I think you are in a better position than some. We have friends for which one parent is saying “pay it all” and the other is saying “they are on their own.” Your husband is at least open to helping.
I think you’ll need to map out various ways to finance two kids in college and what that changes for him specifically. Does it mean HE will need to work past retirement age? It’s not selfish to not want to do that. What exactly does it mean he can’t have… does it mean he can’t have a brand new sports car or would it mean maybe a used sports car could still be an option.
I would be prepared with what compromises you might have to make in advance… because you very well may need to. Consider if there is ANY loan amount you’d be comfortable for your kids. Few people can give their child a loan-free sleep away education at any college of their choice… especially not 2 at a time.
@turtletime I’d be shocked if he ever bought a “used” car…he only buys new. Also…just an FYI…he already owns a sports car (which is our 3rd car)…a 2004 Mazda Miata convertible stick shift (that I can’t even drive by the way - sorry tried to learn stick and I just can’t)…it still runs great…stored in the garage when not used.
No, he would not have to work past retirement age…which is 67 if I’m correct. Problem is he’s actually started talking about how he could retire in 2 years when he’s 55 because his job has union benefits and he’ll have enough years at 55. He is in great health. He gets free health insurance and great benefits. What happens with health insurance and social security and impact on taxes…not sure…I have to pay for my health insurance so if I have to add him that’s less take home for me. I’m 6 yrs younger…I don’t plan on retiring anytime soon and I honestly don’t think I’d have to work past 67 to help pay off student debt for my kids but I would if I had to.
Is part of his truth that he wants to retire at 55? Find that out. It may be normative in his peer group.
If he is going to retire then, has he given any thought to how he might use his time? What have his colleagues who retired at that age done? If he gets bored at home on his own while you work and the kids study, are there any hobbies he might take up?
I think you need to sit down and work through “the numbers.” He says that the kids should chip in half. Half of what number? Does he understand they can’t borrow half of many college paths? What path is he envisioning (Community college, then local state school? Can the kids even afford to pay half of that?) He may not be fully clued in on the reality of college costs.
@happymomof1 - no he has not given it any serious thought…at first I thought he was joking. Remember, he does not like to deal with serious issues.
@donnaleighg - no he has no clue and you got it right with your last statement…but not only is he clueless of the costs…but he’s clueless about financial aid, EFC, etc.
We’ll see what happens when I finally sit him down and have “the talk”.
If he really knows nothing about the whole process, his reaction may be simple ignorance. It’s frustrating that he’s hard to pin down for a serious discussion but he may not be totally inflexible.
My hubby put himself through community college and didn’t go past associates. He’s been fortunate to get a great job with no B.A. He really had no concept of what we and the kids were facing in terms of admissions and finances. Once I started doing the research, like you are, I had to really lay it all out for DH. We had a good conversation with the kids on what we could pay and all their options. All worked out.
OP - you need to continue to have this discussion with your H, no beating around the bushes to figure out what is going to be workable for both of you. This kind of discussion should have happened even before the kids were born. Unless both of you are on the same page, it is going to be hard for your twins when they are doing college search.
My older daughter is getting married in a month. She and her fiance had pretty intense discussion where their future kids would go to K-12. She would like her kids to go to a private (because that’s how she grew up) and he believes in public school.
OP - I am with you about doing everything you can to make sure they could get the best college education possible debt free. I would forego sports cars, vacations and a lot of niceties in life to make sure my kids could get good education.
You handle all the finances. He’s not interested in financial planning, taxes, etc.
To me it sounds what YOU will say goes – by default!
Make out a college financial plan and show it to your husband. I doubt he’d have any solid financial arguments to counter your plan. The very sight of all those numbers may prompt him to lose interest and accept your strategy.
I was still married when our children went to college. Ex believes in higher education but doesn’t like to think or talk about money. Our children got good financial aid because our income was low at the time; ex lost his job just before child 1 started college and it took me awhile to build my income. Both children took the maximum amount of loans that were part of their FA packages. I wanted to pay back the loans with parental money, using a HELOC; ex suggested that our children just not pay back the loans. Unfortunately, this is just one example of our deep differences about money and family finances. I hope your differences with your spouse, OP, are at their root less to do with money and more to do with feelings about whether the children should go to college. The latter probably are easier to resolve.
