Wellesley, Whitman, or Grinnell?

Colleges and Universities A-Z Grinnell College
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<p>I posted this in the parent section -- and was encourgaged to post it here as well. I would appreciate your thoughts. . . </p>

<p>Who would have thought that this stage would be so stressful? My D is having a very, very difficult time choosing which LAC to attend and we would value your input. Each school is excellent academically, but the cost and culture vary significantly. </p>

<p>D attends a public magnet high school in California where many of her friends are high performing, religious, children of immigrants. She is athletic, Jewish, politically liberal, out-doorsy, and a bit preppy. She is conservative personally and doesn’t like to be around a lot of alcohol consumption. She is fairly social and fits into the mainstream of her unusual high school, but is not a social leader. D is beginning to be sad about the idea of living far from home. </p>

<p>D feels that the best fit for her is Wellesley (in Massachusetts). The young women have a tight social network, most alcohol consumption happens away from campus, and the students’ ethnic backgrounds are similar to my D’s high school. We have family in the area with whom D is close. The cost is $44 k per year. (We could pay this amount, but there would be no funds left for graduate school and D would need to work hard every summer.)</p>

<p>Whitman (in Washington) is close enough that weekend trips home are possible. Alcohol consumption on campus is about average. The school does not have sub-free dorms. About a third of the students are in Greek organizations (a negative for my D because she worries about social cliques). The swim coach is excellent and the team might be a social fit. The student body is mostly white, affluent, outdoorsy, Pacific North westerners and Californians. The cost is about $30 per year. </p>

<p>Grinnell (in Iowa, with poor transportation options) has no Greek organizations. My D’s sense is that the dominant culture of the school values innovative thought and counter-culture perspectives. The school’s alcohol policy is very loose, though they offer sub-free housing. The swim team coaches are great, but my D worried that the team’s social activities revolved around alcohol. The student body is much more diverse than Whitman and includes a fair number of international students. The school offered generous merit aid. The cost would be about $24 per year. (This would allow my D many more options over the summer and some funding for graduate school.) </p>

<p>Any thoughts would be very welcomed. </p>

<p>p.s. D's other options (which we think she won't take) are Bowdoin, Middlebury, and Willamette. Only the last offered signficant aid.</p>

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<p>Congratulations to your daughter for earning so many wonderful choices. You sound really lukewarm about Grinnell -- I get the feeling that you/your daughter would prefer Wellesley for sure, or Whitman over Grinnell if money weren't part of the equation. Wellesley is a really fine school - with distance and money being the major drawbacks. For Whitman, yes 30% greek is big, but that leaves 70% who don't join. Greek campuses tend to have a lot of drinking, so it could be that it's more "underground" than at Grinnell. My daughter is not the least bit counter culture and neither is her roommate. It is true that the student body tends to have a lot of quirky kids, -- here comes a gross generalization -- the men more so than the women.</p>

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<p>Hi,
Has your D visited the three campuses? I think it is important for kids to spend a night if possible - generally they have very strong feelings after doing so. My D looked at Whitman two years ago and has several friends there (she ultimately choose Wesleyan) and my S is now looking at Grinnell. I remember my D telling me there was a lot of 'pot' at Whitman (can't speak specifically to alcohol). I don't think the Greek scene is much but I assume a lot of the partying goes on there. My S received a wonderful letter today from a Grinnell junior who is from California and currently studying in Turkey. She loves the school.</p>

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<p>I really think at any school there is going to be alcohol and pot, it just depends on who you choose to hang out with. When I visited Whitman I didn't encounter any pot, but there was definitely alcohol (but there was no pressure to drink on anybody). Once again, if you want it, it's there, if you don't, thre are other people like you.</p>

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<p>I grew up in Boston, and believe me they drink on the campus at Wellesley. And, being all women, there are some countercultural activities there which may not be as open at coed schools.</p>

<p>Whitman is much more conservative than either. I think a blue skies Cal kid may despise the life of gray skies of Washington. And, I really canot equate it academically with Grinnell or Wellesley.</p>

<p>I attended Grinnell and really had to twist arms to get people to go out drinking. Grinnell has two natural sources to suppress the same: homework and money problems. Grinnell kids are far from loaded and -- in my time -- a dinner out was a novelty because of the expense.</p>

