Coming Out in High School

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I read it. At first I was like "oh my gosh, is this sloc guy completely insane?". From your two options, what came to my mind was "ew sick". Why the heck did you post that? You are so nasty! Sloc!! You know why you think spongebob is gay? CUZ YOU R FREAKY DEAKY. Nothin' else!</p>

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Oh, for those of you that are wondering which forum i got it from: An IB Student Forum</p>

<p>IB student forum? There are actual active IB forums? Besides ibscrewed? Wow, what's the URL?

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<p>LOL!!!! Oh, no: not a FULL HARDCORE IB forum, i think it was a sub-forum or stuff like that....Hold on; lemme find the real link.</p>

<p>EDIT: anyways man; that was nasty</p>

<p>Holy crap! it was IB Screwed!!!! <em>Shocked!</em> :)</p>

<p><a href="http://www.ibscrewed.net/forum/index.php%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.ibscrewed.net/forum/index.php&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>I'm sure you can find the story (if that's what you're looking for), but Its probably been deleted since this was SOOOOO long ago. :)</p>

<p>Aww... The IB internet community is so small! :(</p>

<p>Why did you save a gay romance from a long time ago? o_O</p>

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Why did you save a gay romance from a long time ago? o_O

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<p>Because I thought i would need to post this somewhere else...ya know? For the laughs : )</p>

<p>donkeyz12212: There's no right answer as to when you come out to people. I'm a little surprised that you came out to your parents first, because in my experience that's been the hardest step for people I know who've come out (the dad thing, specifically, but still parents in general). However, if you have enough confidence to tell your parents, it's a good sign. I'm still not completely out myself, so I'm definitely not an expert on the topic, but I'd advise coming out to a few close friends who you feel you can trust and who you feel will be, if not completely comfortable with it at first (you can't really expect that of anyone, at the time being, it's too unrealistic), at least supportive of you. If that goes well, you might find that it's a lot easier to come out in general. And if it doesn't go well... well, you're going away to college soon, so you can leave those suckas behind forever if they don't react well.</p>

<p>I'm gay and going into my senior year, and I'm not completely out. I started by telling a few close friends, and got such a warm response that I decided to take a leap of faith and, if not start screaming it from the rooftops, at least feel comfortable enough to date guys quietly and let word get out. I'd still be surprised if a third of the people I'm friends/acquaintances with know, but my closer friends, the ones who I want to be completely honest with, know. I know there are rumors about me outside of my friend circle, but the good thing about hanging out with the theatre crowd is that there are gay rumors about EVERYONE, so people I might not necessarily want to know about me (because I'm either not comfortable with it or just don't want them to know my business) tend to assume that they're just rumors.</p>

<p>Hope this helps, a bit.</p>

<p>That helps greatly Creme.</p>

<p>I was rather surprised myself to come out to my parents first but I am a good boy and hate lying to my parents all these years.</p>

<p>thesloc....I'm speechless at your lack of maturity. YOu've fianlly proved you are a childish twit. </p>

<p>elisamariah, </p>

<p>I think of myself as agnostic or weak atheist, and therefore, religion plays no part in my life. To me, morality is a code of conduct accepted by an individual for their own behavior. It is simply respect for individuals and rational values based on reason, and human compassion and dignity. Faith is the negation of reason. </p>

<p>My reasoning against religion as a frame for morality wasn't because religous texts are old, as you so quickly assumed. Religion should not dictate morality because of the freedom we are given in this country; not only freedom of religion, but freedom from religion as well. </p>

<p>I have no problem respecting other people's beliefs; it is only when they try to dictate personal choices based on their religious views that bothers me. </p>

<p>I hope we can agree to disagree.</p>

<p>I told you guys that this would turn into a 15pg thread!</p>

<p>"To me, morality is a code of conduct accepted by an individual for their own behavior. It is simply respect for individuals and rational values based on reason, and human compassion and dignity."</p>

<p>What if organized religions express the exact codes of conduct? I am sure that you are against murder, and theft, and deceit. Those are actual commandments in the Bible. </p>

<p>Do you have any right to feel badly towards Christianity or other forms of organized religion, when you share some of the same beliefs? In your anger over the alleged imposing of religious beliefs on the non-religious, you certainly made yourself seem as if those religious beliefs were also themselves disagreeable to you. This would look like hypocrisy. </p>

<p>"Religion should not dictate morality because of the freedom we are given in this country"</p>

