<p>I wonder how much all of the information on the internet has contributed to this problem of multiple rejections from “match” schools, etc? According to the college search sites, DS has NO matches anywhere in the country :). Now, we know that is not true, but the schools he has visited and loves, have everything he wants one is a reach the others he comes in just fine with the stats (top 25% which is why they aren’t matches). He would be trilled to attend any of his top 3 choices but on paper, he doesn’t belong at any of them. Are people putting too much stock in these college matches? DD has a few “matches” but one of those we visited and she hated it. The schools she has visited and loves, don’t show up as even a close match, but again, they have what she wants, have great placement rates into med school 95+%, etc. We have gone about the search process somewhat backwards and did visits first (after researching on the school websites to make sure they had the programs the kids want) and eliminating schools that way. We figure why waste the time applying if you don’t like it?</p>
<p>skier, Your S sounds like a great young man. Kids are resilient. He’ll leap this hurdle and move on and you must too.</p>
<p>My S1 (with great stats, etc) went to our big state u. on scholarships by choice (when I thought another might be a better choice). Then by chance (or maybe not), during soph. yr. he found one of his instructors had previous experience with the very selective program S1 was working toward. This man guided S1 through the app./training process. When S1 spent a summer training w/ other candidates, he couldn’t believe what little support they had received at their bigger name schools. In his senior yr. S1 was selected (only 12 taken nationwide) for the program. His roommate was selected too. Their univ. was the only one in the country that year to get two guys in.
S1 said it would not have happened if not for the mentoring/guidance they received at regular ol’ state u. Coincidence or meant to be? I like to think it was meant to be.</p>
<p>Your S will land in the place where he is meant to be and won’t believe he ever wanted to be anywhere else. Best wishes in making the choice.</p>
<p>I couldn’t help reading this thread as it brings back some painful memories but great outcome. D1 is about to graduate college after an amazing four years. She too had stats and EC’s that put her in the top 25% of every top school in the country. She only applied to 8 schools because she “knew herself” and was not a prestige hunter. Her high school teachers were disappointed she was not going to a “top” school or ivy, but she only applied to 2 ivies, and 3 other schools that are “reaches” for everyone. Waitlisted at 2, rejected at 3 which left her 3 “safeties/match” schools. As a parent we teach our children to do their best, blah, blah, but this application process also teaches us that life is often unpredictable and I think “unfair” sometimes. I promise you will look back on your son’s journey and be so proud of him. It is more important to learn from failures, and rejections and turn it around. My D1 has engaged herself fully in college, has been adored by professors and has made amazing and strong friendships. She is about to go off to a very challenging and demanding career choice and is ready because she is confident and feels great about her abilities. Ready to face whatever comes. I tell other parents going thru it that the kids do much better than the parents. It is very important that when our children “fall down” , sometimes it is better for them to learn how to pick themselves up. D2 got nervous, applied to 14 schools! (I know excessive) and had more choices. That’s another story but she is very happy too.
Where ever your son decides to go to college, he will figure it out. Hopefully he is happy, but if not, as painful as it may seem at the time, he can transfer.<br>
Just a “side note” about Stony Brook vs. F&M, very DIFFERENT schools. I know students at both very well. I know my children have been very happy at LAC’s (I am going thru the process now with kid #3) but obviously other kids prefer larger universities.
If he likes Lehigh, I suggest the guidance counselor make some calls, have your son write still interested letter. These smaller schools love when you show the love. DS1 also w/l at lehigh and is waiting to hear from his #1 choice but has some good other options. (He won’t let me get crazy about it and he thought I was “nuts” when my two girls were going thru the process.)</p>
<p>Four years later, I am much more relaxed and “go with the flow” now. I learned a great deal from my children! Love them lots. Just needed a son to help keep things in perspective! Ever read “ZITS” comic strip? Fits my relationship with my son perfectly. Look it up on line. Will give you a few smiles during this time. Many hugs. He will be fine and I am proud of your son even though I haven’t met him!</p>
<p>Skier…be proud of the fact that you counseled your child to cast a broad net with respect to potential options. I am seeing and hearing of so many situations where expectations have resulted in all rejections and waitlists. Your child will make lemonade wherever he chooses! Congratulations on being close to the other side of the madness!</p>
<p>Skier: Sorry about the circumstances. Clearly neither you nor DS2 did anything wrong. In fact, I think you both showed better judgment than many applicants, especially with Presidential Scholar-level statistics.</p>
<p>It always hurts when the top choice doesn’t say “yes,” even when the alternatives are excellent. From my vantage point, both Franklin & Marshall and SUNY Stony Brook are great schools. SUNY Stony Brook has world leaders in nuclear physics on the faculty, including a Nobel laureate (I believe–at least they have had one in the recent past–not sure how old he is now). One of my colleagues is a Franklin and Marshall alum, and if any indications can be drawn from his work, it provides a top-notch education.</p>
<p>There might be some special draw of Lehigh for your son, which makes it worth waiting for. In that case, it would be good for your son to send them additional information, beyond his statement of interest in staying on the waitlist. Aside from what he sends, he might ask teachers or advisors/managers of EC groups who did not write for him before to do so now.</p>
