<p>Hello all you ivy league hopefuls. I am one of you, waiting for decision with bated breath. I only recently discovered college confidential, long after I had already applied to both Princeton and Harvard. Had I discovered this site before my application, and posted a chances thread, I would have been effectively torn apart by this community, as my scores are not 2200+. The fact that people post threads here with ridiculously high numbers really just shows that a) they want to brag, or b) they are lying. Of course option c exists, that is, they are just the overly paranoid type, but in reality the chance threads are, for the most part, absolutely pointless. I say this to anyone who has or may in the future post a chance thread; applying to any of these schools is usually a long shot, so posting a chance thread on here will not help you to make a better decision about applying or preparing. In fact, it could hurt you. I will post some hard facts here, and be done with it. These are the Sat scores for students in the 25-75% range in the ivy league schools (excluding Cornell, because it looks at only two subjects). Brown, 1980-2310, Columbia, 2050-2320, Dartmouth, 2010-2310, Harvard, 2080-2370, Penn, 1980-2250, Princeton, 2000-2280, Yale, 2080-2370. There are 25% of people at these schools who have lower than these scores. So stop these chance threads; if what most of you say is true, then you should be fine. Princeton 2014 hopeful!!! (This thread was, in part, to give hope to those who applied and are waiting who underestimted their chances :) )</p>
<p>you fail to take notice that the 2000 area you mentioned in your post is largely reserved for athletes, legacies, and other “hooked” students. Many applicants do not have any of these advantages, and thus need the 2200+, which is simply expected of many unhooked white/asian applicants.</p>
<p>Anon,</p>
<p>The middle 50% number that you cite are for students that matriculate. The ranges for admitted students are slightly higher, by perhaps 20-50 points. Admitees with high scores are more likely to have other attractive options and go elsewhere. Consequently more of these high caliber students are admitted. On the lower end of the range students are very likely to to matriculate and fewer with are admitted.</p>
<p>The chances threads are students asking about probabilities, not possibilities. Any thing is possible, but probabilities vary greatly.</p>
<p>I would agree wholeheartedly with your central point: “posting a chance thread on here will not help you to make a better decision about applying or preparing.”</p>
<p>note: your numbers for Princeton, 2000-2280, must be old. They are closer to Yale and Harvard.</p>
<p>Hey Anonymityy, my sat scores are not exactly Princeton standard and I have no hook… but I’m not affraid or fearful. The SAT does not dictate the person you are, and Princeton is much more interested in the person behind the score. Good luck to you!</p>
<p>you fail to take notice that the 2000 area you mentioned in your post is largely reserved for athletes, legacies, and other “hooked” students. Many applicants do not have any of these advantages, and thus need the 2200+, which is simply expected of many unhooked white/asian applicants.</p>
<p>No, I dont fail to take notice of this. Honestly, it depends on what you assume the numbers are for hooked students. 12,7% are legacies, 6.8% are Hispanic, .5% are Native American, and 7.3% are African American (if you can even consider them hooked). I would guess about 10% are athletes, but that number isnt available. So we have 37.3% of the students being hooked. If these are the students that the lower SAT scores are reserved for, that still leaves quite a large score range still available for under 2200 scores, not to mention this is assuming that all of the hooked people have these low scores. </p>
<p>Standrews: note: your numbers for Princeton, 2000-2280, must be old. They are closer to Yale and Harvard.</p>
<p>No, these are the 2009-2010 admission statistics. As far as what you said about the matriculation of the students, I suppose you have a good point.</p>
<p>per 09-10 common data set
690-790 CR
700-790 M
700-780 W</p>
<p><a href=“http://registrar.princeton.edu/university_enrollment_sta/common_cds2009.pdf[/url]”>http://registrar.princeton.edu/university_enrollment_sta/common_cds2009.pdf</a></p>
<p>Rightly so, you make a good point criticizing the ridiculous standards held here. But also keep in mind the number of students who receive top scores vs. (even slightly) lower scores. I’ll make my example with the ACT (just because the score categories are easier to compare): 600 or fewer kids receive a 36, about 4,000 a 35, and then about 11,000 or so a 34. When you see a middle 50% range of, say, 32-34, you get the idea of the types of scores most students received. However, a whole 25% of the grade may have/has a 35 or 36. With respect to numbers of other students who have received those scores, a much greater proportion of recipients vs. admitted students lies within the top scores. Like people have said, advice is given by probabilities. Certainly a good student with a score in the 50% range could apply and very realistically get in (clear evidence of the actual score range), but they’re also chosen from a much greater pool of those with similar scores than the ‘top’ scorers are. </p>
<p>That being said, many on this site also hate being wrong, so they are much more conservative when dishing out “chances”.</p>
<p>High-match. Chance back?</p>
<p>The lower 25% is not “reserved” for people with hooks; it’s just that the average SAT scores are lowered by these. If you do not have any of these hooks, it’s best to shoot for a SAT score that’s slightly higher than the mean; to be safe, shoot for the 75th. The chance threads are obviously subjective and bogus, but often, it does give a sense of how the colleges will react to your application although it’s very very general. It’s mostly for common sense since if you have a 2000 SAT score, normal ECs, normal esays, and etc., you likely will not get in.
Also notice that people with the lower end SAT scores are people that excel highly in other aspects of the application. This means that you can’t shoot for the 25th for the SAT with normal ECs and etc. and expect a high chance of getting in. To be honest, the most useful thread in understanding how you fare to other applicants is to look at last year’s thread that shows who got in and who got deferred.</p>