<p>Assuming an 8th grader who wants to be prepared when it is time to apply to their Dream College........</p>
<p>Parents: Knowing what you know now, if your son/daughter was an 8th grader all over again, what would you do differently through the high school years? And what would you do the same? What do you wish you had known then, that you found out too late?</p>
<p>Students: Same question, only for the student - what advice would you give the 8th grader?</p>
<p>I think many 8th graders have heard of Harvard/Stanford/Ivies and feel that it would be really cool to go there. It is certainly good to encourage them with this, but there is really no way of knowing whether or not an eighth grader is going to follow thru or not. If they plan on Harvard, it shows a good attitude. However, it is not really important that they go to an elite college. Even for the people who are accepted to elite colleges, it is possible that they may decide to save $100K by going to the state university. </p>
<p>My point about 8th graders, though, is that it is too early to tell. It is a grade famous of puberty. Probably somebody who is very oriented towards college in 8th will continue with it into high school, but wanting to go to an elite college is not the same thing as wanting to do the work necessary to go to an elite college. My advice to parents would be to encourage, but to take things as they come. It is not a good idea to have a goal of going to an elite college, and then if it doesn't happen, to feel that the child and the parents are failures.</p>
<p>Other advice would be to read about how insanely competitive the elite college admissions process is. I would recommend that the parents get a admissions guide and read it. They can then pass the information onto the child, but I would not recommend that you expect the child to read it themselves. You need to understand the place that extracurriculars play in the process, the importance of taking the most challenging curriculum offered, the importance of summer activities, and the importance of volunteer work. The child should take Algebra in 8th so that they can take Calculus in high school. I see the best way to get your kid into a "good" school is to adopt the attitude of a coach. The kid calls the shots and decides what to do, and the parents provide support and get the information for the child so that they know what they have to do. If the child decides not to pursue it, then it doesn't happen.</p>
<p>Student here. Firstly: realize that you have three years to be ready for the application......not four. Secondly: realize that many high schools find creative ways to limit the advanced courses that your student may need. Thirdly: self motivation and internal drive are important to get through the process. If you have visions of herding cats through the college process you will realize that the student needs to own this process.</p>
<p>Do NOT let your child become set on one institution early in the process. High school is truly a rollercoaster ride, and nothing is guaranteed.</p>
<p>I would have started the financial planning part earlier. Start saving big time. Move money out of your child's name (or UTMA accounts) into yours so it will "count less" for financial aid.</p>
<p>My daughter did it all on her own. She decided freshman year that she wanted an elite college. She planned her HS career accordingly. I think it really has to come from the kid. She was accepted to 6 Ivies and is a 1st year at Harvard now. </p>
<p>Start looking at fastweb.com now. Some scholarships are awarded to freshman and sophomores. By junior year, you will be too busy to attack many of them. </p>
<p>Start touring colleges of interest freshman year. Start with schools close to home so you have something to compare against. Plan to hit your highest interest schools spring break of junior year. By that time you will have a good idea whether the Ivies are realistic. </p>
<p>Start taking standardized tests as a freshman. Taking the PSAT freshman and sophomore years as practice is good (talk to your HS counselor early). Taking SAT practice tests (available on-line) periodically is good. Take SAT for score during spring of junior year. Plan to take it again early senior year if needed. </p>
<p>Plan for SAT II subject matter tests (3 needed). Schedule them soon after the related course is completed. Again, they need to be completed by the November test date of senior year for EA applicants. </p>
<p>Find an EC that you love and stick with it. Become a leader. Accomplish something other than holding the title.</p>
<p>Don't think of EC's as being extracurricular activities at school. A strong EC is an interest, and not so much a club.</p>