<p>I don’t think they will take only full-pay students from the waitlist. I agree with mini that they will take students with financial need (and meet it) as the total budget allows.</p>
<p>While I think they are accurate in saying that the waitlist is not ranked, I suspect that it might be classified into sub-categories, according to need, but also according to the “niche” that the student would fit on campus (e.g., intended major, participation in music, athletics, journalism . . . , potential for leadership, geography, and other qualities).</p>
<p>I would guess that, in practice, when there is an opening to take a student from the waitlist, admissions looks at the available budget. Then, within that constraint, they look at the group of students at the top of each niche (who are not ranked relative to each other) and at the niches that they want to fill. </p>
<p>Beyond that, I think that most universities will look again at the students who sent them some reason to reconsider–those students may jump to the head of the queue, again validating the idea that the waitlist is “unranked.”</p>
<p>I think that geographical considerations probably reduced your son’s chances in the regular admissions round. However, at waitlist stage, I’d guess that no longer applies, for several reasons: If a college has a large number of applicants from the northeast, they may cut off that geographic pool at a higher level of qualification than applies to students from other areas; so the applicants from the northeast wind up at the top of the waitlist de facto (right–it’s not ranked–but in terms of qualifications, at the top). They will probably admit a reasonably large number from the northeast, in the regular round. But also, some number of admitted students from the northeast will go elsewhere (quite possibly a larger number than the college is losing from other geographic regions), creating openings in that niche (or sub-niche). Then, if your son has given them a reason to reconsider, combining all of these factors, I’d say he stands a reasonable chance of admission from the waitllist.</p>
<p>skier, I really feel for you! Selective college admissions is a crap shoot for high stats kids and who knows if there was anything you could have done to stack the odds in your son’s favor. I am glad he has some decent options. I could really relate to the restaurant analogy! </p>
<p>I think at this point you are going to want to look forward rather than back. Can you (re)visit all his acceptances with a different eye? </p>
<p>Did you say what your son wants to study? And why does Case leave him underwhelmed? I know a kid who did not get into his top choices a couple of years back and he is happy at Case.</p>
<p>I freally don’t know what people are talking about when they say they fall in the top 25% on the “stats” other than SAT/ACT.</p>
<p>Part of the problem is that the only real statisitcial information most colleges put out with any detail are the SAT or ACT test breakdowns. Some list GPAs or rank, but the grade information is pretty vague and meaningless IMO.At most of these schools they don’t liist GPA, only rank, and virtually everyone is in the top ten percent. So nobody really knows with any granularity where their kids fall wrt grades or high school transcript - and so many kids have perfect grades with a zillion APs anyway.</p>
<p>So when someone says “my child’s stats fall in the top 25%” what they really mean is their child’s SAT or ACT scores fall into the top 25%.As we all know, that’s an imporantant stat, but not a silver bullet.</p>
<p>Colleges don’t generally even give their SAT II or AP test breakdown, so you don’t really even have a complete breakdown on all testing. Of course, if you’ve got 800s and 5s across the board you know you’re at the top everywhere, but you don’t know how much company you have up there.</p>
<p>So we can only go with what info we have. I certianly would have considered skier’s list a very safe reasonable choice for a Presidential Scholar candidate.</p>
<p>Agreed that the test scores are only the firm thing you can use. But if you have a kid who is not up there in grades and you see in those schools that virtually everyone is, you know that despite test scores that may be up there, s/he may not be in the running for awards,</p>
<p>^^^
True.</p>
<p>I’d say it’s also probably a better thing to use to identify which schools you might eliminate as possibilties.</p>
<p>Yes, the internet is contributing to this madness as well as common apps, and the computer itself. In my day, to do 20 apps would have been murderous. The time alone would have been tremendous. I had to type every single one of my college apps, and then teachers had to send in each recommendation. I felt I was pushing it with 12. Now it’s a few pushes of some keys, and send, and that’s it for the recs and if you pick common app schools, once you have an array of essays, you are good to go. </p>
<p>This has resulted in problems at the schools too. Imagine getting 3,4 times the number of applications that you have historical data to use as guidelines. You now have a record number of applications, the same number of spaces but you also well know that it’s not that there are necessarily more kids out there for the spots. THey are just applying to more schools. Admissions directors must be getting the sweats thinking about not making the headcount, or a full class when there are so many applicants. They’d look like fools and be fired, and with good reason. But who are the “phantom” applicants? THe ones who just threw the college in the mix, because it was easy to do so? Sometimes they even pan out. But who is going to accept the school when faced with a hand of acceptances?</p>
<p>skier29 Funny that you talk about meeting your husband at school and thats why things happened as they did. Sweet story from my dad…we moved all over the East Coast for his jobs and he often wondered if it was worth it. Then he realized that we had to end up here, so I could meet my husband and he could have his three wonderful granddaughters!</p>
