<p>Nspeds--why, are you the prospective law student? Or what are you insinuating?</p>
<p>Harvard2400-- Actually, sorry, but I wouldn't. I don't like the South. I've been there many times and I really don't like it. I don't think Duke's departments are really superior to Berkeley's anyway. </p>
<p>I would however pick Oxford over any American university. I love Europe.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Um, you idiot. Harvard2400 hasn't even applied to any schools yet.</p>
<p>And you picked VANDERBILT over Berkeley? Or what school DID you pick over it? Please don't tell me Vanderbilt, please don't tell me Vanderbilt.</p>
<p>( I picked Berkeley over U Penn. )</p>
<p>Ok, never mind. You picked USC over Berkeley? Are you mad woman/man??</p>
<p>USC? OVER Berkeley, and UCLA maybe??</p>
<p>Are you serious? DId you even get into Berkeley?
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Wow aren't you flustered? </p>
<p>Before calling me an idiot, settle down, breathe to 10, and re-read my post again. Where did I mention that he was already at Vanderbilt? I said, "wants to go to a school", meaning he's not already there yet. </p>
<p>Yes, isn't that a shocker? Must baffle your mind. I chose USC Marshall over Berkeley Haas. Am I mad you ask? Well, let's see here are some reasons why I chose USC:</p>
<ol>
<li> Far better alumni network.<br></li>
<li> Smaller classrooms. </li>
<li> Direct mentoring.</li>
<li> More attention as a student.</li>
<li> School Spirit.<br></li>
<li> I thought the whole, "Berkeley Goggles" thing was a joke, until I actually visited the campus for a weekend and saw the girls.<br></li>
<li> SC's highly rated Career Planning & Placement</li>
<li> Lifelong ties: Programs that bring alumni back to school, regional alumni clubs, etc.<br></li>
<li> Oh and a kick arse football team.</li>
</ol>
<p>You make it sound like I picked a state school over an IVY or something. I picked a #9 business school over a #3 business school. Big deal. </p>
<p>Sorry for thinking things through and finding a school that matched my personality and expectations out of college.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Nspeds--why, are you the prospective law student? Or what are you insinuating?
[/quote]
</p>
<p>A cursory glance at its placement statistics in Top 15 law schools hints that other schools ranked lower and higher might be better in the same respect.</p>
<p>Georgetown matriculated one more student in HLS than Berkeley; however, the class size of Georgetown is significantly smaller.</p>
<p>Ironically enough, the highest matriculation rates in the preponderance of Top 15 Law Schools are from their own undergraduate schools, whereas UCBerleley students do not constitute the preponderance of matriculating students at BOALT.</p>
<p>afterhourse: "I picked my school over Berkeley as well, and I haven't had a single regret since. Goodluck to you."</p>
<p>Ok by saying "I picked my school over Berkeley AS WELL" you are implying that Harvard2400 had already chosen a school over Berkeley...as well. </p>
<p>And ok I'll start with the obvious--football team? Berkeley's team was ranked 4th this past year, and what kind of reason is that to go to school? </p>
<p>And if you wanted a good alumni network, you should have attended UCLA. They have the best.</p>
<p>And Berkeley's "Goggles"..morelike Haas*oles. You have the wrong stereotype for business school.</p>
<p>After reading your post, I assume you are a graduate student. Well ok fine, although Berkeley's Haas is ranked above USC's business school, your reasons are somewhat understandable. Somewhat.</p>
<p>Nspeds--</p>
<p>Your website proves nothing. It doesn't show how many applications from each school Harvard received, nor does it show the admit rate. So you basically have proven nothing. And who says that just as many Berkeley students would want to even attend law school as Georgetown?</p>
<p>Relativity my little friend, relativity.</p>
<p>What's all this hatred against Vanderbilt? It is currently ranked (I believe, I'm too lazy to check) #18 or #19 in the nation. And since I don't believe that matters, let's not forget that it has a low student to faculty ration with tons of personal attention for students, a campus that's a national arboretum, a spectacular reputation that is only going to rise in coming years, a location in an amazingly unique city, and a great social life! </p>
<p>I visited Berkeley and couldn't STAND it. None of the buildings matched at all--the campus was hideous! I was definately turned off by the hobos who were actually sitting on campus. Actually, I wasn't sure if they were hobos or just extremely hippy-ish liberal students. The classes are huge and the professors simply have too much research/too many students to really care about you. </p>
<p>Berkeley didn't meet a single one of my criteria for a school I wanted to attend. Vanderbilt, however, matched all of them. </p>
<p>This is because I AM A DIFFERENT PERSON THAN YOU. And I want different things than you. And while Berkeley is a great fit for you, I was turned off by everything about it. And while you dislike Vanderbilt, I found it to be the perfect environment for me. So whatever the rankings say (although they currently say that Vandy is "better" than Cal), we are all entitled to our opinions of what schools are "the best".</p>
