Black Parents: Was I Wrong About Lehigh U?

Parents Forum
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<p>Goldblot: Thanks for the profile. That pie chart says 77% white (not 65% as someone else suggested). The alarming figure for me is the 3% black. That's pitiful. And look at the percentage of NJ students at Lehigh: 27%. That alone is not remarkable. What's remarkable is that there are more students at Lehigh (and Muhlenberg) who are from NJ than from Pennsylvania! I don't get that. I really don't understand how that happens. Both schools are in Pennsylvania, and they are not located in border towns, especially Muhlenberg. I've always assumed state residents would dominate at any college with a first rate reputation. I guess I was wrong.</p>

<p>Anyway, that 3% is pitiful, especially when you consider schools with more selective admission requirements than Lehigh have significantly higher percentages of black students. If a college like Swarthmore can pull in three times as many (percentage-wise) black students, despite stiffer admission requirements, what's the problem with Lehigh? They can't say there aren't any qualified students. I don't think for one minute the administration at Lehigh discriminates. But, I think over the years, fair or not, Lehigh has earned a negative "reputation" with black high school students, and to some extent other minorities, as being an inhospitable place. Scuttlebutt does get around, especially if you're from the tri-state area, which is the case for most of their students.</p>

<p>Anyway, my D will apply to Lehigh - she'll finish her common app this weekend - and I'm not going to talk her out of it. I'll just wait and see what happens and hope for the best.</p>

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<p>Plainsman: You clearly have learned nothing from this thread if you are still focusing on the percentage of students at Lehigh who are from NJ. </p>

<p>Look, either the atmosphere on campus is problematic (from your standpoint) or it's not. That's the question you need to grapple with. Not whether the campus is 5%, 45% or 85% from NJ. You keep trying to use that as a proxy for SOMETHING. It's a proxy for nothing other than exactly what it is -- what % of kids are from NJ.</p>

<p>Have your dd do an overnight, talk to current students, contact an Afr Amer student association on campus. Whatever it takes. But PLEASE, stop linking it to the % of students from NJ.</p>

<p>BTW, did you know that there is a Black Studies major at Lehigh?</p>

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<p>It was my general impression that among the "top 100" (or 200 or 300) or so schools, only "the top 10-20" get above 3 percent African American students. I think Cal/Berkeley might be around 4 percent. How "high" do you have to go to get above 4 or 5 percent?</p>

<p>Perhaps off topic?</p>

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<p>I kind of consider all of the Lehigh Valley a border area since we're less then an hour from New Jersey. I think we're fortunate to have so many good schools in the area but I'm happy my kids chose to go further afield. There is something to be said for new experiences with kids from a different area and since that seems to be a concern, I would strongly suggest it. I think it's pretty ironic that you are surprised that so many kids from NJ attend Lehigh when part of the reason they probably chose it was their parents didn't want them to go more then two hours away - just like you.</p>

<p>As to why more PA students don't attend Lehigh, I think it's because we have more very good private colleges to choose from and when you are talking about private colleges, state lines don't make much difference. I know someone who works at Lehigh and his two boys (both engineering) are attending Case Western and Rensselaer.</p>

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<p>Plainsman: The 65% figure is accurate. This number and the other figures I gave (22% domestic students of color and 6% international) are for the Class of 2012. They can be found here: <a href="http://www3.lehigh.edu/pdf/admissions/LUadmissions_class_summary.pdf%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www3.lehigh.edu/pdf/admissions/LUadmissions_class_summary.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>Note that 4.6% of that class identify as black and another 4.5% choose to self-identify as multiracial. Those figures, especially when summed, compare favorably to Swarthmre's 7.7% black (%multiracial=0, since only single race categories were used for Swat's numbers; <a href="http://www.swarthmore.edu/Documents/administration/ir/cds2007.pdf%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.swarthmore.edu/Documents/administration/ir/cds2007.pdf&lt;/a&gt;). </p>

<p>Also note that there at least twice as many black students in Lehigh's entering class than in Swarthmpre's. </p>

<p>Things at Lehigh are much better than you think, but your selective attention to real and imagined negatives is only serving to create and perpetuate a negative reputation. That is certainly not fair to the students there now, nor to those in future classes, including-perhaps-your daughter.</p>

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<p>How "high" do you have to go to get above 4 or 5 percent?</p>

