@Roentgen … would it possible to address a few questions to you regarding the UMKC program one on one via email or phone? I realize you are busy and this might not work out. Advance thanks!
if any of you were waitlisted in the past, how long did it take to hear back?
Hey @naive101, I’m happy to address any questions regarding the UMKC BA/MD program either in the thread or by private message through CC. Just click on my CC username on the left hand side of my post and then click on the orange “Message” button.
@nerdgal123,Deadline to accept the offer is May 1st. I assume most of the applicants do not send declines and you need to wait till 1st week of May.
@sgnyc, @nerdgal123, correct, the coming off the waitlist process will start after May 1st when people that have received an acceptance have made their decision. Depending on what their options are, they might either find a better fitting Bachelor/MD program, or decide that a normal 4 year undergraduate education is better vs. the compromises they’re making by doing the UMKC BA/MD program. It varies from year to year, but it can be anywhere from no movement to quite a bit of movement when it comes to the waitlist for each applicant (in-state, regional, out-of-state) pool.
Dear @Roentgen - I am very new here, so it seems I lack messaging privileges. But I had a few specific questions:
1.) Since UMKC is not a top run school, can it mean that some students might not get residencies/ eventual job offers? (that would be most terrible with a 300-400 K loan!). Can joblessness or the inability to pay the fee loans be a real possibility with a medical degree from schools like UMKC, esp. for students who expect to be in top half of the class?
[I apologize for sounding negative here, just want to ask you opinion as a knowledgeable party; we know grads from our area who seem to have done well and have heard of others who have given up Brown, Caltech admissions to come to this program. So the pool of students seems quite good- but i have no clue about this profession so was hoping for your insights].
- Relative to matches at other mid-rung school, especially in state/ regional schools like Mizzou, Oklahoma etc, would you characterize UMKC placements (residency matches) as 1) same as average from those schools or 2) marginally inferior or iii) Much worse than average from those schools, in comparative terms?
Thanks very much @Roentgen - Have benefited much from your posts as a naive parent!
Good question, @naive101. I don’t think you sound negative at all. I think it helps very much to be realistic & I’m happy to help, esp. those who don’t have a relative or someone close by in the medicine profession to explain the physician pathway.
- So, in terms of a residency, that’s something you apply for in your last year of medical school (whether that’s in the 6th year of our BA/MD program, or as an MS-4 in a traditional 4 year medical school) in a particular specialty. In order to practice medicine in the United States, it’s required that you complete a U.S. residency program. So unlike say a PA or an NP who can go directly go out and practice upon graduation, medical students can not practice once they graduate and get their MD, they have to complete postgraduate residency training.
Is it possible to not match? Yes, especially now as more medical schools are popping up and the number of total residency program program positions has stayed relatively stable (although not static) since the 90s (I won’t go into a huge history as to why this is but a lot of this has to do with the fact that residency programs are funded by the government through Medicare). That being said, most U.S. senior medical students DO end up matching into a U.S. residency position (depending on the person’s academic record, it may or may not be the person’s first choice in terms of specialty), or at the very least an internship (the first year of residency, after which they apply again the next cycle). I’m still working on my analysis of the match list from this year (I didn’t realize that acceptances/waitlists/rejections were coming this early vs. the 23rd/24th), although you can see my previous analyses in the thread.
2016: http://talk.qa.collegeconfidential.com/discussion/comment/19480193#Comment_19480193
2017: http://talk.qa.collegeconfidential.com/discussion/comment/20551641/#Comment_20551641
I do think the AAMC is coming more and more to terms with students/graduates not practicing and they do discuss options that are out there: https://www.aamc.org/cim/career/alternativecareers/. I would not go into medical school with this goal in mind, just because there are a lot easier ways to get there.
Do I recommend that students take a 300-400K loan to enter & complete this program? Absolutely NOT. Please don’t do that. I realize a lot of students these days at UMKC Med come from very affluent families and so money is no object where dropping 300K-400K w/cash on hand is no big deal, but no, I don’t recommend that esp. if you’re out-of-state.
