My MIL was extremely frugal. She lived through the Great Depression and was widowed young with no savings and four children under five years old. Through the years she built quite a substantial estate, but was still uncomfortable spending anything. H had a heart-to-heart talk with her (actually many) inquiring on how she would like to use her money if she didn’t want to spend it on herself. She said she would like to help with the grandchildren’s education, which was greatly appreciated.
She passed away last year leaving a nice sum to H and his siblings. Thing is, we could have used the money when we were first starting out, but now we really don’t need the money.
So in answer to the OP, we pay for everything. Both “kids” are in career jobs and are very responsible with their money and savings. Our reasoning is that we want to be able to enjoy them receiving our gifts, joint vacations, etc. When they’re in town they take over meals & cleaning so it’s not a one-way street.
We like to enjoy doing things with/for our kids while we can. Whats the fun of their enjoying our $ when we are dead? They’ll get to, but its nice to enjoy it with them now.
I just booked a flight to visit the “kids”. My DIL said, “We can’t wait to take you out to a nice dinner”. That will be a first. Well, not really. I was visiting my son in grad school, and he ordered in Thai food. I fell asleep and he paid, wouldn’t accept $.
What I truly liked was visiting him while he was in school. One night he’d invite friends to join us for dinner. At his wedding, it was nice to see the same young men again.
My generosity involves happily paying for guest to be put up in a hotel. But I could tolerate a guest in my home better than I could ever stay in anyone else’s house. That is something I hope never ever to do again ( my last time was 25 years ago when after a night on a lumpy mattress at my brother in laws I told my husband we’d be checking into the beautiful resort 5 miles from their home for the rest of the week. )
This whole thread has been very enlightening to me. I think I need to stop fretting about this. The issue of vacations is not ripe for us. Ds has no S.O., so a wife and grandchildren are clearly far in the future. Dh and I discussed, and I think we would be wiling to spring for a large family vacation for him and his family once every five years or so if they wanted that. I think the dynamic is slightly different with an only. It’s not like we are going to rent a large vacation home and expect at least two or three of four adult children would join us. Also, if ds and future family didn’t us want to join us at Disney, we’d likely do something else.
I truly appreciate the sentiments on having children enjoy WITH us now rather than WITHOUT us after we die. But, that is part of the reason I make annual cash gifts to ds. So far, he seems to have squirreled those away. He doesn’t need cash gifts from me, but I have the money, and I can give it, so I do. Not sure how long I will continue those.
The key for me is the attitude of the adult child. I feel as though the adult children of my friends in my OP “expect,” it. I really couldn’t abide by that.
What a thought-provoking topic, Hogirl - thank you. So interesting to hear everyone’s views.
My parents when they were alive always offered to pay, even to the extent of insisting on giving me money for gas/tolls when I drove (1 hour) to visit them. Now that I have adult children, I understand more. It’s such a blessing to spend time with the people they have become, you want to facilitate.
I will I guess continue to pay and hope that kids will offer to do so occasionally (because it shows generosity of spirit). They have a few times and it’s been really nice!
As I probably said before, we have taken our adult kids (and the 1 serious SO at the time) on “ALL expenses paid by parents” vacations. But I’m thinking we won’t do it every time. I just got back from a vacation with one son and his SO. I am now retired, and they both now make more than I do. The main reason I went on this trip with them was bc otherwise they wouldn’t have gone or would have paid at least $1,000 to rent a car. So, we split the rental in 3 (really close to 4, bc I had a friend come for several days). I think I will wind up paying a little more for groceries, etc., but will come close to splitting those also. The last trip we went on with these same kids they paid something, but not “full cost.”
Related question that I started to think about on vacation… do you take the kids on vacations while they are young and have the time/fewer obligations, or do you wait (hope) for grand children and take them then? We will likely do some of both.
How would you handle it if you “like” going on vacation with some kids, but not so much others? If some can afford it and others can’t? If some “invite you” and some don’t? (Obviously you don’t go with the ones who don’t invite you).
I say both to the first part of the question. I have an only so can’t speak to the second part.
Just hoping my D wants to continue to travel with us. I know after college, I had zero interest in traveling with my parents.
I will say that I have a hard time traveling with folks outside my immediate family. I think I’m too set in my ways. We’ve tried to do a couple of vacations with the inlaws and friends and they were awful for me. Too many conflicting priorities and it tends to be super stressful. Most of it is just basic differences - morning people vs night owls, adventurous vs safe, gourmet meals vs casual, partiers vs homebodies, neat freaks vs slobs, etc… ; ).
Also 100% agree! And have felt that way when my kids were younger and now as they are in college. My kids have never expected or “demanded” anything . Or whined about the newest version of X or name brand Y, etc.
So it is nice to be able to pay for things that they may not expect us to.
We traveled with our kids from the time they were in diapers. We chose age appropriate things - grandparents (both sets lived far away), parks, Disney + similar, road trips, etc.
The only time H and I traveled without kids was once per year for our Anniversary and that was never more than 3 days. When we did longer anniversary trips they came along.
