<p>The combination of laziness, entitlement, and not following family rules drives me nuts too! My son drifts into that state from time to time and I employ what is known here as the “hard crackdown”. It involves taking away all toys and privileges that hard work (mine) gave him - ipod, cell, laptop, expensive sports, allowance, etc; having him earn his own money (leaving very little time to spend it); restricting friends from visiting and visa versa; and having a heart to heart talk about what his future will look like if he continues on his path vs. his true potential as a human being. I’m willing to allow him to make choices about his career, college or not, etc. but he must put good effort into high school and whatever else he chooses. So far, this method has quickly produced results the few times it’s been needed and he now only needs to hear the word “crackdown” to change his attitude!</p>
<p>Lots of issues to discuss here but to the OP’s question about Marist vs CofC: I agree with #19 – Marist rather than CofC. There are plenty of non-partying, serious students of CofC and the school does offer support to students with learning issues BUT even the admin person I spoke with told me that a student needs self-discipline and focus to avoid the party scene. It sounds like this may not describe your child currently. </p>
<p>I’d also think about the distance from home. You may want to be within a 2 hour drive time, just in case you need to get to the school quickly. I know that sounds a bit dramatic, but you have a s who sounds like he is dealing with a lot of issues. </p>
<p>Working a low paying, dead end job with adults who can’t get better jobs can be a wake up call, too. I have a musician s, too. At first I worried he’d start partying with those folks but he learned to appreciate how difficult life can be on minimum wage.</p>
<p>My parents sent my brother to college when he wasn’t ready (poor grades, bad attitude, drug usage). He got bad grades there and eventually quit. After a few years working crap jobs, he got married, got religion. He straightened up and went back to college. And he had to overcome the horrible grades he got from his initial trip to college. Today, he is a functioning and thriving member of society.</p>
<p>Best, I think, is to send your son when he is ready. Then he will start with a clean slate rather than having to undo a bunch of bad grades earned when he didn’t have his act together.</p>
<p>Face it. Your son isn’t ready yet. Don’t send him yet.</p>
<p>Really, how does decide readiness versus senior year ‘stuff’? That’s what I seem to be struggling with via S. He had great grades as a frosh, soph, but they trailed downward as the work got more difficult, and as he invested heavily in ECs (to the point of having been just offerred a FT job from one connection). Teachers love him - he’s invested in a classroom generally, just has failed to do HW, particularly busy work - and that’s cost him a great deal. Grades this year flew up and down - low grades in the 1st quarter (multiple Cs for my former 3.9 kid), followed by similar stuff in the second quarter in a very tough courseload. Here in the 3rd quarter, a turnaround to all As and two Bs after at one point early in the quarter being warned that he was in danger of failing 2 classes due to his failure to hand in work! He’s not thrilled with his admissions results, and so has reached out to find an internship -and found a paying job that he’s yet to accept… </p>
<p>Oh, the gray hairs… </p>
<p>Is he ready for college?</p>
<p>Tough one. I’ve had friends who have had it go both ways - succeed in college and fail in college. My son was a pain in the you know where his senior year because he just wanted to get out of dodge so to speak, but he has succeeded in college. Regardless of how my children act in high school they all know that if they do not perform adequately (C average is as low as we’ll go for freshman year) we will “yank” the finances and any college going forward will be on their dime. If you can afford to “risk” a year’s tuition then I might let him go. But be prepared to back up your plan of ceasing college payments if he fails in his freshman year. I would let “him” pick the college so that it can’t come back on you (that you picked the college and it wasn’t the “right” one.) If up until this point in his life he has been doing fine, if he chose the colleges to apply to and was engaged in the process, if he wants to leave then I think the odds tilt toward him. If you dragged him into the process, held his hand through the applications, took him to visits when he was disengaged…then I think it could potentially be a problem. My painful senior son, wanted to go to colleges, picked the colleges he applied to, willingly did his apps, liked visiting colleges, hated senior year of high school, did his essay on why he couldn’t wait to get out of high school. While the day to day living with him that last year was painful for my husband and I, clearly this was a kid that needed to move to the next step of life. So my advice is to step back and take a look at what led up to his behavior this year and if it’s relatively new behavior or if he’s been disengaged for a long time.</p>