<p>According to USN Nat'l Universities ranking, the answer is # 32. Some exceptions of course, above and below, especially University of Florida, University of Maryland, University of Georgia....hmmmm.</p>

<p>(NOT University of California)...</p>

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<p>KathieP: "I think it's pretty ironic that you are surprised that so many kids from NJ attend Lehigh when part of the reason they probably chose it was their parents didn't want them to go more then two hours away - just like you."</p>

<p>Yes, that! Good observation. Plainsman, if you're going to want your daughter to stay close to home, then don't be surprised if other people do the same.</p>

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<p>Exactly. Lehigh is VERY close to NJ. NJ doesn't even have that many colleges given the number of college bound students. Many kids go to college within a couple of hours from home. In fact, Plainsman wants his D to do that very thing. If so, she is going to encounter many kids from NJ at the schools that are within a certain radius of where he lives.</p>

<p>The issue for Plainsman should not be "kids from NJ." Rather, if diversity and racial tolerance are big selection criteria for his D, then she needs to examine these factors at the schools on her list and talk to many current students on campus, both White and African American and ascertain the vibe.</p>

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<p>Plainsman -- I have listed below ten Northeastern research universities, including Lehigh. Next to each school is listed, by percentage, the number of African-American students, Total ALANA -- African-American, Latino, Asian/Pacific Islanders, Native American -- students, and Internationals. </p>

<p>Now I would certainly agree with you that the percentage of African-Americans attending Lehigh is low. However, it is not as low as at WPI, Boston University or Brandeis. And Lehigh's 3% is comparable to the percentage of black students at such LACs as Colby, Bates, Bucknell, Middlebury and Union. Other LACs with fewer than 5% African-American students include Skidmore, Hamilton, Kenyon, Wheaton, Dickinson, Franklin and Marshall and Goucher.</p>

<p>I would say that where Lehigh really falls down in comparison to its peers is in enrollment of Asian-American students. Of course, Asian students are often referred to on CC as an OVER-represnted minority. Just not at Lehigh.</p>

<p>Johns Hopkins University (6.4 %, 38.6 %, 5.2 %)</p>

<p>Northeastern (5.5 %, 19.1 %, 4.8 %)</p>

<p>Case-Western Reserve (5.3 %, 24.3 %, 3.5 %)</p>

<p>Carnegie-Mellon (5.0 %, 34.0 %, 14.3 %)</p>

<p>University of Rochester (4.2 %, 15.6 %, 14.6 %)</p>

<p>RPI (4.1 %, 20.6 %, 2.2 %)</p>

<p>Lehigh (3.0 %, 13.0 %, 3.0 %) </p>

<p>Brandeis (2.9 %, 13.7 %, 7.6 %)</p>

<p>Boston University (2.8 %, 23.0 %, 6.3 %)</p>

<p>WPI (2.6 %, 13.0 %, 7.5 %)</p>

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<p>Where/whether a school "falls short" is a matter of perspective and personal pref. For me, the presence of other urm groups is secondary to the number/percentage of black students ernrolled b/c my concern is that D not feel isolated. </p>

<p>Interesting that your list includes two of D1's top three picks (URoch and Kenyon) - - each of which I believe has at least 4% black enrollment (that was my threshold). We initially considered all the LACs on your list (except Midd, Dickinson and Goucher), but moved them to the "B" list or crossed them off entirely b/c of low black enrollment, the campus was too conservative or both. Even with that, D had plenty of great options - - but we didn't have OP's geog limits or a particular concern about NJ residents.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
I was wrong in my fear that Lehigh U's almost all-white student body was conservative to the point of racist,

[/quote]
</p>

<p>I'm conservative (in the libertarian sort of way). [Actually I call myself a classical liberal, with social contract roots and humanitarian characteristics.] I also happen to be a Singapore-born ethnic Chinese from a low-income background whose favourite socioeconomic theorists include Indian Nobel Prize Winner Amartya Sen. What in the world is with the association with conservatism and racism.</p>

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<p>


<br>
The only thing that I can agree with is that our family highly values education. We are definitely NOT a family of privilege but my son did well in engineering. He didn't get one of those "fat paying" jobs after graduation. He decided to stay at Lehigh to work on his MS/PhD.</p>

<p>


No one forces you to join a frat/sorority. You can have a successful college experience without joining.</p>