<p>Swimming is a religion at Grinnell. I could never get those guys to go out drinking. They would party, but at very select and very engineered times. A clique arises within the team -- a good one -- and much of your social life can be with the other swimmers who tend to be pre-med and clean cut.</p>

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<p>thank you for all your thoughts.</p>

<p>snorky--I would go to Grinnell in a heartbeat. My d visited and worries whether it would be a good fit for her.</p>

<p>Father -- Whitman is on the desert side of Washington and enjoys 300 days a year of sunshine. You experience with the swim team members is certainly encouraging.</p>

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<p>I visited Grinnell last Thursday, and just wanted to comment that, from my overnight visit- the alchohol and drug scene is very open and available, especially pot, but there seems to be no pressure to partake. Yes, I was offered beer and pot, as were the other prospies I was talking to, but it is very easy to say no in the Grinnell atmosphere. The whole atmosphere is very laid back, which I liked. I got the e-mail from the study abroad student in Turkey. It was coincidental in that the first thing I mentioned to my mom after visiting Grinnell, in jest, was the lack of In-n-Out. </p>

<p>I'm visiting Wellesley for their open campus on Monday and Tuesday for the first time. I'm in Boston right now, and met an alumna, she was a perfect example of what I had pictured an alumna to be!</p>

<p>btw, Californian, I visited Middlebury over the weekend. I loved it! It's absolutely beautiful, and academics are superb. The environment was quite a contrast from Grinnell, but did fit another part of my personality. If only I could find a school that encompassed all the things I've loved at so many!</p>

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<p>Mimmea, Did you get any sense as to whether there is a signficant percentage of Grinnell students who choose not to partake? Any comparisons with Wellesley or Middlebury?</p>

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<p>Good question, I haven't visited Wellesley yet, so I can't speak for it, but at Grinnell, subfree housing demand is larger than supply, resulting in another dorm being added for subfree for next year. From what I gathered, it's a perfectly respected choice. At Middlebury, there is also subfree, but I didn't get much of a chance to ask about them. One thing I noticed, though, was that there seems to be very little drinking during the week, with most drinking on Friday or Saturday night in the social houses or off-campus. In contrast, the drinking policy at Grinnell is lax, with drinking in the dorms, and at least from my experience, moderately on weeknights. That was my observation- anyone with another perspective?</p>

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<p>I'm a current student (junior) at Grinnell, so I'll shed light on the social scene. Drinking is big with about half the campus, but there are several different pockets of social activity that revolve around dozens of different things. On any given Friday, a student can go to a concert, watch movies in the Harris theater, drink at student parties, hang out at student parties, go to the Harris dance parties, hang out in dorm lounges, do homework, go to plays/art exhibits, go to Des Moines or Iowa City, etc. etc. All of the campus events are free. A large part of the social life does revolve around alcohol, but I'd say about half of the campus doesn't partake in that on a regular basis.</p>

<p>Weed is widespread, but (this just in) it's widespread everywhere. If you want to smoke it, go ahead. If not, then don't...just like anywhere else.</p>

<p>The swimming team is very, very good.</p>

<p>Good luck.</p>

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<p>Grinnell's page writes, " The Grinnell men's swimming and diving team won its fifth straight Midwest Conference title and the 30th MWC Championship in school history with a three-day total of 1,152 points at the 2006 Midwest Conference Swimming and Diving Championships, hosted by Lawrence University in Appleton, Wis., from Fri., Feb. 10, through Sun., Feb. 12."</p>

<p>Yeah, they are very good.</p>

<p>But, do not think this closes the door for ANYONE who wants to give it a try.</p>

<p>That is the beauty of Division III. Anyone who is willing to partake 2 hours each day at the pool, can do so. And, in my day, many of the lesser swimmers became stars as their perseverance delivered rich rewards.</p>

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<p>Mimeea - Any more comments on Grinnell vs Middlebury? My S is flying out to Grinnell tomorrow. He was waitlisted at Middlebury. Although the chances of getting a call from Middlebury are slim, we are trying to get as much info as possible as we haven't been there. Thanks!</p>

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<p>My D and I visited both. While Midd wins the beauty pagent, I found myself more drawn to Grinnell. </p>