<p>Many parts of Christianity share the same moral beliefs and propose the same rules of conduct that our American government-- a government supposedly BUILT and CREATED as free from the Church-- follows. This is because it is undoubtable that the founding fathers-- the vast majority of them-- were either Christians or believed in a higher power, a God-being, and that it affected their conduct and their rule-making. </p>

<p>Religion already has been an intergral part of the moral shaping of our country as we know it.</p>

<p>"not only freedom of religion, but freedom from religion as well."</p>

<p>And, of course, there would be freedom to have faith in and believe in a higher power, and read and base morality on thousand year old religious texts without it being derided as outdated and non-progressive. </p>

<p>You don't like people getting in your face about religion and saying homosexuality is a sin, right, helix? </p>

<p>Well, it certainly was not appreciated either when you wrote "damn Bible."</p>

<p>elisamariah, </p>

<p>"Do you have any right to feel badly towards Christianity or other forms of organized religion, when you share some of the same beliefs?" </p>

<p>I am not against murder, theft, and deceit because the bible says so. I think they are wrong because they go against what I believe. My morals were founded on my own principles and what I believe is our common humanity. I was never raised with religion, yet I still come to the conclusion that murder is wrong, through no credit to the bible or any other religious code. Believers feel things are wrong because the bible and God says so. They feel homosexuality is a sin becuase that is what is written; I do not share these same beliefs, and if I did, it would be through my own reasoning, not because of organized religion. </p>

<p>Because the founding fathers were religious isn't a strong argument for why our country should have a religious foundation today. The founding fathers didn't deal with homosexuality, divorce, or the prospect of human cloning, just a few of the modern concerns of today's world. Their way of living was different, as were the societal problems they had to deal with. We've evolved much since then, yet the concept of separation of church and state seems to have escaped us.</p>

<p>For the moment, at least. It was born a Christian nation and continues to this day. You may not agree with it, nor with its influence on our nation's law, but that is the way it is.</p>

<p>"Believers feel things are wrong because the bible and God says so."</p>

<p>As opposed to you, you mean? You're seeming to imply that you personally can develop your own moral codes based on non-religiously-connected compassion and reason, but that Christians ONLY feel a certain way about morality because they have been told so. Are you so sure about that? </p>

<p>You're treating Christians like automatons. You don't think that most of them, like most of any other religion, have working minds and hearts that can recognize morally correct behavior on their own? </p>

<p>Many Christians are like you in that they have reasoned and understood why stealing, murder and lying etc are wrong. They just happen to also feel connected to a certain faith because the same teachings and beliefs are preached and shared.</p>

<p>Don't generalize Christians and don't dare suggest that all of them are mindless and only follow and agree with moral behavior because you believe it's been drilled into them from the Bible. </p>

<p>Because if you say that, you're implying that more than a billion people in the world do not have their own conscience and their own sense of moral justice, like you say you do. It's never safe to generalize, let alone with over a billion people.</p>

<p>"Because the founding fathers were religious isn't a strong argument for why our country should have a religious foundation today"</p>

<p>Having a religious foundation is INEVITABLE, because the foundation-- the base of the law-- has ALREADY been set, centuries ago. That's why it's the "foundation" and base, after all. It is difficult and takes time to actually attempt to change the (Christian) foundation of the moral code of the country. </p>

<p>One could argue that attempting to change the foundation would only make the building upon its base begin to errode. </p>

<p>It is so hard to imagine an America without any religious ties. The coins say it "In God We Trust." Many senators and representative publically pray and attend church. Even John Kerry called himself a Catholic and attempted to participate in a Eucharistic ceremony. Even Bill Clinton, many a liberals' favorite, prayed and used the name of God favorably in public. </p>

<p>It might drastically change, but at the moment, America, as a whole-- Democratic or Republican-- IS a religious nation with a very religious foundation. Even when the founding fathers insisted that church and state be separated, many Americans did and still do consider Christianity the utmost authority. Only very recently have Christian-based laws been challenged and put down (like prayer in schools). </p>

<p>"The founding fathers didn't deal with homosexuality, divorce, or the prospect of human cloning, just a few of the modern concerns of today's world."</p>

<p>Human cloning is excusable in this argument because that technology wasn't avaliable during that time. But homosexuality? Divorce? Homosexuality and divorce weren't dealt with because they weren't concerning-- Christian belief and law, which the first Europeans in America adhered to, were against both so much that considering something like the legalization of homosexuality was unthinkable. It wasn't until our soceital "evolution", as you call it, in more recent decades, that these issues have become so problematic. </p>

<p>"We've evolved much since then, yet the concept of separation of church and state seems to have escaped us."</p>