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<p>"I'm conservative (in the libertarian sort of way). [Actually I call myself a classical liberal, with social contract roots and humanitarian characteristics.] I also happen to be a Singapore-born ethnic Chinese from a low-income background whose favourite socioeconomic theorists include Indian Nobel Prize Winner Amartya Sen. What in the world is with the association with conservatism and racism." - galoisien</p>

<p>Your post is off-topic but let me respond. Conservatism does NOT equal racism. Period. However, there is a perception, which may or may not be true, although there tends to be some validity in many perceptions, that in the United States most racists do identify with more conservative views on social issues and with the more conservative of the two major political parties. That, unfortunately, contributes to the perception that some people have that conservatives are racists. </p>

<p>Example: Skinheads, KKK, anti-semites, etc. tend not to vote for Democrats who are viewed by most Americans as the more socially liberal of the two major parties. In certain parts of this country among ordinary citizens who are not members of racist organizations conservative views on social issues (affirmative action, anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage) are dominant. In those geographic areas, white voters overwhelmingly went for the Republican in this last election. I'm talking primarily about southern states like Mississippi, Alabama, South Carolina, Tennessee, Kentucky, etc. In New England states, white voters overwhelmingly went for the Democrat who happens to be black. Those states include Vermont, New Hampshire, Maine, Massachusetts, etc. How do I know white voters overwhelmingly went for the black guy in those states? Because there almost no black people in those states (and I peeked at all the published exist surveys). </p>

<p>Fair or not, there is the perception or belief that whites who vote for blacks are not racist and at least lean liberal as opposed to conservative on social issues. </p>

<p>The question of fiscal conservatism is a different kettle of fish. Maybe you are fiscally conservative but socially liberal. If so, you're not alone. </p>

<p>Foolishpleasure: I agree totally. The total number of all minorities is much less important than the number of black students. I include black-white biracial students in that group.
And my D is seriously considering Dickinson despite their low enrollment. I didn't get the same vibe from Dickinson during our visit as I did with Lehigh (and there are no headlines) despite their paltry black enrollment. They keep contacting her (which is flattering). Now they are having students contact her by email. They are really trying to recruit black students who have good grades. </p>

<p>GOOD NEWS EVERYONE! My D received her first college acceptance in the mail on Saturday. It's Ursinus College an LAC (in PA) that sent her a "priority app" back in September. She has until May 1st to respond. We won't know about a financial aid package, if any, until March or afterwards.</p>

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<p>Congratulations on the acceptance. Isn't it wonderful to get that first one? Here's to many more!!</p>

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<p>Thank you, laxmom! Yes, it feels great to have the first decision a positive one. She should hear something positive from Penn State next, sometime between mid-December and mid-January.</p>

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<p>Congrats to your dd, Plainsman.</p>

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<p>i kicked lehigh off my college list b/c of the lack of diversity. and i specifically stated on my ED school's supplement essay that diversity is a HUGE thing for me. i've lived around different people all my life. i honestly wouldn't know what to do if u put me in a nondiverse environment.</p>

<p>plus lehigh is expensive. and it's not as elite as some of the others of the same price tag</p>

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<p>Congrats on Ursinus. As I said before, I am in Collegeville once a month or so and have spent a lot of time there over the years. I like it, but this is not going to be a diverse school or the right fit for your daughter. I can't imagine the same student being interested in Lehigh and Ursinus.</p>

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<p>MOWC: My D was born and raised in a 99% white environment. All of her friends are white. The only blacks she knows are me and her cousins on my side of the family, none of whom live within 700 miles of us. There are a few blacks in her public high school but not many. We don't live in Easton or Bethlehem or Allentown. She is the only black in her high school on the National Honor Society. There is one Hispanic on NHS. When my D looks at Ursinus and Lehigh, two schools she is completely unfamiliar with having grown up in the upper midwest, she sees that one is a university and the other a college, and both are mostly white. Lehigh a little more so. But that's all she sees, and it's all she knows. The surface stuff mostly, the different size campuses, and their respective catalogs and course offerings, but as an outsider they don't seem that much different to her in terms of culture.</p>

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<p>Plainsman - congrats to your daughter, Ursinus is a very nice school.</p>

<p>MOWC - I think it is normal for kids to look at all types of colleges. They really don't know how many different schools are out there - different in culture and programs. I bet the average college bound doesn't know the difference between a LAC and a University.
My daughter last year, applied to a bunch of different schools, from LA, to small u's to a flagship U. By visiting them she really got a feel of how different they were.</p>