<p>Don't take the SAT more than three times. Most colleges will take your best subscores and combine them rather than your best "single sitting" combination. If you take it more than three times, though, schools will start averaging the scores instead of picking the best subscores.</p>
<p>As been said, the child has to want it themselves and has to be willing to make the extra effort. However, I don't subscribe to the idea that the child has to do it by themselves. If a parent can read about the process and then pass the information onto the child, I think that is ideal. I don't think that it is fair (or smart) for the parent to buy a college admissions guide, and tell the child to read it. For one thing, the child has more important things to do such as studying. For another thing, the parent can better interpret the material and then teach it to the child.</p>
<p>I have to disagree with the "visit colleges during your freshman year". If I had done that with my d she would have been completely burned out by now (junior year). She hated when I even mentioned college planning to her - and with her junior course load, still hates it even though visits are on the horizon. Additionally, she changed so much from freshman to junior year - in interests, personality, career options, etc. that any early visits would have been a waste. I'm even afraid that the ones we take in 2 weeks will be a waste, as she'll change between now and December!</p>
<p>"If they plan on Harvard, it shows a good attitude." </p>
<p>No, if they plan on Harvard it means one of two things:</p>
<ol>
<li>They're snobby, know-it-all, arrogant brats and you need to tell them that they have three years of hard work before they can even think of saying "I plan on Harvard."</li>
</ol>
<p>or </p>
<ol>
<li>Their parents are Ivy-obsessive, over-protective soccer moms and dads who need to stop projecting their false ideas about accomplishment (like getting into Harvard is the only worthwhile goal for a 14 year old) onto their children.</li>
</ol>
<p>Early visits are only to establish a frame of reference. As you noted, junior year is very busy and you will be limited as to how many you can see. What if the top two schools are on different coasts? That's why I recommend doing local area stuff early and holding the top interests until later. My daughter was talking Columbia freshman year, but had never really been on a college campus. I showed her UT (large) and Rice (small) as a frame of reference. Those trips are great bonding and discussion times as well. Again, it depends on the kid. If she isn't interested in where she goes to school, then you can't force it.</p>
<p>
[quote]
No, if they plan on Harvard it means one of two things:</p>
<ol>
<li>They're snobby, know-it-all, arrogant brats and you need to tell them that they have three years of hard work before they can even think of saying "I plan on Harvard."</li>
</ol>
<p>or </p>
<ol>
<li>Their parents are Ivy-obsessive, over-protective soccer moms and dads who need to stop projecting their false ideas about accomplishment (like getting into Harvard is the only worthwhile goal for a 14 year old) onto their children.
[/quote]
Someone sounds bitter, and neither of those is necessarily true.</li>
</ol>
<p>
[quote]
If a parent can read about the process and then pass the information onto the child, I think that is ideal.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>In my daughter's case, she educated me. She read "The Gatekeeper's" and "A is for Admission" and most of the others. I had no clue initially. It was quite an eye opening experience. The campus visits were even more eye opening.</p>
<p>Encourage your child to look forward to High School for its own sake--not just as a springboard to college. Make friends, explore new activities, develop a sense of academic interests. Goal should be a happy well-adjusted HS freshman who enjoys learning and gets along with his peers. Sophomore year is plenty of time to begin the college admissions game--start slowly, check out some college guides (Fisk) with your GC, get a sense of what's out there and what it takes if you're going to be on the IVY-elite school circuit. Good advice: look at your finances -know your limits and strategies. Encourage you son to read for pleasure beyond school assignments .</p>
<p>and my final piece of advice: look at boarding schools.</p>
