Black Parents: Was I Wrong About Lehigh U?

Parents Forum
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<p>"It seems the redneck students of Lehigh couldn't stomach seeing Barack Obama win the presidency and decided to make life miserable for the handful of black students on campus".</p>

<p>I highly doubt these unfortunate incidents are representative of the student body at Lehigh, however with so many excellent schools to chose from I wonder what is it that this school has that cannot be found at other colleges. However if she has her heart set on this school, see if she can do an overnight visit. Maybe she can get a better feel for the climate.</p>

<p>Incidentally, since Trinity College was mentioned as a conservative school, I thought I would point out that according to my freshman, there was a great deal of celebrating on campus election night.</p>

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<p>Could someone please name a college where there AREN'T a couple of jerks somewhere?</p>

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<p>"And, to quote an earlier post, even if not overtly racist, I do not care to purchases such experiences for my D."</p>

<p>And how about if she loves the school, has friends, etc.? Does having a couple of jerks outweigh all of that? Are there no jerks at public universities or other LACs? </p>

<p>^^^^</p>

<p>In a word - - "yes." I think there are lots of schools where a student can be happy and thrive. If a parent is sufficiently troubled with the campus culture that is reason enough to move on. </p>

<p>When we began the college search, there were lots of schools that, on paper, looked like a good match. Upon further investigation, there were facators - - finances (schoold didn't meet 100% of need), geography, curriculum (didn't want a lot of geneds), athletics, low black enrollment, prominence of frats etc. - - that caused us to scratch a number schools. Most of these factors are common considerations in college selection. </p>

<p>I doubt there is a college w/o a few jerks, But they could be an issue depending upon what reports suggest about the actual jerk quotient, or if the jerks ejoy the support of their fellow students or if I feel the administration's response is too slow, lacks force or is otherwise inadequate. </p>

<p>Visiting a campus is certainly helpful in determining whether the school is a good fit. But written reports are often helpful in deciding whether to make the trip, or where to focus your attention if you do visit.</p>

<p>I just don't think that ANY of these schools is so unique that one has to keep it on the list if one is uncomfortable with even the one incident. But my list of criteria was apparently more flexible than OP's; I would have walked away from Lehigh w/o reviving this thread or asking other parents' opinions.</p>

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<p>jillyo, and everyone else, Bucknell too was mentioned as conservative. My D said there was celebration on election night there as well. Ironically, at least to me, she said a few students getting annoyed at the celebrating on her hall were McCain supporters (obviously) who happen to be "not in the closet", very open lesbians. </p>

<p>As of July '08, Bucknell has become the institutional home of the Toni Morrison Society and this weekend faculty, staff and student representatives from member institutions of the Consortium on High Achievement and Success (CHAS) will come together for the 8th annual Black and Latino Male Conference. It may or may not be a conservative school, but it is trying to foster diversity and inclusion.</p>

<p>By the way, as others have mentioned,the OP did not like Ithaca. Ironically again, it is one of the most liberal communities in the country. The OP does not like bigots or homeless (what he thinks he saw in Ithaca that another CCer said was probably just a grad student. HAha, I agree.) Does not sound very liberal.</p>

<p>Bigots exist. There are white bigots, black ones, christians and jews. And maybe bigots against poor. Some folk think Asians are taking over the "good" schools and that a man named Obama must be Muslim and we know Muslim's "are evil." Bigotry exists everywhere. Thank goodness the majority of folk, IMO, in the USA are not irrationally biased.</p>

<p>Lehigh is a world class institution. It is not a racist institution. Are some of the students bigots? Unfortunately, yes. Are they a majority? No.</p>

<p>OP--deal with the existing world, not the world of your college days.</p>

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<p>(I don't know if there's a pattern of such things happening there or not--post below is based on the assumption there is not)</p>

<p>So what guarantees something like this will not happen in whatever college you do select? What happens if your daughter is a sophomore and someone scrawls a slur on her door? Colleges, especially big ones, will have by sheer probability some amount of not terribly nice people. </p>

