could say that my older son was a brilliant but sort of weird, and a bit socially awkward, kid. My gut instinct is that over the past few years, Swat has tried to shake the weird image as much as it can, perhaps with a bit of success. We also looked at Williams with both of my kids, and it is really a fantastic school, but more “outdoorsy” with a very strong athletic program and athletic “vibe.”</p>
<p>The locations are very different, with Swarthmore’s gorgeous campus located in a suburb of a major city, Philadelphia. Williams, by contrast, is far from any major city, in a beautiful rural area. Bottom line is that these are both top-notch academic schools, but if you cannot visit, you should scour the web sites of these schools, read student blogs on the web sites, etc.</p>
<p>The Swarthmore stereotype among the tri-college (Swat, Haverford, Bryn Mawr) consortium is “hipster”. Don’t know about Williams. Campus is lovely but the adjacent town is minimal. The Media/Elwyn commuter line into 30th St station Philadelphia is right there. Both of the schools you’re deciding between have good cog. neuroscience programs last I looked, plus there are also classes at the other two tri-co schools to choose from. What you need to figure out is which commute home would be more pleasant, which social scene you favor more and how important is access to a big city when you really really want to get off campus. Academically you can’t go wrong with either school.</p>
<p>briannanic, if you really do happily and positively think of yourself as “weird,” you’re likely to see a lot of ways in which you’ll fit comfortably into the many intersecting social non-circles at Swat. Non-mainstream is genuinely welcomed and appreciated there. So is blurring of the sorts of social delineation often seen at high schools. “Normal” kids do “weird” things at Swat, and vice versa. One great example I can think of is that one year (out of the past seven when I’ve had a kid attending), the Pterodactyl was slain simultaneously by two kids, one a lacrosse captain and one who, I believe, happily self-identified as “weird.” (The “weird” one, by the way, went straight into a consulting job after graduation.)</p>
<p>I’m really only objecting to the notion that as a rule, the student body is socially awkward and not-normal. </p>
<p>I went to Swat when it still had a football team and cheerleaders; there were also lots of people who (for example) wore capes and left notes on peoples’ doors in runes. I absolutely agree with momof3sons that over the years, despite the end of the football program, the balance has tipped toward a smaller population of what many people would call overtly weird and a larger population of what many people would call overtly normal. </p>
<p>Throughout, the Quaker legacy of an atmosphere of tolerance and appreciation of diversity has kept the mix respectful and interesting. There absolutely are people who will cheerfully debate why and whether to say “bless you,” and I’m glad there are. There are also people who (though they don’t wish to offend and will change ingrained behavior in order to avoid it) are very comfortably versed in “social norms” and keep them up without debating their intrinsic worth. </p>
<p>There’s a significant difference between pondering whether a customary pleasantry might actually give offense and rejecting “all social norms that fail to have obvious intrinsic good.”</p>
<p>Hope that helps.</p>
<p>A very well known Prof at Swat spent a year at Williams and said that, all things being equal, Williams students are “happier” than Swatties. Take that as you will.</p>
<p>^^ SwatGrad was pretty normal. :D</p>
<p>Briannanic, I assume you probably have Facebook as well. Join the admitted students Facebook page. There you can see the kinds of things the EDI and EDII have been doing in the absence of other info from Swat. Maybe that will help you as well. They have also had a major video chat recently. But I go along with all the others with the Athletic versus More Diverse personae when thinking about Williams vs. Swat.</p>
<p>You may get a good idea school-wise of the wavelength you are on by this statement:</p>
<p>“There are a lot of wonderfully deep, sensitive thinkers at Swat, but there are plenty at Williams, too.”</p>
<p>I went to one of the three schools (Amherst, Williams, Swarthmore) and later to a top Ivy for grad school. Of all the schools (colleges and universities) I know in the top 5 on any ranking list, Swarthmore is the only one I know of where someone would use the term “sensitive thinker.” If you read that, got what it means without making a cognitive double-take and you related to the term, then you are much closer to your answer.</p>
<p>I had to make this same decision last year and chose swat due to athletic reasons (which were pretty stupid) but by the time you decide there will probably be some arbitrary reason you’ll choose one over the other. My best advice to you is to go on the visit to both schools and decide on how you will proceed from there.</p>
<p>I’ll be honest, Ride the Tide was a lot more fun than the Williams prospective visit.</p>
<p>Re: happiness of Williams students v. happiness of Swarthmore students, relative comparisons of happiness are perhaps misleading. Swatties love to complain, for instance, so it could be that holding happiness levels constant across schools, it may be that Swatties are just more likely to report that they’re unhappy because they generally like to complain about workload. Misery poker is a good example. </p>
<p>I have a similar background to falconflyer and very much agree with his #15 post.</p>