WHAT IS IT with 11th grade admissions?

<p>SO I think Exeter accepts 20-25-maybe 30 out of 250+ apps for 11th graders. That's tough (8-12.... lower than the average ivy acceptace rate, 12.4). It seems like this is a weird group of kids...</p>

<p>from the new uppers i've met from Exeter, an oddly high number are international. </p>

<p>of the 19 i know of (including myself)
2 from california (1 south, 1 north)... myself and 7house
2 from colombia?
2 from canada (quebec, toronto)
1 from china (guangzhou)
1 from Taiwan
1 from tx
1 from nj
1 form chicago
1 from seattle
1 from NH
1 from maine
1 from montana? or Missouri?
1 from NC
1 from IN
1 from NV
1 from NY</p>

<p>=6/19 international = ~31.5% international
compared to something like 12 for the total at exeter</p>

<p>and we all seem pretty normal. a few of us have some fairly interesting backgrounds, as far as i can tell. so how did we survive the 8-12% acceptance rate? what are they looking for?</p>

<p>also.. new uppers do better in college admissions than 4year/3year seniors... but we all seem pretty normal (no internationally ranked jugglers).</p>

<p>what is going onnn?</p>

<p>If you're an internationally ranked juggler or are the public school District 32 champion in Poetry Slam Dressage...why would you change up the routine? I think superachievers -- in the sense that we're talking about them -- don't make the Upper year a point of departure. They might become PGs. Or they might enter at the more traditional entry points, but maybe when things are rocking along in your life in some super phenomenal way you're not thinking, "Gee, I'd like to change gears and attend Exeter."</p>

<p>I'm not saying the field is diluted or isn't as gifted or talented...I just suspect that it's probably gifted or blessed in different ways -- perhaps more balanced overall -- because the kids who want to change things because they're not thriving in their current environment aren't going to get in and the kids who are exploding wouldn't think to change their current environment, so you're left with super-gifted kids who thirst for more of what Exeter offers academically and don't have baggage and don't have "stop the presses" skills that amaze and astound your Exeter peers.</p>

<p>As for the international student mix, maybe they have more applicants because of different points of changing schools...or maybe the admissions office is trying to maintain a mix by compensating for attrition.</p>

<p>That's my off-the-cuff hypothesis.</p>

<p>Yeah, but the thing is, new uppers do better in college admissions... so it's like, well, if they're not superachievers, then what's going on? How come they do better than the 4/3year students?</p>

<p>After you've been at Exeter for a few months you may figure this out. Here are 3 possible factors to consider:
1. Higher GPA because of 2 years at a less competitive school.
2. Possibility of a special talent, athletic or artistic, that is desired by colleges.
3. Repeats should do better in classes they have already taken leading to a higher GPA.
When you've figured it out, let us know!</p>

<p>actually, there are going to be 42 new uppers this year....</p>

<p>Whattt???????</p>

<p>How many applications were there for eleventh grade, tuesdayair?</p>

<p>i have no idea
i just know how many students are coming and stuff b/c of the school "facebook"</p>

<p>So if there's 250 applications like Blair said, that's a 17% acceptance rate, which isn't a huge difference compared to the regular 22%.</p>

<p>My guess is that there are a lot more than 250 applications for junior year at Exeter. I happened to work with 2 junior applicants who were denied, so that's 2 just from my small part of the world.</p>

<p>If these new students end up doing better with college admissions, I agree that it is because so many of them are 11th grade repeats, and also they bring a super-high GPA with them. It is a big advantage for them.</p>

<p>I would say that that 5% IS significant. As you approach the statistical wall of 0% acceptance, each percentage point makes a huge difference. It's not significant if you consider all applicants to be fungible. Then it's like the odds of pulling out 17 green poker chips from a bag of 100 chips. But this is an applicant pool that self-selects, so as the odds decrease, the self-selection increases -- making the overall pool likely to be incredibly impressive as a whole compared to the pools of applicants that have a better chance. Plus, these applicants aren't pursuing a change because the train track goes that direction -- as most of the 9th and 10th grade applicants are doing. And this pool isn't laden with legacy or financial hooks. And lastly, these candidates have an actual high school track record that they have to submit...no speculation is needed as to how these applicants will fare with a high school curriculum.</p>

<p>So even if there are "just" 250 applications, the students who make it past the admissions gauntlet pulled off a neat trick. It's not 5% fewer from an applicant pool that's comparable to the 9th grade applicant pool. It's 5% fewer from an applicant pool that's likely to be extraordinary by comparison to the 9th grade applicant pool. And, given the real numbers -- not percentages -- the school can be exacting in their selectivity. </p>