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<p>Uh oh, I think I’m in trouble with my S. </p>
<p>OP, sorry you’re having to struggle with this. My S has been an underacheiver throughout HS, but fortunately, no drugs are involved. He’ll be heading to college with a contract from us that includes a minimum 2.0 gpa in freshman year with no grades below a “C” and weekly contact, however minimal I expect it will be, with us.</p>
<p>Good luck.</p>
<p>“Best, I think, is to send your son when he is ready. Then he will start with a clean slate rather than having to undo a bunch of bad grades earned when he didn’t have his act together.”</p>
<p>I will say that one son of friends trashed his freshman yearat a very, very good school, the parents pleaded and got him back in for second year. He failed that too. They cut off the college finances. The kid took a couple years off, enrolled at a fine school at age 22 and graduated Magna Cum Laudeat age 25. Sometimes these kids just need to mature and I don’t think one bad attempt at age 17 or 18 will hurt them all that much when they try again a couple years later. Colleges see freshman failure of 17 and 18 year olds, even the top colleges. Other friends of ours were concerned about their son (who wanted to become a doc.) They allowed him to move into an apartment and go to cc for one year to test the waters. While he wanted to be a doc he wan’t very engaged in high school with the “looking for colleges” exercise and it scared his parents. He successfully navigated the study/party balance at the cc and then moved onto a very good school because of his decent high school grades + a solid freshman year at the cc. They weren’t too thrilled about living with him another year so the apartment + cc was a way to “test the waters.”</p>
<p>Peppermint why is your son not thrilled by his admissions results? Did he pick the colleges were he applied?</p>
<p>I should have made my name: mykid is acting like an idiot. He’s not an idiot and I guess that log in name is pretty negative. I wouldn’t be on here if I really thought he was. He is out of control right now and spiraling down and it’s just so hard to watch someone you love destroy their opportunities. I like the advice of the least expensive acceptance. It’s hard when the other schools are more prestigious and he was lucky to get in but maybe we could position it that he can transfer if he proves himself. He left a bong in the backseat of the car last night. This is the stuff I’m dealing with. It’s so frustrating and I feel completely depressed and saddened about it. It could have been so different and he is throwing it away. I don’t think it is bad to say that I actually don’t like him right now-not PC but many parents must feel this way. He is not an idiot and I do love him but man, it is really tough right now.</p>
<p>I feel the same way - there are days that I love my kid, but he drives me crazy. My S was not invested in the process-save for two schools he would have loved but got denials-and found it false. He tends to overinvest in one area to the downside of others, this year it was an EC that took 30 hours a week. He’s the go to person when invested, but he’s ooc when not. He’s also highly changeable - got a job offer yesterday related to the EC - and goes back and forth about whether to take it or go to college…</p>
<p>I have to see my stylist to address these gray hairs…</p>
<p>Look, life is long. A lot of kids go off to all sorts of schools and drink themselves right out of those same schools. A lot of adults later smoke and drink themselves out of jobs and marriages and kids and all sorts of things.</p>
<p>You hold the checkbook in his life, at least for a little while longer. I would really suggest that you are partially, only partially, out of denial, and you may well need to look into entirely OTHER options for this kid.</p>
<p>For example, Outward Bound, for the summer. Possibly even treatment for his addiction.</p>
<p>Social use is social use, but leaving a bong in the backseat of the car suggests something else entirely. This isn’t really a “which school should he go to,” thread. It is a “he’s not ready” thread. I understand how much you want to send him to school and just keep hoping for the best, but it may well be that the best way to insure that he does not throw away ALL of his opportunities is to get him some real help for his problems.</p>
<p>I’d trust your instincts on this one. Whatever drug use you are actually “seeing” is a fraction of what is going on. I’m not sure college is what your son needs right now.</p>
<p>Good luck to you, really. I would def. get him assessed for addiction, though. ADHD kids are at a HUGE risk for drug addiction, especially bright ones, and you really have to keep an eye on it and just hope it has not progressed too far beyond what you have seen. </p>