Once you have the talk with your husband and decide on numbers, have (another) talk with your twins. Include realistic numbers and compounded interest. With your twins being sophomores, there is still some time. They may decide to work full time this summer and part-time through the school year instead of some other extracurriculars. My son has been working since April his sophomore year and has saved quite a bit. He has found time for clubs, volunteering and an internship. But he made the choice to work as he is hoping to avoid loans.
You also have some time. Start now looking for ways to save more money the next two years. You sound as though you value family time and want to give your children more than what you had. I’m not suggesting eliminating everything, but try cutting back. Want the summer vacation? Whatever budget you had, see what you can do for half. Are you paying for more wants rather than needs? We know some parents who pay for hair & nails regularly or two prom dresses, shoes, etc. for multiple proms (you get my point). Maybe instead of sharing the costs, cut some of it out. Take that money instead and save it for college. You could even make it a family goal. Whatever they save, you will match in savings. It may be a way for your husband to buy-in? It could also be a great lesson for your twins how much savings can do for their future.
Best wishes to you and your family. You are doing a service to them by thinking about it now. We’ve come across some families who don’t have any talk. Now as seniors reality is sitting in and it isn’t a pretty picture. Kudos to you!
You mention that you live in Virginia which has excellent instate schools. One way to cut costs is to commute. Are you willing to consider having the kids live at home and attend a school within commuting distance? For example if you live in Northern VA , George Mason University is a very good school that local students often underestimate. Their programs are rigorous and they have classes full of students that are very serious about their education and finding a job after graduation. Since NOVA is a tech area lots of companies hire locally. What I’m trying to ask is graduating debt free more a priority or having the four year go away to college experience. I would say have an open discussion with your kids to set some reasonable expectations in regards to how much you can pay.
@jcmom716 – we are already frugal in certain things you mention…I get my nails done maybe once a year – usually for specific occassion, don’t go to spas and don’t spend hundreds on hair. We clip coupons all the time and don’t go on very expensive spring break vacations…as for summer…we already only go every other year overseas for family obligations (father-in-law in nursing home)…on the off years we don’t do any summer vacation except maybe day trips. We both do home-packed lunches for work almost every day. The areas that are monthly expenditures are those that I can likely guarantee my DH will not give up…the Sports Channel + cable package, the cell phone package (he wants new phones not as they come out but as soon as we’ve paid off the previous one…meanwhile…I’m still with 2 versions back.)
@raclut Yes, we are in NOVA and yes, George Mason is on the table and they could commute (although with traffic the way it is now…that’s debatable ;-), but…
My point in all this is that we “can” afford to pay for 4 yrs of college at $25-30K/yr. Will it be tight, yes, but definitely doable with little to no college debt for each kid…assuming a combination of 529 savings, each kid working as much as possible, parental salary contribution as much as possible, max federal loans AND HELOC/Cash-Out Refinance to make up the difference and also help pay off federal loans. It require a sacrifice that I’m willing to do for my kids.
It is something most families struggle with. We want to give our kids a great free education but we also balance that with wanting to enjoy ourselves and be comfortable in retirement. I know you already have the two weeks in Portugal planned and that will create great memories but it will be less that is available for college and retirement. That is a personal choice. We want to give our kids everything but very few people can do that. Even those who are upper middle class struggle with that.
You need to have the difficult conversation with your husband. Be unemotional about and work through the numbers. Figure out what you can afford before you decide what you can offer your kids and before they are involved in the conversation. Put it on a spreadsheet so you understand it also. Start putting away and living now like you are on the college budget. As parents, we love to say we will do anything for our kids but there are somethings that are just not possible.
I am in No Va also and know many kids who did two years at NVCC before moving on. I also know many who live at home and commute to Mason. All are doing great.