<p>But the flip side is that I attended college, stayed in touch with no one, never used my major professionally, and can only say that the only possible life-changing thing about it was that yes, I have a college degree and maybe it kept me in this area.</p>
<p>Was in a worst place with my dd10…she had one choice. She took it, didn’t like it, transferred and is doing fine now.</p>
<p>It’s so hard to be in the place that you are now and it is fine to whine…but somehow it will work out :)</p>
<p>I think this is why we’re hearing rumors on CC of underadmitting coupled with vast waitlists to control yield.</p>
<p>I’m really not sure those are just rumors.</p>
<p>The waitlists are massive. Seriously, I even wonder if they aren’t just sitting there waiting for people’s GC to call and say, X is this student’s first choice. They “will attend” if admitted.</p>
<p>I think, as Cpt points out, the schools are baffled by this, as well.</p>
<p>“still a nagging feeling of loss and missed opportunity”</p>
<p>This resonates for me and apparently for many others. As parents, we try diligently to provide helpful support and feedback to our students during this process, and then at the end of the day, we still scratch our heads and wonder how things could have ended up as they did. I had pictured my D attending a college different from the one she will be attending. In fact, her guidance counselor convinced her not to even apply to that college. Fortunately, our kids do seem to be more resilient than we are. Mine certainly is. She’s happy and without a doubt will make the best of the outcome. And of course that’s all that matters.</p>
<p>Best wishes to skier and her son, and to everyone else who is still in limbo, through the final stages of this process.</p>
<p>We’re getting through a first choice ED deferral and now a waitlist. It’s hard as parents to see the pain in your child’s eyes over the disappointment, especially when the school in question was not a huge reach. I do question the size of the waitlists at many schools. Seems like a benefit only to the school - they do not need to make a final decision on many candidates, and they have a ready pool of students willing to attend, once they go to the list. </p>
<p>Some students do get off waitlists every year, but this usually involves more work - more love letters, guidance calls (if yours will do that - ours do not), sending grades. I know this is a small thing when you consider the big picture, but enough is enough at some point. (For me, at least. If my D wants to pursue it, though, I will support her.) My D does have two good options, luckily, but the WL at first choice has dampened her enthusiasm for the process.</p>
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<p>D2 stayed on one waitlist, just in case something popped open. But she basically had moved on to making a decision between the 3 finalists that had given her an acceptance. None of this “show more love and keep the dream alive” thing. At some point in time, you have to move on!</p>
<p>FWIW - I did call Lehigh today.
“There is money set aside for financial aid packages for those admitted from the waitlist”</p>
<p>Re; Unranked/non-prioritized; “we have the waitlists in a special pool. when we know how many will come off the waitlist we review that entire pool and select the appropriate number” Yes it helps to send love letters. She specifically mentioned having an alum write a LOR (we dont know any alums - ah well)</p>
<p>When I mentioned DS would likely attend if selected she sighed and said - “if only we could identify those from the regular pool”.</p>
<p>Son will accept the spot, send some updates, but will be deciding between SUNY and F&M without much hope of Lehigh. 14/2914 are not favorable odds.</p>
<p>14/2914…WOW skier!! That is crazy. I told my DS from the start that a WL was like a rejection in our house… CC even emailed him before decisions to ask if he would be willing to be put on a WL if need be and he said, “thanks, but no thanks” at his point they had already played him too long. I know your situation is very different. My S and I had a long talk last night and he is in good spirits, actually said to me he was happy with all his acceptances he got and he is sure he will be happy at one of them. So WHEW!!.. but I know he has to be somewhat bummed. </p>
<p>I think with my S he had such low expectations because he knew he choose his balanced life over his GPA, and took full responsibility for that. He really wasn’t expecting miracles… but maybe I was. LOL!! I think it is much harder for the kids that pour their HS life into doing everything possible to get that GPA… sleepless nights, no life, missed outings with friends…etc, and then they get rejected from their top schools. I think the schools that my S got were matched up perfectly with the amount of effort he put in in HS. We thought it was interesting that it was like a giant axe going down between the schools that accepted him with TONS of merit and FA, to then not even a bone from the schools a little higher in selectivity…</p>
<p>skier - I know several board members at Lehigh. Wish I could somehow make the connection for you. My son applied but we pulled the app after an ed admit, but I do know from everything I’ve heard, at this school in particular you are best served to have shown tremendous interest. In fact his lor were from their board members - at the time I didn’t think it would really matter, now I wonder. But what does that really say about admissions that it matters if you happen to know alum or board members. Given it’s a PA school, what are the chances you’d know someone if you didn’t live in pa, nj & ny?</p>
<p>Skier and everyone here. I just want to say I really send support to you and your kids in these decisions. I’ve been reading this discussion since day one, and it really breaks my heart when kids don’t somehow get into their top choices. I believe if that was our situation I’d have D send another concise letter on why she really wanted to go there and what she could contribute, maybe look into another letter of recommendation, and call it good. I hope something like that works for you, but if not… just get excited about other neat choices. Do that anyway. Lots of prayers and crossed fingers are out here whether or not we post all the time.</p>