<p>It takes a while to address these kinds of things, but it isn’t a kids are kids thing when it begins to interfere with his ability to function in the world, when it becomes his world. I’m sorry you face this, really, but I’d get some professional help ASAP!</p>
<p>Is it possible for your son to defer one of his college acceptances until next year? The one that would fit him best if he were to get his act together?</p>
<p>And I am saying this nicely.</p>
<p>And in the meantime he would have to get his “act” together. Insist upon employment, or a volunteer/internship and following the rules of the house. Clearly outlined rules.</p>
<p>I realize there are as many parenting styles out there as there are parents but I am known for being the “mean” mom. Single mom that puts up with little and has high, HIGH expectations.</p>
<p>No driver’s licenses for kiddos until they can afford their own car and their own insurance. No cellphones. No ipods. No computers. No game systems. At least on my dime or time. Their jobs during high school were to get good grades, graduate and matriculate. And they knew well ahead of time there was no college money.</p>
<p>It would be up to us as a family and they as good students to make it work. Some went to a CC and transfered with great scholarships, some had great scholarships straight from high school and others were fortunate to matriculate to schools that met their full financial need with no gaps. They knew this early going in so if they didn’t have their “act” together they knew their options would be limited.</p>
<p>And a bong in MY CAR??? Oh no!!! And he can still walk and talk this morning???</p>
<p>Mine are restricted on HOW they can speak to me, no less having that kind of stuff. As my boys would say, “RUN, she is soooooooooooooo ANGRY”.</p>
<p>With my boys all being defensive and offensive lineman (ie HUGE) and all of my 5 foot tall angry mommy I needed to have a strict household with little to no raised voices.</p>
<p>I can’t suggest on how I would handle the situation you have now as that I haven’t experienced it however, it is obvious that you love him very much. Love isn’t just how you feel but how you treat him and what you expect from him. Let him know.</p>
<p>Over and over. And over.</p>
<p>And I am saying that nicely.</p>
<p>Kat
Hope it gets better.</p>
<p>“He left a bong in the backseat of the car last night.”</p>
<p>If one of our boys did that my husband would tell them to their face that they are an idiot! I’m comismerating 
I really am.</p>
<p>Are you guys talking (parents and son) or are you yelling and he’s not talking or are you yelling and he is talking? What are his friends doing? Are his friends going to college? Has he changed friends this year? Have you set firm study time and taken away the car keys? Have you put any restrictions on him? Do you think he’s in danger of getting in a position where he will be arrested? (If he’s leaving bongs in the backseat, I might be scared to death of this one depending on what the laws of your state are.) Rebellion is one thing, but he’s underage still (I assume) so you have a right to be a parent and crack down in whatever way you feel you need to.</p>
<p>There is really two separate issues the first being is he engaging in behavior that could harm him in the future because of a legal record, failing school etc. and the second issue which is what to do with him next year.</p>
<p>Agree it may be time for some professional intervention.</p>
<p>Best case- he’s bored, a little immature, and will rise to the occasion when surrounded by high achieving peers.
Worst case- he’s on his way to a drug addiction and it won’t matter where or when he goes to college- he’ll need help regardless to get himself out of whatever trouble he’s going to land in.
Most likely case (in my opinion based on what I’ve observed in life)- it also doesn’t matter where he goes to college since he’s likely to mess up Freshman year anyway. If his roommate is a studious engineering kid who is on full scholarship and has to maintain a 3.7 in order to stay in college and therefore sleeps 8 hours a day and works the rest of the time-- from what you’ve described, your son is likely to crash on someone else’s floor rather than rise to those expectations.</p>
<p>I would be inclined to give your kid the benefit of the doubt, i.e. he’s acting out, has some unresolved issues with his ADHD, is immature but not a candidate for a residential treatment program.</p>
<p>I’d sit down with him and outline the following:
–We love you and want you to succeed at whatever you decide you want to do.
–We do not tolerate drug use- here, at your friends homes, in our car, wherever. If you use again, you will be escorted to the door and we will be happy to forward your stuff to wherever you end up finding a place to live.
–We believe that you will be successful in college once you get your act together. Once you demonstrate that you have your act together, we will all work as a team to make it happen (financially etc.) Until you have your act together, we will all work as a team to get you launched into Plan B- job, internship, volunteer work. You tell us what it’s going to be.