@scoutmom2002 I could have written your post. DH went to trade school and makes a great living. I have a degree and work for him None of our kids are following in his footsteps though and he seems to resent spending money on their college. One went to a local Tech school for his associates and landed a fantastic job upon graduation. One chose an expensive out of state school that costs about $5k/year more than our state flagship. We paid everything for his freshman year but next year are capping what we will pay and expect him to use his savings and work hard this summer to cover the balance. If necessary we will loan him some money at a favorable rate, but we have another kid coming up in two years and want to cap our investment. Also, he needs skin in the game. You are definitely not alone in this difference of opinion!
OP- I actually don’t think you have difficult conversations ahead of you.
You seem to have a solid understanding of the financial and academic options available to your kids. You have a greater appetite for working longer, cutting closer to the bone, etc. than your spouse does which is not unusual (not everyone is in synch with their spouses on these things) but have the advantage of being the person who worries about the finances and knows where every penny is.
Once your kids understand that high stats are ALWAYS a good thing, and never a bad thing, and realize that solid grades, scores, etc. can only help them, I think you’ve done your job for now. Once it’s time to put together a list of places to explore/visit/research, get your husband as involved as you can. And everyone can keep an open mind for now- merit aid at a college in Ohio which would make a four year sleepaway experience affordable? It can stay on the list even if none of you have ever been to Ohio. Full ride at a Quaker college with a fantastic program one of your kids is interested in? Stays on the list, even if you aren’t Quaker. And of course- visits to the commutable options, figuring out if living at home and going to class is workable.
Don’t set off WW3 now. In most families with the dynamic you describe, it’s the partner who is less invested in spending for college who does the taxes, sees the mortgage payment, knows what’s in the IRA’s. You’ve got a significant advantage here!
I’m in sort of the same boat. I handle all the financials. DH went to 3/4 of a year of trade school, paid for it himself, and makes the same amount I do with my college degree. He had occasionally mentioned that kids should put themselves through school like he did. We didn’t specifically set aside any college savings other than paying most expenses for the kids so they could bank the majority of their earnings. I figured things would work out somehow.
DD’17 ended up choosing an AAS program at a cc and she will be done in 5 semesters. Between scholarships and the tax credit, the tuition cost will be $0 and she pays her rent working at Target. Only needed to touch her savings at the very beginning before the paychecks kicked in. So she is meeting DH’s ideal and she is happy with her choice (was not pushed into it by us).
DD’19 is much more a 4 year school candidate, possible valedictorian etc. so things are different. My plan now is chasing merit, and giving DH info in small chunks to digest. We have found a school DD loves that will have a COA of $9000 after auto merit, possibly less if she increases her ACT score and/or gets some other scholarships. I figure that price point won’t be an issue for us to contribute a bit, get some tax credit back, and DD to contribute a bit. I plan to have no car payments during those years and maybe get either the HELOC or mortgage paid off by fall 2019 to help. DH wouldn’t even feel that few thousand a year but the school is further away than he would like.
We had a little bit of discussion last night. I told him DD was invited to visit my alma mater with a friend and that I decided she shouldn’t miss school for a college she’s not going to. He said but it would be closer to home. I asked him how he would pay for the $25,000/year after merit. “Me?” “Yes, kids can only borrow $5500 a year.” He did not know that. Then we discussed how we wondered how other families were doing it. Later he brought up kids supporting themselves after high school and something about minimum wage, at which point I should have said something about investing in your kids so they can support themselves well in adult hood. Oh well, maybe later.
He spends money on antique tractors, and I don’t really have a “thing” that I spend money on, so if pressed, I will tell him I’m investing in my kids. Just trying to keep the cost low with merit so that’s it’s not a HUGE issue. Yes, she could go to cc to start, but in her case it’s quite possible getting freshman merit rather than transfer merit will make cc a non-savings (other than keeping her closer to home).
Do you have a life plan for finances (I don’t)? Can you sit down with you husband and talk about how this decesion will impact your future and your kid’s future? Depending on your kids future plans, a little debt could very well be manageable. How about hiring a financial planner to aid the discussion.
I also had parent that paid for my education. At the time, it was a drop in the bucket financially. Times have changed, for most it is not a realistic goal. I strongly guided (pushed) my daughter towards the state schools since that is what I could afford. My wife felt more like you that we should make any school work. Luckly, the kid understood the realities.
