This is a very different message then needing to quit if you realize that you won’t be the world’s best. I might disagree about requiring children to pick only one thing, but in essence, I tell my children something similar. Do your best at whatever you endeavor.
You don’t say why you advised him to give up the racket sport. Was it something he loved? With regard to the others, I believe I would have made similar decisions. I don’t believe that talent is an obligation. If my child had no interest in something, I would not push it. In fact, that situation came up in our household as well. My D2 started flute in 4th grade with the school. The teacher noticed she had a special gift for it and we gave her private lessons. Her private teacher also noticed how gifted she was and urged her to push harder, to start working for competitions, etc. The problem was, that she didn’t love it. She was excellent at it, but it stopped bringing her joy. It broke my heart a little, because I knew I would miss hearing her play, but when she said she wanted to stop, she stopped. She turned towards other interests in science, theater and her community. Talent isn’t enough. It has to be paired with desire and drive.
On the other hand, she has been heavily involved with theater, both performing and tech, for many years. There is NO WAY that she will ever be a professional. But she loves it. It adds to her life, gives her confidence, teaches the benefit of creativity and collaboration, and many other great things. I don’t care one bit that she won’t be the best actress in the world.
I’m just totally dumbstruck reading about all your genius kids here. No way I’m going to let my kid read this thread 
My kids could work 24/7 for 20 years and I don’t think they would be nationally ranked in anything, let alone a sport, an academic pursuit and a musical instrument.
“I’m just totally dumbstruck reading about all your genius kids here. No way I’m going to let my kid read this thread”
For being “genius kids” or being “quitters”? :))
@yucca10 ,
I was wondering that myself. What these great parents do if their children, at best, were mediocre?
I bet you that “do your best” is said by most parents to their children. Whay if the children best was not good enough?
What if, not whay.
This may be the best statement of the difference between “tiger” parents and other kinds of supportive parenting. Obviously, there are millions of kids who were not raised that way, who dabbled in different hobbies, enjoyed the ECs, did sports or theater for the fun of it, and who ended up with happy and successful lives. @hsp2019 I am not sure I understand the obsession with mastering one thing, if that one thing is not something the child is actually passionate about. If a child won’t become a great musician, AND doesn’t enjoy the hours of practice, what is the point of insisting on it? This sounds like a rhetorical question, but I am genuinely curious.
I genuinely want to give all my kids the tools they need to open the doors in life that they choose to open. As each got older, they gravitated towards certain skills and interests that will probably form the basis of their majors and beginning careers. I made sure they each had the academic background to move forward as well as supporting their interests where I could. D1 is a creative, humanities type. She focused far more on her craft that on her academics (although the academics were fine). D2 loves science and medicine. She is focused far more on grades and gaining experience in her chosen field. I can’t see any way in which forcing her to continue flute so that she could wrack up some competition wins would have helped.
I do see how allowing her to do the things she enjoys (theater, fencing, community service, time with friends) has added to her life by making her happy. That is what I mean by “adding” to life. Not everything is about the future or the resume. Some things are about simply being a happy person.
“What will you do if your own children just don’t happen to be the best in the world at something? What if they are simply decent competant kids?”
This misses the point. I wanted to be the best in the world and was prepared to spend 20+ years on doing that. It required a combination of being intensely competitive and self-motivated plus working hard and enjoying what I do. And finding a sufficiently specialized field and having plenty of good luck along the way.
My kids may or may not want to do the same. Most people don’t want to and there’s no point in parents pushing you to do that, it has to come from the kid. If my kids don’t want to then that’s fine with me (so I wouldn’t qualify as a Tiger Parent by the definition above). But if they want to try then I’ll help them find something that they can succeed in, but more importantly enjoy.
And you might still be happy with your achievements without being the best in the world, it depends on the field. After all, most politicians don’t get to be President. Do you want to compete in a field of many thousands or a few hundred, or simply a few dozen? You can define it down. For example in math, being the best in a particular research speciality.
@HSP2019 since as you said in post 163 tiger parenting is working so well why do you think there is a need to sue Harvard University?
@HSP2019 You have an interesting perspective. I do understand the need to help a child cull her schedule so that she can commit time to what is truly important. My daughter loves theater but has no intention of pursuing it as a career. Theater takes up a good amount of time, but as long as it doesn’t interfere with her academics, I am happy to let her do it. Her passion is to become a doctor one day. In order to do that, she will need excellent grades, test scores and the right experiences. Most of that will take place in college, but she is working towards it now. If her theater or other activities interfered with her class work or prevented her from doing the extra things she needs (research, volunteering), I would have her cut back. But as long as she is doing well, she is free to pursue the hobbies she enjoys. Of course, we all have our own definition of “doing well.” I would not pull her out of the school play because she didn’t maintain a 4.0 average. But there is a level where I would draw the line.
