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However, those schools have chosen to add their own shuttles during peak student travels times to help their students
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<p>This is what I meant when I said the operative word in your quote was Yale. Yale decided to pick up the tab to run extra shuttle services for their students outside of what the private lines are running.</p>
<p>If you are looking for additional shuttle service as I said before, the answer is not petitioning the bus companies or even the first year office at Dartmouth. I think students should be raising their concerns to the student assembly (SA = student government). Each class has a present and SA representatives. Perhaps your son might consider becoming a SA rep and being on the student life or student services committee where he can raise the issue.</p>
<p>When there are additional buses that go to NYC for Thanksgiving, Christmas and spring break, it is SA who coordinates that effort. They find out how much it is going to cost to get busses to go to NYC. Then based on the cost of the bus, they pass the cost back to the student. I remember my D's freshman year it was $35 a set (I am quite sure it has gone up). The bus service meets a need and the students are charged a fee where it is cost effective and the bus probably pays for itself.</p>
<p>What I am trying to say (I guess not well) is that the students who need shuttle service to manchester should petition to SA about using some of their funds (because we do pay student fees with the tuition bill) to get shuttle buses to go to Manchester during peak vacation periods. But be prepared, even when there is a shuttle service, they may be a chance the shuttle is not going when you want to go. I think my D took the bus to NYC once, because of exam schedule so we had the exact opposite problem where it cost us an arm and a leg to book a flight on a puddle jumper from Manchester to NYC where with some planning she could get a jet blue ticket for ~$59 (sometimes cheaper).</p>
<p>I guess what surprises me is, given its remote location and the well-known problems with Dartmouth Coach and Greyhound (formerly Vermont Transit), that Dartmouth does not take a greater interest in this issue. Their students are missing flights and being left at the airports because the buses are full. I would hope the administration (not the student government) at any school would take some kind of action to assist their students. If Dartmouth's rivals, located in cities, can do it, why can't Dartmouth? By the way, Yale charges for its shuttle service.</p>
<p>Another option is to carpool.. I'm pretty sure that there's some sort of carpooling system that started a little while ago to help with this. I don't think that the way to find the solution is to say "well, Yale does this, why doesn't Dartmouth?" Yale does a lot of things that Dartmouth doesn't, just as Dartmouth does a lot of things that Yale doesn't. The bottom line is this: it costs more money to travel in rural areas because the demand for the service is lower. Yes, Harvard and Yale have shuttles.. however, look at the areas that the campuses are in. It would cost Dartmouth a lot more to bus students to and from Logan and Manchester than it does for Yale to run a shuttle. It's not like Dartmouth is strapped for money, but it's something for Student Assembly to handle, not the administration.</p>
<p>It seems like the answer would be chartered buses like the one SA runs to NYC on breaks. I'm not sure if they only run one, but they run out of space fast. I'm asking son to talk to SA and figure out the possibilities.</p>
<p>We had 10 Dartmouth students in and out of our Vermont house this past break. I was surprised that the majority flew out of Manchester, not Boston. </p>
<p>There is also a new airline that flys between Boston and Lebanon airport for $60. Wish it flew to NYC like the last airline did!</p>
<p>On a side note, there is a rumor going around (I think it's above rumor, but still not official) that Dartmouth might be starting a 'Dartmouth Coach' route to NYC. That will be really convenient for a lot of students. (But it would still make more sense for people to fly into Boston or Lebanon...)</p>
<p>coteee - I am only using Yale as a reference because I have a D there also so I have first hand knowledge. I know Yale has a travel service office and website and, in addition to organizing extra shuttles, they also have arranged discounts with the bus lines and private airport limo companies for their students and employees. The distance/time from Yale to JFK and Bradley airport in Hartford is the same as from Dartmouth to Logan and Manchester. My point being that Yale has made an effort to make travel easier for their students. Maybe this is not feasible for Dartmouth. I don't know. But I'm sure those students who missed a flight or were left at the airport because the bus was full, think otherwise. I have a freshman at Dartmouth so I am new to the community and all I know is that arranging her travel for Thanksgiving and winter break was an exercise in frustration. The First Year Office was no help and dealing with Greyhound and trying to find out the bus schedule was a nightmare. For Thanksgiving my D took a private car/limo to the airport with another student because Greyhound was only running 2 buses during the day to the airport and they told me they usually fill up and you can't reserve a seat. That transportation cost more than her flight. On her return trip from winter break she waited 2 hours at the airport for the bus and couldn't get on because it was full. Fortunately she was with a friend. I have no idea if there is a solution but I think something could be done to make travel easier and less stressful. I also don't think the fact that Dartmouth is in a rural area should be used as an excuse. If anything, it seems that would be more of a reason for them to do something.</p>
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I live in Maine and the flight from my airport to Logan is 30 minutes, but a round trip flight is $400! (On a 40 seat plane x.x) It's way cheaper for me to take a bus from here to Boston, then the Dartmouth Coach.. it's about $240 round trip that way versus $520. I wish that I could drive!