It’s not at all a surprise to me that our kids have a wandering mentality too. It’s both genetic and how they were raised. We all want to explore and enjoy a variety of options the world offers.
For much for my kids’ lives, we weren’t doing much better than living paycheck to paycheck, so big vacations didn’t happen. However, I think we did visit every attraction/activity in a 5 hour radius. It was also nice having free lodging in the DC area until my parents retired.
10 years ago was our first big trip to Cape Cod/Acadia. It’s funny now, but we rented a van and drove up 95 vs 81 because I wanted my kids to at least see the skylines of the big cities. We’ve seen enough cows and farms! Since then, we’ve been fortunate enough to travel a good bit. Not near as much as many here, but way more than most from my city. I mostly wanted to show my kids everything that was out there. So many possibilities and don’t be afraid to try anything once. And we almost always rely on public transportation. I didn’t want them to feel afraid or stuck unsure of what to do.
I’d love to be able to take my kids and their families once they are gown. I doubt we can do the 3 week european trips like mine have done for us a few times in the last 10 years, but I’d still like to do something at some point. Right now, we definitely include older S because younger S is still a dependent. It’s a weird transition time.
We have already done one trip with the kids and SOs. No grandchildren yet. No weddings yet, but we think one engagement is soon to be announced. Will continue when there are grandkids, though those will likely be coming to one or more vacation houses.
Two other interesting questions. First, one of our kids is likely to do very well (Silicon Valley VC-backed entrepreneur) with the right educational background. I asked him, if he does very well, to make sure he takes care of his sister. Has anyone else done something like this?
Second involves vacation houses that went from family ownership under the parents to ownership by a subset of the kids. My in-laws transferred one cottage to their kids. Because it was owned by 4 kids and only three and then 2 wanted to pay for it, it fell into disrepair. This past year, I organized a buyout of the 2 who didn’t want to pay for it and we knocked it down and ShawWife and her sister organized the building of a new house there.
Here’s the question. The sib who originally had contributed to the upkeep of the place but then dropped out has always wanted to use the house for free (as if they were paying for it). It was awkward when the first year after the dropped out, they gave us their preferred date as if they were were still equal partners. After we bought them out, the BIL intimated that they were expecting to still being able to stay there. Awkward. I sent out an email along with the transaction that the BIL who is one of the remaining owners is a black and white kind of guy and he decided that he would prefer not to rent it, but if we rent it, it would have to be at market rates but that there would be a discounted rate for family.
Have you guys ever had a family property whose ownership devolved to a subset of the kids? How have you dealt with other kids who still want to go back to the family property for free?
I’m surprised to read that you told your S that if he “does very well” to take care of his sister, but then later in the post you talk about how BIl wants to stay for free at the family vacation house (without having kept up with his share of expenses over the years) and are clearly bothered by that.
First, I’d be bothered, too, by the latter.
But me being bothered by that doesn’t matter.
I’m just thinking your frustration with BIL seems very inconsistent given your own expectation and request to your S that he take care of your daughter (his sister) in the future, if he does really well. Why?
Maybe I’m missing something.
(I’m multitasking so it’s entirely possible.)
My friend assumes her son will take care of his sister if she needs it. The daughter has a college degree but does have some special needs. She did an internship in a lab in college, is doing one now in a bakery, but has never had a paying job. She hopes to start her own baking business, but they don’t think she’ll support herself. She will inherit the same sum as her brother, not from the parents but from grandparents (one gf died last year, one just died).
I don’t think your son should have to ‘take care’ of his sister, @shawbridge. She’s a nurse an makes her own money and can support herself. Things might not be even if your son is making boatloads of money, but everything in life isn’t even.
I have two friends who will have guardianship for their special needs siblings when their parents die. The inheritance is set up appropriately so that they are compensated for the heavy caregiving needs that will be required.
I can’t image asking one sibling to take care of another who is capable of caring for themselves.
My mom and aunt helped their four siblings throughout life and after death (for my mom). They were the oldest two and were able to go to college allowing them to have better jobs. The college money ran out afterward. My grandparents never told them to do anything. It’s simply what they wanted to do.
I would never ask one kid “to take care” of the other short some kind of actual disability that would put employment or self-care in question.
Right now, ds1 is married to a woman who has a trust fund thanks to her late gf. It’s not huge – not by cc “wealthy” standards – but it has enabled them to buy a house in this hot market and will pay for her advanced degrees. Invested well, the balance will be a nice nest egg that will make life so much easier for them. Ds2 has chosen a life in the arts for now. He got a degree from a “name” school and could be making bank like some of his classmates, but he chose not to go that route.
Now, I know that if the arts kid makes it big he’d be generous with his brother, just as the brother with access to a trust fund will be generous to his now-“poor” artsy brother. But I would never say it’s my expectation that one take care of the other. We all make our choices. Dh’s brother owns a company and is much wealthier than my teacher dh. He buys dinners out occasionally and gives us a present at Christmas, but I don’t think he has any obligation to “take care” of us.