<p>IMHO,
1. The first semester is a little different. If I remember correctly, the first few days were overwhelming, even though we were preregistered and my kids aren't. It's like getting married to someone you don't know at the same time you take a new job you don't understand, but will begin to be reviewed in 2 weeks in a new location that you may have visited only once.Any help (not always wanted :)) the kids can get from advisors, RA's and parents is a good thing during this period. Students should be much more independent after that critical period, especially by the end of the first year. There should be a transition period in de-involvement, the length of which depends on the kid.
2. Who is the University's customer? Probably the student, but as others have
pointed out here the obscene costs give the parents the right (if not the wisdom) to be involved. It may be a bad idea for the parent to be involved, but it is his/her call.
3. As far as learning to work through problems with the institution on their own, I agree with the desirability of this with one caveat: some elements in the institution will use age and status to intimidate the student. If it's a truly critical situation, why shouldn't the parent get involved? Again, as the university experience progresses the student should become less vulnerable to these situations.
4. Finally, my wife and I expected to take our freshman twins to colleges this fall, move them in, have dinner (maybe), and quickly bail out. Nope. Both institutions expect the parents to stay an extra day for parent orientation. Much of the orientation is 'letting go'. :)</p>
<p>SRmom-
While I understand your point, and I am quite familiar with class scheduling challenges, I still do not agree that an incoming freshman (or upperclassman) should be expected to forego the opportunity to travel in order to deal with registration in the middle of the summer. To me, travelling is an educational opportunity in and of itself. It is quite possible that this kid was available by cellphone, so the issues that you described (eg suggestions for different sections, different professors, etc) could have been done by the student talking to his advisor on his mom's cellphone. In this day and age, I think we should be more open-minded about ways of handling things. I registered for my freshman classes via mail, and then stood in line for registration for my classes the remaining years of my undergrad career. That was 30 yrs ago. I think we can do things a little differently these days.</p>
<p>my son has attended fabulous academic summer programs for many years. He has basically spent every summer away from home for 5 years. I don't think he would want to cancel a big swath of it or take a week off in the middle of July to be in San Louis Obisbo either. I would support him if he wanted to delegate registration to someone else, and it would in no way imply a lack of independance. Perhaps it would imply that the summer programs were more important to him than being on the spot for registration decisions, but that is not the point that the article was trying to illustrate with this story. (and besides, the mom probably had cell phone contact with the kid).</p>
<p>I don't get this registration in middle of summer
My niece who is attending Bloomington had to fly out in the middle of summer to register.
I think that that would be quite a pain and expense, why don't they just start orientation/registration a day or two earlier in fall rather than requiring an extra trip?</p>
<p>texas and emeraldkty-
EXACTLY!! Couldn't agree more with both statements! It would be more logical to do registration when everyone is back on campus. Also, why has it become in vogue to be so critical of parents? Not every parent is overinvolved, and not every situation where a parent is involved is negative. What happened to common courtesy and customer service (as texas137 and others have mentioned)? I am so tired of the negative spin so many things get these days. But then again, thats what sells newspapers.</p>
<p>For whatever reason the date is the date. He may have had choices he may not have. But college is now his job. If you were starting a new job in September and your boss told you, when you were hired, that part of the job involved a summer seminar, conference whatever, would you say sorry I can't go can I send someone else to go for me? As an instructor that is how I read this response. Again there is nothing in the OP that S was involved in any kind of summer program, merely that he was traveling. He might be in Europe studying art, he might be in the south pacific studying the impact of global warming on sea urchins but he also might be in Hawaii studying bikinis. I regularly have students use the excues of vacation plans to justify why they miss the first week of class, the classes before and after spring break, Thanksgiving etc. I realize that this is not the same thing but it is still part of his responsibility, not his mom's. </p>
<p>I don't know where the assumption that he was at Cal Poly came from,. though I accepted it as well, but I just checked their site and the data doesn't match the inof here. There system though would likely create the same situations except since it is on-line the mom would have had no problem. Their students register Aug 8 or 9 depending on their last name. Looks like registration times are quite an issue, reading between the lines.</p>
<p>Clearly there isn't enough actual info to make a real statement about this student's situation. Many of you assume he is doing something worthwhile with his travel while I assume it is a pure vacation. My bottom line though is student's who haven't bought into their classes, which starts with the selection process, more often have problems make a true commitment to them later on as well.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I don't know where the assumption that he was at Cal Poly came from,
[/quote]
It's right there in the article:</p>
<p>"Administrators prefer that students pick their own majors and courses. At California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo, Calif., last week, a mother showed up -- without her son -- to register him for classes and meet with his academic adviser, says Andrene Kaiwi-Lenting, the university's orientation director. She intercepted the mother and urged her to leave and let her son come alone later; "there's going to be a time when he needs to do this on his own," she says she told the mother. But the woman said her son was traveling and refused to be dissuaded."</p>
<p>
[quote]
Many of you assume he is doing something worthwhile with his travel while I assume it is a pure vacation.