<p>I don't think Lehigh is terribly unique either--I just don't think a single case is worth downgrading it over <em>if</em> there is some reason to have interest in it in the first place. </p>

<p>Of course if you search the school newspaper and find this stuff happening month after month a visit probably isn't worth the time. But the reality is jerks will be present everywhere at some rate or another. Even in my highly liberal suburb there were a couple of cases where swastikas were sprayed on schools--what can I say? Stuff happens. If it happens regularly and is not dealt with, that's bad. If it's limited to rare incidents though, I don't really see what you expect the school to do--they can't control the actions of all their students 24/7.</p>

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<p>"Lehigh is a world class institution. It is not a racist institution. Are some of the students bigots? Unfortunately, yes. Are they a majority? No."</p>

<p>True enough - - but bigots don't have to be in the majority for me to decide I want something different/better for my child. Lehigh and, yes, Bucknell are more conservative than I'd like for my D and they have been the subject of a number of anecdotal evidence of intolerance or insensitivity on these boards and elsewhere. There's no gaurantee that there won't be incidents on other, more liberal campuses - - indeed, there have been such incidents on more liberal campuses. But, on those other campuses there are factors, which I have previously identified, which me more comfortable.</p>

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<p>Ironically, I think even at Bucknell and Lehigh Obama would have won the election. Students as a group are pretty liberal... not too many old boys club colleges left...</p>

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<p>True enough - - but that the majority of students support Obama, by itself, is not good enough for me.</p>

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<p>So what's good enough for you?</p>

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<p>If your daughter fits in, is happy there, and wants to go there, what's wrong with her going there? Really, most students at any institution do not have it out for her or anyone else. If she tries to make friends, she will probably succeed. </p>

<p>No offense, what do you expect to happen in the real world? Most people will not actively discriminate, but no one is going to go out of their way to actively try to make other people feel included.</p>

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<p>"It amazes me that two colleges in such close proximity have such diverse experiences. D2 is at Muhlenberg, perhaps 15 minutes from Lehigh. We were initially concerned that it might be too conservative for our daughter, but this election has allowed the true colors (no pun intended) of the students to shine through. Obama's camp in particular had a strong ground game at Muhlenberg. Muhlenberg hosted Clinton, Obama, and Biden this campaign cycle, and according to D2's reports after the election was called, there was immense excitement on campus that night. While it does not have as diverse student body as my D might have preferred, the students who are there are very open-minded, and I know they would love to have more minorities represented there." - TEriwtt</p>

<p>Teriwtt: We live about 20 minutes from Muhlenberg, but haven't really thought about the school or even visited. My D is considering adding Muhlenberg to the list. I'm pretty sure she'd get in. For some reason, she's expressed zero interest in even visiting. </p>

<p>By the way, before my D was born, my wife, D1 and I lived in your neck of the woods, Chicagoland. Naperville, to be specific.</p>

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<p>"Pizzagirl - just the point MOWC was making. I hope for her own sanity - she doesn't bring an "intended" home to meet dad until she has already tied the knot! " --JustaMomf4</p>

<p>JustaMomof4: There is a silver cloud in that lining. It means I didn't shell out thousands of dollars for the wedding. I like that.</p>

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<p>"Ironically, I think even at Bucknell and Lehigh Obama would have won the election. Students as a group are pretty liberal... not too many old boys club colleges left..."
--Piterbizon</p>

<p>Piterbizon: You haven't been listening. As I said, Lehigh is NOT a typical college with a predominately liberal and female student body. The school is 55% male (and 95% of the men are white), which makes it very different right off the bat--overwhelmingly white, male, conservative and Republican. McCain and Palin received two invitations and they held big rallies for them on campus. Obama got zero. Lehigh might be the only school in the northeast other than West Point that Obama would not have won.</p>

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<p>Lehigh</a> University - UR News Story: 2908</p>

<p>"Chris Addy ’10, president of the College Democrats, says he already has more than 400 students on his mailing list, with 50 who attend the weekly meetings.</p>