My question for you is, what would you do if your son wanted to pursue an activity just for the fun of it. He didn’t want to devote endless hours to it, but just wanted it as a hobby? What if, for example, he wanted to do the school play? Would you allow that?
“tiger parenting is incredible effective in elite college admissions” Where is the fact based analysis to back this up.
“you should try and get the referee fired” Why in heavens name would you want to do that? It is called piling on and gloating
@HSP2019 I don’t think we are that different after all. By the way, I am also a very large proponent of deodorant.
@HSP2019 in regards to your post 213 where is your causal inference analysis? 50 per cent of the students at elites are males . That doesnt mean if you are male you have a 50 per cent chance of getting into an elite
@TiggerDad for genius kids, naturally. He’s doing fairly well, in our opinion, enough to have a shot at the best school, but nowhere near that level, and he’s fretting enough about admissions as it is.
He’s done his share of quitting (and I did a whole lot more when I was younger, not too happy about this now). The only thing I’ve ever insisted on regarding ECs was any sport at least once a week, for health. Not too onerous, and he’s tried several before he settled on the one he loved, but he’s not really competitive anyway. The rest of the ECs in high school he chose himself, with a lot of input from his “tiger friends” who are great kids but not shining stars on a national level and not working 24/7 either. Some of these things he does with the understanding that he can reach a decent level at best, like debate. He was a terrible, terrible speaker in middle school, and joined a debate club to rectify the situation, in fact over the objection of several family members who thought only STEM pursuits to be worthwhile. He worked really hard for 3 years, mostly losing, but when he eventually qualified for a state tournament, I thought this was an outstanding achievement even if it by itself didn’t count for much. Yes, this took a lot of time he could use to improve more in the areas where he has more natural ability. I still think this was a more valuable use of time, nurturing growth mindset and confidence, but on the other hand he could have been ranked nationally on math or science if he tried harder. It’s really not an easy choice, and I never felt I could make this choice for my son.
Why do we have so many competitions for.young people anyways? Adults rarely compete in organized competitions. Do the competitions serve any purpose beyond the event itself? We have multiple kids in our area excelling at Chem,math, physics Olympiads. Spelling and geography bees. National History Day. And in our area it is primarily 1 or 2 gen immigrant children competing. What is the end result? Just a feather in the parental cap?
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I assume you do it for you and your parents don’t put your trophies in their living room and would not be disappointed if you quit?
A part of the answer to your question regarding competition, in relation particularly to Tiger parenting, can be found in my post #130 (pg. 9).
In general, though, competition has its own universal merits. Why do people climb Mt. Everest at the grave risk of losing their lives? While some might answer a Zen like, “because it’s there,” I’m sure most would answer, “because of the personal challenge and the thrill.” It’s like that with competitions. I grew up competing in athletics, martial arts in particular and later in more mainstream sports. My dream was to be an Olympian as the ultimate experience as an athlete. I know first hand the glory of winning and the agony of defeat, and I just loved competition in general. So naturally I introduced my own kids to various competitions beginning with swimming, tennis, Taekwondo, violin, as well as some academic competitions, too. They enjoyed them all with varying degrees of satisfaction and results. If they hadn’t, I would never have had them continue. Swimming competitions, too, they enjoyed. The only reason for quitting is that they didn’t enjoy the training part of it.
Again, whether competitions are enjoyable and highly beneficial to a personal growth or not depends on each individual. I know some folks who hate any kind of competitions while others need the adrenaline rush on a regular basis. Whether competitions are means to a “feather in the parental cap,” that, too, depends on the parents. Some parents like to live vicariously off of their children while other parents value individualistic growth for their children with clear awareness that they’re different beings.
“Again, whether competitions are enjoyable and highly beneficial to a personal growth or not depends on each individual. I know some folks who hate any kind of competitions while others need the adrenaline rush on a regular basis.”
Isn’t that the point. Some people, both kids and adults, are intensely competitive. They thrive on competitions, high stakes testing, etc. whereas others do not. Pushing kids your kids to compete for the sake of it, when they don’t want to, is a bad idea. But if they really want to, by all means encourage it (or more likely just look on in awe). That may look to some from the outside like Tiger Parenting. But really it isn’t the same at all.