[/quote]
And yes, some of us are preferring to see the glass as half full, while you seem to feel that it is half empty. I hope your CC students have a true thirst for learning, and I hope, as their professor, you convey a positive, not cynical attitude to them about life in general. I work with students too, but I try to be reasonable, flexible and understanding. I don't assume they are trying to get away with something. The ones that are will show their colors quickly. Maybe CC students are different than 4 yr students. I'd hate to blindly make that assumption. But that is what you seem to be implying here. For all we know, this kid could have made his travel committments way before the registration info came out, and he is trying to be responsible to both. That is how I am looking at it. And its a nice view from here.</p>
<p>I agree that students need to register for their classes, and that an advisor who actually is helpful is necessary for many students especially freshman year.
Still- why require students to leave their summer jobs- family trips, etc to fly back to to the university that they will be moving into in a month or so, rent a car, get a hotel room, when it is very likely that they will have to take time out from their summer job that they need for tuition, to do so?
This is very different than taking time for a work related conference.
If it was required for their job, they would get paid for it!
For us this has been a moot point, Freshman year classes are quite limited after required classes are taken care of, and the only thing I have ever said to D regarding her choices( K-12) was that I would lean towards French instead of Spanish. HOwever, she took 5 years of Spanish so that shows you how much influence I have, I guess.</p>
<p>I think her school also has registration online , in any case she didn't have to go there till move in week.</p>
<p>I also have a problem with schools that dont make their schedules available until other plans have been made.
My 15 yr old needed to take a summer class but although I kept asking when the schedule would be available, I didn't find out until a few weeks before school got out.
THis was too late for us, as we had to make our other summer plans by the end of April, once I found out about the schools plans I tried to change them but that wasn't possible.
Many people do make summer plans mid winter. Even the local summer camps in our area want you to start signing up in January! We have very few summer plans, but the ones we have, I don't like to have to change becuase it is such a PITA to get everyones schedules coordinated in the first place.
Just make em all online. then they can do it even if they are out of town.</p>
<p>My S is at a summer program that goes on for another week. It attracts students from all over the country; it is expensive and it is also extremely educational. Students are not allowed to go offsite for any length of time, let alone fly off for several days.
There are kids who travel abroad for a variety of reasons: family reunions, educational programs. Who's to say what is legitimate travel and what is not? This is summer, not the middle or even beginning of school! There are kids who must work to fund their college education (yeah, right, tell the boss you will take several days off when you've only been on the job for a couple of weeks or so. And especially, tell the boss when you are applying for the job and see if he'll hire you).