<p>“There are a good amount of committed people and I am very proud of that,” Addy says. “It’s an election year with a magnetic candidate and it’s exciting to be a part of it.”</p>

<p>Addy’s counterpart, Chris Huether ’09, president of the College Republicans , is also seeing an influx of students interested in being a part of the campaign.</p>

<p>There are about 160 students on his mailing list, he says, and about 40 that attend the meetings regularly."</p>

<p>EDIT:</p>

<p>Amusingly, Free Republic despises Lehigh for how liberal it is-- Lehigh</a> Univesity and the "Art" of Bush Bashing</p>

<p>"In a shocking display of partisanship on a campus already known for its left-wing bias, Lehigh University has placed an exhibit of 5 full-sized wall photographs depicting President Bush and his cabinet in compromising situations in the home of its History and Political Science departments. One of the photos depicts President Bush in a drunken stupor fondling a woman's breasts, while another depicts a group of whores, one of whom represents Dr. Condoleezza Rice, surrounding a table displaying numerous elephants, the Republican Party symbol."</p>

<p>“These photos are a sinister attempt to shape the political thoughts of students and make conservatives feel uncomfortable on campus. The fact that numerous galleries exist here and yet they were placed in this particular building is clearly intentional,” said College Republicans Vice President Mary Yoder. </p>

<p>College Republicans President Neal Hoffman commented on the photos saying, “We want it to be known that we are not against Mr. Fink’s freedom of speech, but if Lehigh, as a private institution, is going to maintain an assumption of political nonpartisanship, then these pictures clearly are in violation of that. Not only are they tasteless and falsely based, but they send a message to women, especially conservative women, who want to enter politics, telling them they are nothing more than sex symbols. By hosting these pictures, Lehigh has not only attacked conservative students and women, but they have given it their personal stamp of approval.”</p>

<p>Thus, Lehigh is comparitively conservative because it has some Republicans, whereas most colleges have so few it may as well be none. I still doubt McCain would have actually won it.</p>

<p>Actually, bluntly put, that you complain it's too conservative while the Republicans complain it's too liberal makes it seem better to me...</p>

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<p>whether or not Lehigh has a student body that is more rigid or restrictive in their thinking- to me is besides the point- although I haven't read the whole thread.
But by reading the title of the thread- which is addressed to not, * freshman* parents, or 1st gen parents- but to parents of one particular race- asking them if the school is exclusionary towards others of that race.</p>

<p>Perhaps I am overly sensitive in this area, but why wouldn't you ask this of any parent who is familar with the school? are they not able to discern bias directed toward or against others?</p>

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<p>While I'm not the OP, as a black parent, I have always found it extremely helpful to connect with other black people about questions involving possible racism.</p>

<p>Even very open minded whites may not be aware of situations that a black person would be aware of. For instance, a black person will attract attention from people prejudiced against blacks that a white person will not. </p>

<p>I think the OP also is trying to figure out whether to allow their child to apply to Lehigh given the parents' concerns about racism there, more reason for the OP to want insights from black parents. While well meaning, white parents aren't going to be as personally cognizant of the potential ramifications of the OP's decisions.</p>

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<p>I know plenty of white kids that disliked Lehigh, transfered or endured. For them it was an air of snobbery, though coming from a hodge podge of racially diverse high school, to them it wasn't the real world. </p>

<p>Another reason for a kid to visit, there is an ultimate "vibe" that is there and those "vibes" don't show in a brochure.</p>

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<p>I'm reading these posts and it almost sounds like two different languages are being spoken. </p>

<p>Look, we are all very blessed to live in a country where there's such an abundance of choices, right? Undoubtedly, we can agree on that. We can also agree that given the number of choices, it's natural to gravitate towards schools that best reflect our specific interests, proclivities, and paradigms. In fact, if we didn't, some would never be able to come to a final decision. So, I actually don't think anyone here is really suggesting otherwise. </p>