<p>Midd's students come from much wealthier backgrounds, are much more likely to have gone to a private prep schools, have a trust fund, and own cars (about half the kids have them on campus). I left the place calling it, as others have, "Club Midd." Something about the upper class whiteness of the place really bugged me (who comes from humble roots). </p>

<p>That said, my D lliked the campus, applied, and got in. If she elected to go, I know I would love visiting her. It really, really is a beautiful place and it seems very strong academically.</p>

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<p>Thanks Californian and good luck to your D with her decisions!</p>

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<p>dcz- I would have to agree with californian in that some of the strongest differences are within the student bodies at each. In contrast to Club Midd, Grinnell students seemed much more open to express themselves, their style, and personality, than their wallet. Both are in an isolated climate, but I felt a lot more at home in Middlebury's small town. There are a handful of casual, inexpensive, locally owned places to eat that are very tasty. Grinnell is more politically active than Middlebury, from student perspectives and action that I saw. Middlebury highlights its international and environmental focus a lot, although the most populous major on campus is economics. Hmmm, if you would like more specific comparisons, let me know. I hope your S has a safe trip and an informative visit at Grinnell!</p>

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<p>Thanks so much Mimeea - it will be interesting to see if we ultimately have a choice to make!</p>

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<p>If my child got into either Middlebury or Grinnell, I would be be both ecstatic and about 40K/year poorer. But, it would be a quickly forgotten poverty. Well worth the investment at either place.</p>

<p>california -- I spoke to wife yesterday about the drug issue and she told me -- after all these years of marriage -- that it did bother her at times. Well, it was not my room at least. Maybe, just maybe, that issue will be the straw that turns the corner for your child. I think her suffering is well subordinate to the good times she had.</p>

<p>But, when I visit the school today, there is a significant change on campus. Probably more serious students. Definately more Asian than in my day. And, the 70's are gone and more distance from the 60's from which the wild child syndrome arose. In short, the student envirnoment is more conservative today.</p>

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<p>California -- I've been to two parents' weekends and at each the president speaks to alcohol issues. Grinnell -- like every other college campus in america -- is very concerned about alcohol - especially binge drinking. The president said the binge drinking rate is lower than the national average. The administration has tended to look the other way <em>somewhat</em> because they want to be sure that they don't drive the dangerous drinking activity underground and they don't want students to hesitate about getting help when a friend is in trouble and needs medical treatment. (I work at a large state university - and happen to be in a job where I review the security reports every day -- and I would say that it's not an overstatement to say that almost one student a day is "transported" to the ER due to alcohol. Most of the time, it's another student that calls 911.) The other thing Grinnell does is to create alternatives for students. The new gym and student center are designed to provide safe spots to play. Also, I think that's part of why social activites are mostly free. My daughter says the students feel that the administration and the local police are starting to get a little tougher on alcohol. I was very impressed with Grinnell's thoughtful approach -- but it certainly has not stopped drinking on campus. And I have yet to hear about a campus that has had a lot of success in controlling it. Many have tried. Honestly - I don't think marajuana is as worrisome. It just makes you goofy and stupid, but it won't kill you.</p>

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<p>I'm going to Whitman next year, I picked it early in the fall and applied ED, but had I not done that I was considering applying RD to Grinnell as well. </p>

<p>I wouldn't worry at all about the Greek life being any kind of issue, I've visited campus 3 times and it's very open to everyone and just chill. I've heard most people in Greek life never thought they'd be a part of it, so might give you an idea of what its like. </p>

<p>Father of the Boarder said Whitman is "more conservative than either" but I'm pretty sure that's unfounded. It's a very politically liberal campus, similar to most LACs. And as californian said, the weather is good, better than western WA, where I hail from. So...I clearly would pick Whitman, as that's what I did, but Grinnell could be a good choice as well. Or Bowdoin/Middleburry would be cool to look into if the price difference isn't a big factor. Ultimately, all her options sound great.</p>

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<p>Attached is club information from Whitman which reflects that it may not be as conservative as I thought:</p>

<p>Whitman College Republicans
(At present, this club is NOT ACTIVE)</p>

<p>The Whitman College Republicans are dedicated to bringing political diversity to the Whitman student body through the advancement of conservative ideas and policies.</p>

<p>SITE:</p>

<p><a href="http://www.whitman.edu/student_activities/directory/stu_orgs.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.whitman.edu/student_activities/directory/stu_orgs.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>