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<p>Next year you may be able to carpool on breaks, at least to the Portland area. There are plenty of Maine students at D. We haven't gotten our S to ask anyone about carpooling either way yet, but he's the introverted type. ;)</p>
<p>what about flying out of Burlington, VT? ... it's about the same distance from Dartmouth as Manchester .., if there is a direct flight from your town to Burlington (not a lot of possibilities) it might work well.</p>
<p>It's getting to the airport that's the problem, not getting a flight. Check this out Williams</a> Transport. This is what Williams College organizes for the students. This is at a school of less than 2000 students and a very rural location, maybe even more rural than Dartmouth. You can reserve on-line and are guaranteed a spot and bus fare is charged to your student bill ($20 to Albany-1 hour, $31 to Boston - 3 hrs and NYC - 3 1/2 hrs). Again these shuttles are in addition to the long list of transportation options listed on their general website.</p>
<p>In the big scheme of things it doesn't matter who offers what. If Dartmouth doesn't offer it, it does't offer it and until they do offer it (be prepared for the fact that it may not happen), then you are going to have to work with what you have.</p>
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I also don't think the fact that Dartmouth is in a rural area should be used as an excuse. If anything, it seems that would be more of a reason for them to do something.
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<p>Playing devils advocate here. </p>
<p>My question is why do you feel that Dartmouth should do something about this? When one applies to Dartmouth, they know that the school is in rural NH and the school is not moving. They also know or should know what services the school provides. If it isn't offered when you apply, and it becomes available ,then its all good. If not, you cna't assume that it is going to be offered or it should be offered because you are now there.</p>
<p>For some Hanover is a draw and others consider it a barrier and may not feel that it is worth attending. At the end of the day the school is not responsible for making sure that my child gets to and from Hanover. I need to look at the transportation available and see if it is a system I could live with. If there is only one bus leaving dodge, and the bus leaves at noon, she cannot sashay over to the bus at 11:55 and expect to get a seat because theoretically she was on time for the bus. My D needs to make sure she puts enough time in her schedule so she catches the bus or make sure she has another way to get her flight. This may mean standing on line way ahead of time to ensure she gets a seat on the bus. Transportation issues happen all of the time, some with in our control some out of our control.</p>
<p>When looking at transportation options and how my D was going to get back and forth out of Hanover, I knew before she came to school that Greyhound only ran 2 buses a day to NYC. So her first year, I made sure that she took a different route (greyhound, amtrack, plane out of boston, plane out of west leb and the Dartmouth bus to NYC). I felt the more important thing was that she not be dependent on one mode to transportation and that she knew multiple ways of getting home. This way she wasn't dependent on the 2 greyhound buses to NYC or the one daily amtrack train from white river junction.</p>
<p>Sybbie calm down and stop getting so defensive. This is not a personal attact on you. Excuse me for wanting to make things easier for the students there. When we looked at Dartmouth initially Vermont Transit was in existence and ran more buses. That is not the case now. Even with Dartmouth Coach to Logan, which runs more buses, there are issues. I guess your point is that Dartmouth just doesn't care how their students get to and from campus and whether there are problems. Personally, I would like to be the devil's advocate and assume that is not the case.</p>
<p>Not upset, not feeling defensive as my D has graduated so getting to Hanover is no longer an issue in our house. I also don't think that it is not a matter of Dartmouth not caring about their students and how they get home. Perhaps they don't see it as an issue because many year over year students fly in and out of manchester and most without incident.</p>