<p>The issue as I see it is that there's a big difference between filtering for factors such as academics, geography, finances, programs, traditions, etc., etc., versus selecting principally by preconcieved notions that certain schools, as a brand, can be classified and accurately defined by categories of individual human behavior. </p>

<p>That's not to say different institutions don't reflect divergent cultures from one another. But individual human behavior is almost always a wildcard. Additionally every four years the student body at these schools completely turns over, and because we are talking about human beings, virtually every school contains subsets of the full spectrum of human interaction. That's why anecdotes often mean very little. It's also why we sometimes see students who thought they were going to a "very friendly" school become disillusioned by a different reality upon arrival. It's why we have to be careful about how much we buy into labels such as "liberal," "conservative," "southern," and so forth, as sufficient definitions of the social experiences a school provides. And it's why we inevitably offend when we carelessly malign a school's reputation by holding up its worst social culprits as representatives of the entire institution. </p>

<p>Colleges aren't as static as some of us like to think. Sometimes schools do live up to their reputations, but many of us have encountered campuses that utterly fail to reflect some aspect of what they're known for, whether for good or bad. At best, we can attain a snapshot perpective of a given point in time. Though some are accurate, the broad assumptions we make about various schools are often meaningless when measured against reality. And of course, there is that little wrinkle that someone else's reality may not necessarily be our particular reality. </p>

<p>This is why I think it's important for the student to have as much latitude as possible in the decision-making process. Sure, lay out the facts, discuss all perspectives, but once everything is on the table, let them take the lead. The people they meet on campus will be individuals from all walks of life, not some monolithic, brainwashed cult lying in wait to devour your young (well, there might be a few of those, but very many). Chances are, the vast majority will be great kids no matter what their background or politics. Nothing to fear but fear itself.</p>

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<p>*ven very open minded whites may not be aware of situations that a black person would be aware of. For instance, a black person will attract attention from people prejudiced against blacks that a white person will not.
*</p>

<p>I understand that- I was just questioning- why only solicit opinions from one group?
That sounds a bit ...</p>

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<p>"The issue as I see it is that there's a big difference between filtering for factors such as academics, geography, finances, programs, traditions, etc., etc., versus selecting principally by preconcieved notions that certain schools, as a brand, can be classified and accurately defined by categories of individual human behavior. "</p>

<p>I don't think anyone has suggestig that college selection be based "principally" on the notion of certain schools as a brand. For me black enrollment, history of liberalism and accounts from black parents/students regarding the racial climate important factors, but not the only factors. </p>

<p>Also, many schools do stand as a brand - - Williams is a D3 powerhouse and tends to attract more than its share of athletes and more of a jock school than other small LACs; Swatty is liberal, but less so than Wesleyan, Wes students also tend to be more quirky; the women at Smith are in-your-face about EVERYTHING - - and proud of it; southern women's colleges, like Sweet Briar and Hollis dubbed "Smith of the South") are a world apart; Bennett and Spelman, as black women's colleges are yet another brand. Lehigh and Bucknell are more conservative, losts of frats and have lower black enrollment; solid academics, but not the social environment I want for D. And with all the choices available, I don't need to settle on those factors that are important to me.</p>

<hr>

<p>"[A]necdotes often mean very little. It's also why we sometimes see students who thought they were going to a "very friendly" school become disillusioned by a different reality upon arrival."</p>

<p>Yes, but I find this is also true about visiting the campus - - it's just a snapshot, best used to rule-out schools. A good visit, or rapport w/ the guide doesn't mean you'll be comfortable for four years, but a bad visit should sound an alarm. And though an imperfect measure, visits, institutional history, branding and anecdotes are the toos available to inform our selection.</p>

<hr>

<p>"Nothing to fear but fear itself."</p>

<p>Perhaps OP is fearful; I'm not. That I want a certain racial composition is no different than applicant families that consider a schools in/out-of-state enrollment or the gender mix or any number of social factors. They want their kids to be comfortable and happy; why would I want less for my D?</p>