<p>He meant Gtown students in HLS, not Gtown Law</p>
<p>semiserious--wait, you're saying we're NOT identical twins or you're not my clone or me yours?</p>
<p>Wow, an epiphany for moi.</p>
<p>Anyway, fair enough. </p>
<p>But I still stand by what I said that Vanderbilt isn't as well-known as Berkeley, for many reasons.</p>
<p>And I'm not the only one against Vanderbilt in the top 25.. Look at the other posts.</p>
<p>Thethoughtprocess--I know what he meant.</p>
<p>I'm saying he thinks Berkeley students are just as likely to theoretically desire to go to law school as Georgetown students. There is one more Georgetown grad at HLS than Berkeley grads.</p>
<p>But why would he assume that both universities' students share the exact same proportional desire to attend law school?</p>
<p>The argument is statistically faulty.</p>
<p>
[quote]
It doesn't show how many applications from each school Harvard received, nor does it show the admit rate.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Since you are intransigent, I did the homework for you:</p>
<p><a href="http://career.berkeley.edu/Law/lawStats.stm%5B/url%5D">http://career.berkeley.edu/Law/lawStats.stm</a>
Since we wish to compare the same years: For 2003, Harvard admitted 3 students out of 64.</p>
<p><a href="http://careerweb.georgetown.edu/law/numbers.html%5B/url%5D">http://careerweb.georgetown.edu/law/numbers.html</a>
Likewise, Harvard admitted 18 out of 129 applicants from Georgetown. </p>
<p>Even worse, these are the median stats for students admitted into Harvard:
Georgetown: 172/3.82
UCB: 171/3.98</p>
<p>This implies that students from UCB must endure two setbacks: first, the lower overall admit rate, and second, the absurdly high GPA that must be attained to have even a remote chance.</p>
<p>wow I got 2 warnings from moderators and I can still post..whew...</p>
<p>But Zizooop, you are seriously trying to boost Berkeley like insanely high. So what if Sandy Cohen from The O.C. went to Berkely Law School. That doesn't make it amazing. But seriously, Berkeley is a good school that was once amazing...just like UMichigan. I say this when we are comparing UGrad. Look at michigan- it has almost every field in the top 10 grad school list but it itself is 21 on USNEWS. The same is going for Berkeley, which trust me I would love to go to for grad school. But in essence, for undergrad, people arent feeling the vibe anymore to attend a large university.</p>
<p>..Take another example- JHU- great med school but when you read about the pre-med and its ultra-competitive cutthroat atmosphere where there is this ridiculous screening process for med school applicants, its not a place you wanna be for UGRAD. Sure, like Berkely, its grad schools are hyped up. But I would not want to go there.</p>
<p>Its not statistically faulty, just has loose reasoning</p>
<p>Even if twice the percentage of kids at Gtown applied to HLS compared to Berkeley, Gtown would still win out since its student body is half the size. Berkeley has lots of social science students, so it would be suprising if such a small portion of the students wanted to attend law school. Of course, you may be right, data showing in actual acceptance rate would be better.</p>
<p>That all being said, I never really heard of Vanderbilt either; then again, I never heard about Berkeley too much since I live on the East Coast, but both seem to have comparable student bodies judging by a quick search of facts on collegeboard.</p>
<p>Edit: nspeds confirmed what I guessed lol</p>
<p>Oh, I wasn't necessarily talking to you, Zip. A few people on this board have been arguing that Vanderbilt does not deserve to be in the top 25, with which I wholeheartedly disgaree. Vanderbilt truly is the total college package. Not only does it have challenging academics and strong student-professor relationships, it also has sports teams, school spirit, parties, and all of the other things that make college, well, college.</p>
<p>I agree that Vanderbilt is not as well known as Berkeley and I believe the main reason is it's location--many people hear Tennessee and immediately end the conversation. It's really quite unfortunate.</p>
<p>However, I must argue that I believe this will be reversed in 10 to 20 years. Vanderbilt is clearly on the rise, and it's prestige on the national scale will only continue to increase.</p>
<p>Of course, one could always argue that UCB students prefer to stay in California. So here are Stanford Law School's numbers:
Applied/Admitted:
Georgetown: 85/7
UCB: 66/2</p>
<p>Mean GPA/LSAT:
Georgetown: 168/3.85
UCB: 169/4.12</p>
<p>Do not even think about about disputing the GPA scale; all undergraduate GPAs are 'universalized' by the LSAC.</p>
<p>Damn 4.12 is the mean??!?!?! Holy crap. 85 applied and 7 got in at Gtown? Stanford is nuts! I bet they all had 3.8+ 165+ LSATS. I am so intimidated right now...seriously.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Damn 4.12 is the mean??!?!?!