<p>As I said on a few other occassions in this thread, if it is an issue that needs to be addressed, perhaps your child should raise the issue to her class president or the SA reps for her class. But if your D is not saying anything and other students are not saying anything and just going along with the status quo, then change is not going to happen.</p>
<p>You are absolutely right that the kids and the administrators are too smart not to fix the problem. But if the kids are not speaking out, railing over the issue nothing is going to change (remember at the end of the day, the administration is getting in their cars and driving home in the upper valley)</p>
<p>When D first to Dartmouth, there were no additional buses going to NYC.<br>
During freshman year, the NYC people spoke out, SA sent out a survey asking if they ran buses going to NYC during the breaks and holdiays how many students would take it. Based on the responses, they saw that there was a need and now there are buses that go to NYC outside of the normal transit system (perhaps there should be more, but unless someone brings the issue up, it probably is not going to happen).</p>
<p>I agree Sybbie and have suggested that DS and his friend make this happen. The irony of what you say is that SA is still not managing the NYC bus situation well. We actually arranged a large van for 9 students who were too late for the Thanksgiving bus. And those were just immediate, first year acquaintances of DS. Makes me doubt SA is the route to go here.</p>
<p>hmom5 - that's my concern too and why I think the admin should be involved. I do agree that the students (and the parents perhaps too since it impacts us also whether travel plans go awry) should speak up. I don't think it would hurt to bring up what Williams, in a remote area, and other schools organize either. At the least the school could look into the matter and possibly talk to the other schools to see how they made it happen. It might not work for Dartmouth but we'll never know unless someone tries. I did speak to someone in the First Year Office who showed no interest whatsoever. As my D is only a freshman, I do not know what would be the most effective way to address this concern. Is there some type of parent organization at Dartmouth?</p>
<p>I've been wondering the same, longroad. Also wondering which dean's office might be most logical as this effects more than just first year students. It's just amazing to me this was not addressed a long time ago. </p>
<p>On a side note, as an employer, I have a recruiting trip to Dartmouth with no more direct flights to Lebanon from NYC! My assistant tells me the choices are charter a plane, fly to Boston and transfer or drive! Has anyone wondered how all this will effect recruiting?</p>
<p>hmom5 - are there any direct flights into Manchester for you? The airport there is very manageable, less air traffic problem, less rush hour driving problems and in-terminal car rental. Having gone to college in Boston, I am not a big fan of Logan airport and Boston traffic.
That's a good question about the recruiting and whether the travel issues impact such efforts. I would like to believe that the wonderful new employees that the employers recruit from their Dartmouth visits make it worth any travel aggravation and keeps them coming back :)</p>
<p>I don't know about the general Dartmouth student body, but I know that out of the 45 - 50 people I visited campus with, less than 10 kids flew into Boston.. way more flew into Manchester. The Boston-Lebanon flight costs the same as it does to ride the Dartmouth Coach and takes less time? Cool. I know quite a few Mainers that go to Dartmouth now.. one lives like, ten miles from me. </p>
<p>It seems to me like this thread is spinning its wheels here. Obviously, transportation to and from Dartmouth is not the most convenient, but it's unrealistic to expect the college to take the responsibility of providing the caliber of transportation that we all would like to see. The fact that some people get stranded, etc. is horrible, don't get me wrong, but Hanover isn't exactly on the way to most places on the East Coast, so less ridership = less transportation options. </p>
<p>I actually thought that Dartmouth students had good transportation options considering where the college is located... usually, a town of ~10,000 people doesn't get the attention from bus companies that Hanover/Lebanon do. I agree with Sybbie -- it doesn't really matter who can express their points more eloquently on this thread; unless someone involved in the Dartmouth community DOES something about it, change isn't going to happen.</p>