– Our love for you is infinite; our financial resources are finite since we have to keep a roof over our head, pay taxes, eat every once in a while. So we won’t be paying tuition so that you can party your way through Freshman year. Demonstrate to us that you are ready to go to class, do the reading, write the papers, show up for the labs and office hours, and we will happily put down the deposit at the college of your choice.</p>
<p>YMMV.</p>
<p>OP, I sympathize with you completely. My older kids seemed to be on a rampage to systematically destroy every positive thing that they did their entire lives in a very short period of time. There really is no definitive answer to your situation, as you probably know.</p>
<p>I sent my problem child off to college. I don’t know if it was the right thing to do. I could not have him around the house and it was the cheapest and the most socially accepted thing to do at the time. I paid those first year college costs really to most easily put him away, far away from us. He was in rebellion mode and was stirring up trouble and conflict at home. I made it very clear to him that if he got thrown out of college for whatever reason, home was not going to be the sanctuary for him unless things changed drastically. He told me he would rather go to a homeless shelter than come back home. Fine with me.</p>
<p>Some of S’s friends took an involuntary gap year by getting caught at their mischief. That took care of that problem for them. Mine did not, and so the college offer was open and ready. I don’t think H and I could have handled a year with him at home the way things were going. </p>
<p>So off to college, he went, and he is now graduating on time in 4 years. Yes, he got into some trouble at college too. He had one term where his gpa was abysmal and would have been thrown out of many colleges for that kind of non performance. H and I were tormented as to whether we should withdraw the financial support at that time. Instead, we told him that college was not for everyone, and if this was the type of performance he was going to continue to have and life he was going to lead, he was out after a probationary semester. We had a long discussion, not all of it good, and basically we gave him a chance. He improved his grades considerably and stayed out of trouble the next term. Had that not happened, we would have probably helped him transition to a job and to stay in his college town, because for him to move back in with us would have caused us too much stress.</p>
<p>I think the fact that we did not get angry, just sad, and tried to come to a solution to his issues and letting him know our issues and breakpoints too, made a big difference to him. It was not an angry confrontation. Just a session of what alternatives he and we had. I think that shook him more than any threats or punishments. We told him he was now an adult, and what we could offer him and what we could not.</p>
<p>It has not been smooth sailing but better. He will be graduating next month, and now we have to discuss the next step. We’ll help find an apartment and hopefully he gets a job. He still is not at the point where he can live at home with us and not make things and us crazy here.</p>
<p>It is a rough time when the kids hit that particular skid in life.-</p>
<p>Oh, and he does not have car privileges at all.</p>
<p>I worked in the heartbreaking addiction field for years, and did my second grad degree in this. I’m concerned and I do not in any way think drug use or addiction or whatnot has much of anything to do with parenting. I know people do, but there is wayyyy too much evidence to the contrary to believe you can parent your kid out of addiction, or experimentation. But, kids who are addicted do not respond to experimenting the way thier peers do. Also, kids who want to be wasted all the time, like adults who want to be wasted all the time, find other people with like interests.</p>
<p>If this is his current EC? Do you think he will join another EC in college?</p>
<p>Be honest with yourself. It doesn’t really matter what I think, or anyone else thinks. But “Completely spiraling out of control,” is actually a textbook definition of addiction. </p>
<p>I don’t know that I would recommend residential treatment, either, unless I saw him. What I do know is that he ought to be seen, by a professional, who can assess the situation, based on whatever facts are available.</p>
<p>Drug testing might be a good idea as well.</p>
<p>Look, it may not be anything. But, it will not hurt to find out. It could hurt not to find out.</p>
<p>I have just one question for the OP:</p>
<p>Do you really expect your S’s behavior to IMPROVE once he’s out from under adult supervision?</p>
<p>My experience is very similar to CPT and how we reacted was similar. I will say that we were nervous as cats that Freshman Christmas break, but he matured quite abit in the first couple months of college and every year gets better and better. Each year he grows further from his high school experiences and becomes his own person. But it could easily have gone the other way, which I’m sure CPT would agree with on some level. On some wierd level we were glad our child chose to rebel his senior year because it gave us that year to attempt to get to the root of everything and one more year to instill some street intelligence. I don’t know what I would have done had he chose to fall apart his freshman year of college as some of our friends’ kids did. His entire senior class was a handful and the entire administration was glad when they graduated. They were an exceptionally smart class of kids that could dream up a million ways to rebel…and they did.</p>
<p>Another mom with a son who may or may not make it through freshman year…just noting that all of these types of threads seem to be about SONS!</p>
<p>Time to talk, without raising your voice. Time to call it like it is. Time to see what he wants to do next year, and then set financial limits. He will either find motivation and get his act together, or he will hit bottom and realize something has to change drastically. I agree that a gap year might be good, but you might loose him forever. I like the idea of an outward bound type program for summer, and college with financial strings. If he doesn’t meet guidelines, looses his scholarship etc, he his on his own.</p>