[/quote]
</p>
<p>I agree; I wonder how many students at UCB can actually attain that GPA. With so many students and so few slots the competition must be fierce.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Ok by saying "I picked my school over Berkeley AS WELL" you are implying that Harvard2400 had already chosen a school over Berkeley...as well.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Wait a minute, so a school can only be chosen once you set foot on campus as a student? I chose USC over UCLA 2 years before I even sent my application to USC admissions. You see, the key factor here was the fact that I mentioned, "wants to go to a school" first. Thus, using "as well" later makes sense because I've already made it known I'm speaking from the not-admitted-but-choosing standpoint. But hey, let's not argue about semantics, because it's rather pointless. </p>
<p>
[quote]
And ok I'll start with the obvious--football team? Berkeley's team was ranked 4th this past year, and what kind of reason is that to go to school?
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Did you completely miss the 8 other reasons? Hmmm, what kind of reason is that? Well let's see, I'm flying with my friends to the Hawaii game next month, then Notre Dame a few months later, and finally taking a road trip up to good ole Berkeley for the weekender. You know, I think I'm going to look back when I'm 50 years old and say, "Hey man, do you remember our 1st trip to South Bend, Indiana? Remember how we laughed at those silly Irish fans after our 50 to 7 romp?" with fond memories. I just don't think I'll say the same about some theory shown on the overhead.... hmm nope. </p>
<p>
[quote]
And if you wanted a good alumni network, you should have attended UCLA. They have the best.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Hehe. Well if this was a test and there were 4 possible answers to the question, "Which of the following are true for Zipzoopzabulous?"</p>
<p>(a) He/she lives/lived in Southern California
(d) He/she knows about networking and the schools best known for it</p>
<p>A & D would be crossed off for sure. </p>
<p>
[quote]
And Berkeley's "Goggles"..morelike Haas*oles. You have the wrong stereotype for business school.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Hmm I don't get this part of your post. I was referring to "Goggles" as in, the girls are so aesthetically displeasing that I have to wear these Berkeley Goggles to make them look right. </p>
<p>
[quote]
After reading your post, I assume you are a graduate student. Well ok fine, although Berkeley's Haas is ranked above USC's business school, your reasons are somewhat understandable. Somewhat.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Undergrad. We both have UG business programs.</p>
<p>Actually Devil, when UCB students apply to graduate school, like for example at Stanford Law, they have to add to our unweighted GPAs because our GPAs are not inflated, unlike Ivy League grads'. </p>
<p>It's actually impossible to get above a 4.0 while studying at Berkeley, because an A+ here simply means 4.0. Thus, this proves that grad schools--at least Stanford-- have to add to our GPAs.</p>
<p>I like Columbia's admit rate for Berkeley students. And I like NYC....</p>
<p>afterhours--if you had even applied to Berkeley to become an undergraduate, you'd realize you CAN NOT directly apply to Haas.</p>
<p>You have to complete your first two years before you can apply to Haas, taking into account your success in its prerequisites.</p>
<p>Thus I believe you did not actually apply to Berkeley, because you implied you chose USC's business school over Haas (which you couldn't have applied to anyway as a high school graduate).</p>
<p>
[quote]
Actually Devil, when UCB students apply to graduate school, like for example at Stanford Law, they have to add to our unweighted GPAs because our GPAs are not inflated, unlike Ivy League grads'. </p>
<p>It's actually impossible to get above a 4.0 while studying at Berkeley, because an A+ here simply means 4.0. Thus, this proves that grad schools--at least Stanford-- have to add to our GPAs.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>If you did your homework, you would know that the LSAC converts the GPAs of all students applying to law school.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I like Columbia's admit rate for Berkeley students. And I like NYC....
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Good luck...</p>
<p>Applied/Admitted/Percentage:
Georgetown: 185/35/19%
UCB: 76/8/11%</p>
<p>Median GPA/LSAT:
Georgetown: 171/3.73
UCB: 170/3.76</p>
<p>Edit: Georgetown is ranked 25, by the way.</p>