Don’t use other people’s matriculation decisions to guide yours. A lot of things factor into this, and there are so many confounders that it doesn’t give you valuable information when it comes to other people turning down specific undergraduate options for this program (and it’s not always the right choice). Best approach is for everyone to have their cards out on the table in terms of your son/daughter and this program. This is very much a personal decision to work out w/one’s own family, I believe, with information.
- So I would put UMKC’s match lists in the range of slightly inferior WHEN COMPARED to Mizzou (the main University of Missouri school) med school’s match lists. Mizzou is the public state flagship for the state. I’m not going based off of only one year’s match list. Mizzou is a stronger medical school, and is a ranked medical school (UMKC does not choose to be ranked by USWNR).
So I would put UMKC’s match lists in the range of at average, if not marginally inferior WHEN COMPARED to OU (a public state flagship for the state) med school’s match lists.
You can see UMKC’s match lists from 2003-2014 here: http://talk.qa.collegeconfidential.com/discussion/comment/17808190#Comment_17808190
UMKC from 2014-2018 here: http://med.umkc.edu/sa/ (Click on “Featured Links”)
You can see Mizzou’s match lists here from 2003 to Present:
https://medicine.missouri.edu/admissions/match-lists/.
You can see Oklahoma’s match lists here from 2014 to Present:
https://www.oumedicine.com/college-of-medicine/information-for/current-students/match
The truth of the matter is that UMKC doesn’t have certain residency specialties in-house (Dermatology, PM&R, ENT, Radiation Oncology, Urology, Plastics, Vascular, Neurosurgery, etc.) so UMKC students are much more reliant on outside institutions for help in terms of building up a CV & thus can be at a disadvantage in the more competitive specialties. It’s not surprising that students feel they need to take a year off to do research somewhere else in that specialty (this is happening at higher frequencies at UMKC now vs. when I was there, because of student demand), before coming back for their last year and going thru the match.
Hopefully that was clear enough. If not, I’m happy to explain further or happy to answer as many questions as you may have about the BA/MD program and/or the physician pathway, in general.
@Roentgen Wondering if you can comment on UMKC 6yr vs UIC GPPA ( I believe its 8 yr program ).
@abduljavid in our view UIC GPPA is far better option in terms of academics, location, college life and career options. Also GPPA is restricted to IL residents only.
is there anyone on the waitlist who has heard back before May 1st
@nerdgal123 - I might be totally off here so don’t take this as the norm or quote me on this! I have seen typically for Regional based offers that they usually give 1 or 2 offers (depending on the School) and keep few in the waiting list from the same School. So, if the person who is offered didn’t take it then they will go with the waiting list from the same school. I have seen this in 3 different instances last year for Regional. For example for IMSA they offered 2 and kept few in the waiting list last year. When first set who were offered declined, they went on to fill from the waiting list both the seats from IMSA. Also, another case they did the same thing. I think this waiting list game can go on till Middle to late July until all positions are filled. Last year only 106 were admitted. Yes, it will be frustrating to be on the waiting list and especially if you are keen on UMKC. Good luck.
@nerdgal123, this is how the “getting off the waitlist” process has worked in past application cycles:
http://talk.qa.collegeconfidential.com/discussion/comment/19656464#Comment_19656464
This all starts after May 1st (the national college decision date), once the med school knows exactly how many open spots in each category (in-state, regional, out-of-state) that they need to fill.
@Roentgen Thanks for great posts you do… its really helpful. From your comments am understanding that there are some specialities missing in UMKC but that is for residency post MD rite, so my question is, after 6yr a UMKC student from BAMD 6yr program has same chances to try out specialities out of UMKC as other University students like UIC GPPA or other graduating MD student.