<p>This is all good advice, I have one thing to add that has helped me, a current senior waiting to hear back from the Ivies. Take the ACT every year, starting as a freshman. I'm not saying that you need to prep or worry about it at all, just take it. This helped me learn the format of it, but mostly it just helped me stay relaxed. But whatever you do, DON'T pressure the kid at all or make them think that their score matters in their freshman and sophomore years, because they don't. When I took it as a freshman, I was hoping for a 26 (what my sister scored as a freshman) and I ended up going way above that. Then my next two years that I took it I was really trying to get those last few elusive points and my score went down. I took it one last time my senior year and I just told myself it didn't matter, and I was able to improve my score. In my opinion, it's all in the mindset. I'm just glad I took it that many times, because it definitely helped me. In no way was I neurotic about it, it was just 3 hours each year that ultimately made a big difference. And since the ACT allows you to pick and choose which scores to send, you can take it as many times as you want without looking psycho!</p>
<p>Oh my god. She's only in freshman year. She shouldnt even be thinking about college as anymore than a distant phenomenon. She should have fun, enjoy high school. She'll have plenty of time to worry about college admissions. (It'll take over her life after the beginning of junior year.) Despite this, definitely encourage her pursue her interests. There seems to be a growing tendency for kids to have a laundry list of EC's that they don't care about. If you can build up a foundation of concrete experiences that relate to an interest outside of school it's a big plus.</p>
<p>That said when the time comes encourage your kid to look at schools outside of the Ivy League. They are good schools, but that's all they are. Look at Liberal Arts, and more esoteric colleges. I believe to many kids apply to the ivy league for the sake of applying. I personally never dreamed of applying to Ivy League schools. Is it because I didn't have the scores? No. There are much better schools than those in the Ivy League.</p>
<p>[edit - Don't send her away to boarding school. That's just ridiculous. I don't think taking the ACT or SAT more than a couple times will help. Just relax until you get to sophomore year at least, then have your kid take the PSAT's.]</p>
<p>Unfortunately, junior year is when it ends, not when it begins. Senior year doesn't really count in the admissions process at all, or very little. Senior year is for having fun. Freshman year does count. </p>
<p>Yes, there are schools outside the Ivies. Many are just as selective as the Ivies, places like Williams, Amherst, Wesleyian. Many are not. It all depends on what you want. </p>
<p>
[quote]
There are much better schools than those in the Ivy league.
[/quote]
That's one opinion. Many would beg to differ.</p>
<p>
[quote]
No, if they plan on Harvard it means one of two things:</p>
<ol>
<li>They're snobby, know-it-all, arrogant brats and you need to tell them that they have three years of hard work before they can even think of saying "I plan on Harvard."</li>
</ol>
<p>or </p>
<ol>
<li>Their parents are Ivy-obsessive, over-protective soccer moms and dads who need to stop projecting their false ideas about accomplishment (like getting into Harvard is the only worthwhile goal for a 14 year old) onto their children.
[/quote]
Would it have been better if I had said Stanford instead of Harvard? Actually the conversation with my S at that about 8th grade was him asking what was the best school in the country. I said Stanford. Then he focused on that as a goal for a few years. He went somewhere else.</li>
</ol>
<p>Good "insider" and "background" books to read are:
"Admissions Confidential" by Rachel Toor
"The Gatekeepers" by Jacques Steinberg
"Harvard Schmarvard" by Jay Mathews
"Take My Kid, Please" by Hank Herman</p>
<p>"A is for Admissions" is dated and idolizes the ivies too much. (IMO)</p>
<p>"The Chosen" is a good book on the history of admissions at the ivies since the 1920's, but won't help you get in.</p>
<p>I disagree with the people who say that you don't have to start in freshman year. It is fine to have fun in high school, but the people who go to the elite colleges probably had fun while preparing to apply to the elite colleges.</p>
<p>There are good reasons to apply to and attend the very top schools. But by definition only a small percentage of students will end up there. There are many more excellent schools, offering superb educations, where good, ambitious students would be very happy and achieve great success of one kind or another. Do not underestimate the importance of "good fit" in the undergraduate experience--it's a bit like marriage --not everyone would be happy with the same sort of "great husband or wife"--money, looks, charm --are all very well but some people are quirkier, more creative, more original than that.</p>
<p>Advice for HS ... take the SAT IIs after you take a specific class in HS. For instance take the US History SAT II right after a course in US or AP US. </p>
<p>This is my only regret... Had I known this advice as a freshman I would have had my SATIIs out of the way.I waited until junior year to take my Sat IIs. It was quite a bother having to study (and relearn) things I had once known really well.</p>