Your children need to understand what is realistic. If that menas that you are the bad guy that has to set limits then so be it. They can play a hugh role in the process. If they can earn a lot of AP credit then they could graduate in three years.
One thing my daughter’s college experience taught me is that there is no such thing as a typical college experience. Your kids will have there own college experience be it the 4 sleep-away college or the more typical 2 year cc followed by 2 years at a 4 year college or something totally different. It will very likely look nothing like you envisioned. I had envisioned a nice 4 year sleep-away college that was relatively carefree for my daughter. What the reality was totally different but hey it was her experience not mine. Took me a while to accept. The point is all you can do is provide the support you can and let them define the experience.
As for your inital question that is a tough one. It is hard to explain financial realities when one person handles all the financial decisions (not that unusual in many families). It sounds like you have done a great job. Better than most. However you now are facing two major decisions (college and retirement) that are going to require compromises. I really think that you need to explain to you husband how these decisions will impact your life. Your husband needs to know the details and exactly how you plan to pull this off. Your husband may feel that he has done his part and that your college plans will serverly impact him. You appear to love your job and see working forever is acceptable (warning, life may not allow it). Your husband also seems to reaching the point where he wants a lighter load. My sister faced a similar situations and had to hammer out a compromise that they both could accept. Good luck.
Colleges expect parents to pay for college. Few parents can pay their efc, so kids need to earn merit money. However when parents refuse to pay it’s no longer possible to ‘pulk yourself through college’ with work earnings only.
VA public universities are quite generous with AP and IB credit as well as community college credit. This can provide both rigor (for admission and competitive scholarship review) and relief (cutting one semester off for study abroad or an internship or a do op).
Investing in a few hours with a tutor for prep the summer before the PSAT could yield excellent results financially. Overall, the higher the score, the better the odds of scholarship. You can take the test 3 times and its’ alright by colleges (taking it 4, 5 times is frowned upon though). The score doesn’t need to be 32 (although 32’unlocks’ some scholarships) - there are scholarships for many scores needs to be really high for the college consider, so depending on the college it would be 29, 30… whereas at other colleges it needs to be 33!
So, your kids can go to Alabama if they earn a full tuition scholarship there, to UT Dallas if they wonAES/Collegium V, to UF if they make NMF/Benacquisto…but Christopher Newport and UMW offer good scholarships for lesser scores, as do lots of other colleges OOS. They can apply to LACs out of their region - many Colleges that change lives have excellent scholarships for B+ students.
You can bring up what sort of careers, lifestyle… your spouse sees your kids having. (Btw do you know what sort of carer your kids want?)
If he says they could follow in his footsteps, ask how many fresh HS graduates were hired in the past year with a Union contract and if they’re still there.
If thy kids want to be doctors, teachers, nurses, engineers, screen writers, real estate magnates… Is he ok with their going ona college that’ll lead them to the right first job?
If his goal is retirement, what does he plan to do? Can he live to part time while the kids are in college? Or retire but do some part time work to help them achieve the best they can achieve? Or retire and enjoy rhe kids’ college sport rivalries on screen or in person?
Well…I’m then assuming your husband wants your kids to pick up half of the COA for the VA instate schools?
If you CAN pay $30,000 a year…and your kid takes the $5500 Direct Loan…that would cover the cost of UVA…the most expensive public in your state. Oh…and if your kid gets accepted and you have financial need…UVA will meet it per their calculations.
Would your kiddos be able to get scholarships at any of the smaller VA publics? Christopher Newport, for example? If so, that would lighten your parent spending load.
None of our kids are following in his footsteps though and he seems to resent spending money on their college. One went to a local Tech school for his associates and landed a fantastic job upon graduation. One chose an expensive out of state school that costs about $5k/year more than our state flagship. We paid everything for his freshman year but next year are capping what we will pay and expect him to use his savings and work hard this summer to cover the balance. If necessary we will loan him some money at a favorable rate, but we have another kid coming up in two years and want to cap our investment. Also, he needs skin in the game. You are definitely not alone in this difference of opinion!