<p>Well, I guess you'll just have to consider yourself an enlightened, agnostic individual and let the majority of Americans-- Christians-- follow their right to freedom of religion all the way to the polls and vote the way they want to, even though some don't like it. </p>

<p>You may think it's wrong for Americans to so closely connect a nation's laws with it's dominant religious beliefs, but for the moment that's the way it is.</p>

<p><a href="http://www.godhatesfags.com/main/%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.godhatesfags.com/main/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>^Some people who dislike gay people JUST a little bit (for anyone who's interested)</p>

<p>They staged a protest outside my school on graduation day because we were a "fag infested whore house".</p>

<p>stretch: that's the stupidest website i have ever clicked on...</p>

<p>man, edit that post or i'm gonna vomit.</p>

<p>Glad I could be of service, donkeyz.</p>

<p>But I have to say, it kind of creeps me out how every thread that addresses any kind of gay issue whatsoever has to be hijacked by people with their own agendas, both in favor of and against religion, or gay marriage, or whatever. Come on, guys. The OP asked for some simple advice (or simply asked for advice, I should say, because it's not a simple topic), and you turned it into a big political/moral debate that had very little to do with what his intent was. Just another one of the reasons why I hate homosexuality being such a hot-button issue: gays lose their individuality in favor of discussions of the whole, which really isn't fair to donkeyz12212, who I'm sure didn't intend to have this personal matter lead to a discussion of the morality of following religiously-based codes of conduct. If you must discuss this topic, a) go to the cafe forum, where you can discuss your matter (which is clearly not a high school-related issue, in the terms you are discussing, and b) make your own posts instead of taking over a barely related one.</p>

<p>its too late to prevent this thread from being taken over.</p>

<p>honestly sorry, donkeyz12212</p>

<p>Helix- you have your own religion. that God does not exist. this is not based on reason. please do not denigrate our faith. when i want to know HOW the world physically works, yes i will turn to logic and science. but when i want to know WHY the world is the way it is, why humans are here, the meaning of life, and why the world is so arguably perfect, i will turn to my religion. you may think you are intellectually superior for being an atheist, and you're entitled to your beliefs, but please do not offend most of the people you talk to. and please capitalize Bible.</p>

<p>i know i just sounded like a raving evangelist, but believe it or not, i voted for Kerry.</p>

<p>Well, I am certainly not surprised that this thread has turned into another raving political debate, and I too am sorry that it has... I would love to join in and criticize all the ignorance going on, but that would take up too much time haha, and to very little effect I'm afraid.</p>

<p>However, to the OP:
As I'm sure you've noticed, this is a very sensitive topic for many people, many of whom take a very irrational and unconcerned approach (::cough:: the religious right). Its great that you told your parents - hopefully they are being very supportive. IMHO, you should also tell your close friends if you feel comfortable doing so. Its never easy to have such secrets from good friends, and can be more of a burden than anything.</p>

<p>this thread is really long, so i didn't read the whole thing, so i don't know if anyone has already mentioned this, but just to let you guys know, scientists discovered the gay gene in fruitflies. they're not sure if it's the same in humans, but in the likelyness that it is, i guess being gay isn't really a choice, is it?</p>

<p>there is no "gay" gene. sexuality is determined the same way left/right-handedness is, though, with the wiring of the brain early in development. no the tendencies are not by choice (which we've pretty much come to an agreement upon), but acting on those tendencies IS choice (just as acting on heterosexual impulses is).</p>

<p>elisamariah,</p>

<p>frankly, i'm tired of arguing a moot point with you, so this'll be my last post regarding the subject. You keep insisting that just because most Americans hold Christian values, I should also adopt these values and whatever moral code they impose. This will never be the case for me. As for your statement that religious vaues are still strong in America, this is not the case. The religious foundation you have been referring to is slowly eroding, and a desperate few are trying to force them back into our government and modern beliefs.</p>

<p>Furthermore, I never claimed I was intellectually or in any other way superior to Christians or religious people. You seem to think that because I am not religious, I am not capable of being a moral person either, and that I look down on those who are religious. This is not the case, but believe what you will. You can quote me again and acusse of more things, but there's really no point in prolonging this argument. </p>

<p>I did give honest advice to the OP regarding the situation, and remained very much on topic, but the thoughtless remarks of a few like thesloc irritated me, and we ended up with a raging war. It seems religion has made its way into the most personal aspects of our lives, and for that I am sorry.</p>

<p>the religious are being given a bad rep from raving ultraconservative evangelists.</p>