<p>That 5% percentage difference shouldn't be plotted on a flat line. When you combine the reduced percent of admitted applicants with the qualitative difference in the applicant pools and the smaller real numbers involved, that 5% difference has a geometric reality to it.</p>

<p>In other words, the mythical "last" person to secure a place as an Upper is not comparable to the mythical person from the Prep class who would be last if Exeter decreased its Prep admissions by 5%. I don't think it would be even close. If the precentage difference is greater, as suggested, the difference would seem to be all the more phenomenal along that steep curve.</p>

<p>blairt- what makes you say the "new" uppers do better with college admissions? I find that hard to believe, unless these kids are truly superior, as has been suggested.
It was suggested to me that a new junior (upper) at one of the top, larger schools would be at a DISadvantage in the college process because the counselors and teachers are naturally going to favor kids they have been working with for several years.</p>

<p>New uppers have many advantages. We get more freedom with class selection, can take more challenging classes (we're not held behind by non-advanced requirements for 4years). We're motivated for college during the whole time we're there.. no spaced out, undirected, homesick 13 year olds. But college-minded 16 year olds.</p>

<p>No.. counselors meet with students for the first time in the fall of upper year. No counselors are even assigned until then. Current Exonians (I believe Andover works this way too) correct me if I'm wrong.</p>

<p>plus.. I think that's a bit ... i don't know.. to assume that professional counselors are going to help one child more than another simply because their face is a tad more familiar. that's ridiculous.</p>

<p>... I think that sps was 120 or something. This was half a year ago.. the stats are slipping. I know that Andover/Exeter's ended in -50 and the range was 50 more. another school was 200-something. I don't know if a/e's was 250-300 or 350-400. Plus, this year there were more than ever... those stats were from the previous year (2006, not 2007)</p>

<p>I looked at the Exonian who's who... looks like 42 new uppers...something like 12 internationals.</p>

<p>As a parent of a recent exeter grad, I would like to know where you have your statistics that new uppers "do better" than 3 or 4 years.</p>

<p>I have to concede that the Bunkel Index data doesn't track matriculation numbers for off-track admits. I've looked and looked and tried various data sorts and I just have no data that gives me a number -- not for individual schools nor any school cluster (including the powerful @$ALLSCHOOLS(AESDCH) query). I can't even coax the software to sort out those data for that group.</p>

<p>Here's your chance. You can show that WBTY is a better resource for 11th and 12th grade admissions if they have that data. I've written a letter to the publisher to ask them if Bunkel has it and I just can't locate it or, if not, then why they don't get that information from the schools. Let's see if WBTY has the data.</p>

<p>If anyone knows why Bunkel wouldn't have that information broken out like this, please let me know. I'm very frustrated. This is the first time I've looked for information that I expected to find and couldn't retrieve it. Thanks for any insights.</p>

<p>I don't know what the difference is, but we have advisers, not counselors. Unless you mean the college counselors...I think we are assigned a college counselor in Upper spring but I'm not sure. But we're assigned advisers when we enter the school, it's pretty cool...I definitely don't think new uppers have much of a disadvantage, though.</p>

<p>I don't think new uppers have more freedom with course selections. Old students do have more requirements, but that's because we're there for two more years, and I don't think that the requirements are "non-advanced." I actually think it's much easier to advance as a four year student because the Exeter curriculum is different from most other high schools' curriculum; a lot of new people are placed in lower math and lower language classes.</p>

<p>But I do think most new uppers are really smart, I always assumed it was because it's much harder to get in as a new upper.</p>

<p>When I talked to the advisors about my concerns with college admissions as a new upper, the lady I spoke to (a college counselor at Exeter) immediately said, "You do not need to worry about that -- if anything new uppers have many advantages." She then listed what I noted above.</p>

<p>4-year students have to take all of their HS classes at Exeter. I didn't. I took US history this year. I now don't have to take USH at Exeter, and am instead taking advanced philosophy/history courses. There's an example by what I meant. Yes, USH is very advanced, and known for it. But instead, I got to fill in that blank history period with college level philosophy/history courses. Yes - math and language courses are a contradiction to this, because they're progressive..</p>

<p>The advisor informed me that it was just a known thing, that new uppers get some advantages during college admissions -- the opposite of what I thought. New uppers have the highest GPA's of the group, on average. So, yeah, they rank higher then. Then, they have a better shot at a uber competitive college.</p>

<p>Obviously, the kids who will do the best in college admissions are not the ones getting in on their GPA's. It's the legacies (4y) and champ recruited athletes.</p>

<p>4years will be better prepared for college, 2years may have a better shot at getting in the uber competitive ones.</p>

<p>but this depends on so many other factors.</p>