For anyone who was rejected or wait-listed, I want to tell you this: DO NOT GIVE UP. Last year, I applied as a high school senior and interviewed before I was rejected from the program. I won’t lie–it hurt like heck. But I stuck to my guns, I ended up going to UMKC for undergrad for my freshman year because I knew it was the school for me. I reapplied, interviewed, and as of last night, I was accepted into the program. (For the sake of honesty, it was technically provisional admission because I’m current college student. As soon as I finish the semester and provide a 3.00 cumulative GPA, I have full acceptance.) Regardless, do not give up, and please, please, PLEASE do not let this define you. You all are too smart and too ambitious to have one school take your shine and your drive.
So when I say “UMKC doesn’t have certain residency specialties in-house”, what I mean is that UMKC’s medical school and affiliated hospitals don’t have a residency training program in that specialty (it’s possible that they have a clinical department/division to provide clinical services but not necessarily an actual residency program) . So for example, UMKC does not have a Radiation Oncology residency or a Urology residency.
It helps to have an in-house residency training program as often medical students will work with that particular department during their 4 years of med school. I discuss it further here (see last 2 paragraphs): http://talk.qa.collegeconfidential.com/discussion/comment/18919771#Comment_18919771
@klong12303 if its okay for you to share, what other acceptances/options do you have last year besides UMKC regular admission?
did you take any AP or IB courses in high school? @klong12303
@PPofEngrDr I didn’t apply to any other medical programs as I believed that UMKC’s BA/MD program was the only one in which I was satisfied with every aspect, if I’m being honest. But I did apply to the University of Missouri, the University of Kansas, and the University of Central Missouri and received sizable academic scholarships for each of those three schools, along with UMKC after I was formally rejected.
@uni5374 I didn’t. My high school only offered a few, but because I’m from a college town, they offered a very wide range of dual-credit courses. From what I’ve heard from other students who go to UMKC with me, there was much more luck transferring dual-credit credit in comparison to AP or IB credit. I took somewhere around 30 credits worth of dual-credit, and all of it transferred as it was supposed to. Because of this, I believe I’m technically a sophomore in college rather than a freshman even though this is only my first year of college formally.
I’m formally posting the information I included on my successful application for the program, along with some of my statistical information. I was offered an interview before I was offered admission last week.
Katie Long (Missouri)
ACT: 30
SAT: N/A
GPA: 3.98 - 4.65 weighted
Class Rank: 1/207
No AP/IB Credit
Dual-Credit Courses, School, Credit Value, & Grade:
HIST 1350, UCM, 3.00 cred, A
HIST 1351, UCM, 3.00 cred, A
MATH 111, UCM, 3.00 cred, A
MATH 1112, UCM, 2.00 cred, A
ENGL 1020, UCM, 3.00 cred, A
MATH 1151, UCM, 5.00 cred, A
SPANISH 110, UMKC, 3.00 cred, A
SPANISH 120, UMKC, 3.00 cred, A
SPANISH 211, UMKC, 3.00 cred, A
SPANISH 221, UMKC, 3.00 cred, A
Honors and Awards:
The George Washington Carver Award
United States Marine Corps Scholastic Excellence Award
Bright Flight Award
University of Missouri Board of Curators Curators’ Scholar Award
Summa Cum Laude graduation
(this is only a sampling–I have many more but this is just what I put in my application)
Extracurricular Activities & Community Service:
Student Council (rep, senior rep)
Senior Council (member)
National Honor Society (junior, senior member)
Project Graduation (volunteer)
Spanish Club (member, senior member)
Joseph Baldwin Academy
Summer Talent Academy for Professions in Health
Cesarean Section & Delivery Shadowing
Wound Clinic Shadowing
Family Practice Physician & NP Shadowing
CPR/AED training & certification
Work Experience:
Family Practice and Associates of West Central Missouri (medical records & nursing aide)
If anyone has any questions about what I included and why, please feel free to ask.
Thanks so much for your post @klong12303, and giving back to the College Confidential community!!!