I really don't see the point of holding orientation in the middle of summer and then complaining when students don't show up and send their parents instead. To me, it's not a sign of being either irresponsible or overly dependent. It's a sign of a family making the best of a situation caused by a poorly run school.</p>
<p>Kids make plans as do the schools. If summer registration is the norm it's typically something that has been going on for years. I know that was the case when I registered in the stone age for my large state U. It seems to be the norm for large schools. I know it has been true for my D's friends going to these schools. Often there are several dates available for the student to choose from, but sometimes not. My point, is whatever the situation was I don't think it should have come as a big surprise. It was easy enough for me to look at what the freshman orientation procedures were for D's schools when she was applying just to anticipate if it was going to be an issue that needed to be addressed in planning the summer. Yes flying in from out of state is a cost, often schools have a final registration period right before classes for those that couldn't get there earlier, but the consequence is that there are fewer classes available. </p>
<p>Work you get paid, school you pay. I don't see that as part of the equation. We tell our students and our children that school is their job, part of that job is the registration process. Some jobs/schools are accomodating some aren't. I am not saying I think this colleges procedures are ideal but they are not unusual nor should they have been unexpected. Given that it is part of the students job to register for classes, not his mom's. That is the fundamental issue.</p>
<p>Honestly I really think that the examples in that article were exceptions to the rules. When I was at my orientation a few weeks ago, there we no parents around. While we were looking to pick classes (the way it works at the UCLA orientation is everybody goes to either a computer lab, or more likely a large room with all the classes listed on the wall), I did not see anybody taking out their phones to call for help. When we needed help (which did happen many times) we help each other out. The only difference I can think of is the fact that we were all a bit older because we are transfer students. Most of us had at least two years (even if it's just a community college) behind us already, and we knew (somewhat) how the system worked and what we needed. </p>
<p>All that said however I find it interesting that there are kids out there who get into good schools, who can't manage their own affairs. As soon as I hit 18 I took responsibility for as many of my own things as I could. I'm very close with my parents, but once you're 18 you need to take some responsibility for yourself...</p>
<p>They cannot register for classes online? I thought a lot of schools did that now (mine does), but maybe all do not.</p>
<p>Note: Still do not know what is wrong with other screen name.</p>
<p>New students at my college can't register on-line, and they only take MasterCard and Visa for returning students. If you're paying by check or American Express, for example, you need to go in person.</p>
<p>I know at my old college we were still doing it on paper and students just gave the registrar their schedule on paper and she entered it into the computer and everyone received a printed copy of their schedule before the semester started. LOL.</p>
<p>but I do what I have to do. When my D was a hs junior it was obvious she had no interest in college and no intention of looking into it. She was sick of school, obsessed with her boyfriend, having fun with her job, and nothing about another 4 years of schooling sounded good to her! But this is my D I'm talking about and I know how she works! I went online and applied her to several of our state schools (I knew what we could afford and where her grades could get her so there was no choice in the matter).</p>
<p>Senior year, with the job gone and the bf a distant memory, she received 3 letters of acceptance and she was intrigued. Most seniors were in full 'college mode' and suddeny living at home and going to the local JC wasn't sounding too good to her. We took her to look at two of the campuses but she was unimpressed and still slightly unmotivated. During spring break she went with a friend (no parents) to spend a few days visiting the 3rd and final school she had been accepted to.....BINGO! Not only did she fall in love with the campus and the town, she made many friends and arranged to move into an apartment near campus with some of them rather than go the dorm route. She made many weekend visits over the year and actually moved out of our house and into "her new home" 4 days after hs graduation, making her the first in her class to leave the nest. We did go up for summer orientation but she alone met with her major adviser, registered for classes and bought her books (ok, I emailed her a reminder to do that). She is living independently and growing more mature by the day. I'm confident I won't be involved in anything that happens from this point on unless she asks for my help.</p>
<p>
[quote]
My point, is whatever the situation was I don't think it should have come as a big surprise.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>And that is precisely why the parent is there, while the student is traveling (let's not second guess why he is).</p>
<p>Who cares what that kid and that mom did? It was obviously what they chose. Didn't they have that right to make that choice for any reasons they thought valid? Obviously didn't bother the kid. Why should it bother any of us? Goodness. If everybody is so interested in not running their own kid's life, than why on earth are some trying to pass judgment about what another parent and another kid are doing? Isn't that trying to "run" their lives by what you think is proper? </p>
<p>IMO it's certainly more appropriate for a parent to attempt to help a child (or even to exercize parental influence over their child) in a given situation than it is to comment on a specific parent's choice under circumstances we are not privvy to. I don't know what they were thinking about registration but I'm pretty sure I know what they'd think about this discussion. "I don't know you so leave us the &^%$ alone" would be pretty close.</p>
<p>It's perfectly fine to state what you would do given a particular set of circumstances. Not so great to pontificate on right and wrong like someone died and made you the ruler of all things properly parental. JMO.</p>
<p>Can I PM one of the parents?</p>
<p>Way to go 'mudge. Well said. And all I was going to add on that subject is that I doubted this kid was "off in Hawaii studying bikinis". After all, he's going to college on the coast of California. He'll have plenty of opportunity to research bikinis there.</p>
<p>Cur:</p>
<p>Totally agree with you!
My feeling is that any college that schedules orientation in the middle of summer has got to accept that students will come up with ways to cope. That has nothing to do with parental overinvolvement.
It seems to me the author was trying to find examples of parental overinvolvement and latched on to this one. It is a a great example of a college creating maximum inconvenience for everyone rather than of parental overinvolvement.</p>