Depression, Alcohol, Drugs, Failing, HELP!!!!!

Parent Cafe
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<p>ScaredDad - I’m in the “cut the guy some slack” camp. You are doing some hard things, including 7 day/week AA. Heck when I was pregnant I remember telling DH it wouldn’t be as bad if I could at least have “Sundays off”…no chance of that! The burden of it being continuous made it ever so much harder.</p>

<p>There’s a lot to be said for Tough Love approaches if the teen is strong enough. But even though your daughter is brazenly driving ya nuts, she still could be quite fragile inside. Hopefully you have a neutral party to help guide you. </p>

<p>Unless a parent has an only child, there will always be one child who is that hardest… and it will likely vary over the years. I’m sorry your hard one is so very hard right now, but we do know you still love her. And she still loves you too, even though it may be a while before she can express it. Good luck!</p>

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<p>My only addition to the comments is to ensure a full medical work-up. Schizophrenia also emerges around this age. I have seen it happen. Rule that out before anything else. Treatment for this disease will take precedent.</p>

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<p>I find it quixotic that some are advocating " tough love" for the daughter, yet will admonish parents who are * too tough* on * scared dad.*</p>

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<p>I think that it’s pretty early in the game to know what kind of approach this kid needs. Lots of times the most fragile of kids put on the “badass” exterior to fight back the things that they fear. And it takes a lot of patience to get them to let that tough exterior break down so that they can expose their problem. We were about 4 months into intensive therapy before we started learning what had really happened TO our daughter, and another year of therapy before we unraveled all the underlying problems with general anxiety and ADHD before we found the right medications and started to see our KID come back. But she IS back now. There were lots of points along the way I wanted to punt her out the door. It gets so tempting. Envisioning her on the streets dead kept us trying. Faith kept us trying. Love kept us trying.</p>

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<p>One day at a time is the best advice I’ve seen here. So simple, but so true. It is what got me through a long and difficult medical crisis with one of my kids. That was not mental-health related, but there was so much uncertainty.</p>

<p>Scared Dad, you need to ask yourself, if your daughter had a physical illness that required the level of sacrifice you are making, would you be so full of impatience and anger? </p>

<p>It sounds like your daughter has a lot of mental health problems. Such things rarely disappear overnight, and six weeks is pretty much ‘overnight’ in dealing with a complex medical condition.</p>

<p>It sounds like you are doing a lot to help her. If you weren’t, she would likely be in much worse shape. But it sounds like you are extremely resentful , even angry, that she requires this much attention. At times, I felt like that too. And then I scolded myself, reminded myself that my child didn’t want to be sick either, and moved on. I was the parent, I did what I had to do to help my child. It meant skipping a few years of date nights and it meant figuring out other ways to have time with my spouse and other kid. I still worked, still had a life. It was just way harder than the old life. One day a time, I got through.</p>

<p>A gratitude journal helped me. Every night I’d write down my biggest worry of the day, along with at least three things I was grateful for. It really helped.</p>

<p>Good luck to you & your family.</p>

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<p>paperplane, I love the idea of a gratitude journal. I am going to start doing that. Thanksgiving is a perfect time to start one. What a great idea.</p>

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<p>I am coming into this thread obviously very late, but skimmed over the thread and just coming off the heels of a similar situation I want to add my 2 cents. My D also in college (away at an Ivy) started falling apart, depression, moodiness, total lethargy, mild drug use, pot no alcohol. When we discovered all this was going on, we got her a medical leave of absence right away and whisked her off to an inpatient rehab which treated dual diagnosis, the pot use and the depression. 30 days cannot produce a miracle but it did clear her head and allowed her to leave there with a renewed sense of hope. I think seeing the others there, who had problems far worse than her own was a sobering experience.</p>

<p>This has not been easy by any stretch, we have 3 other very successful kids, all doing great in life. We struggled with ourselves over what we did wrong with her, lots of self blame. But I started to take the advice that kept getting drilled into my ear about taking care of ourselves and our other kids and how important it was to seek out our own support system, whether it be a family therapist, Al-Anon for parents, reading books,etc…well I did all the above. And you know what, approx. 6 months later…I emerged a much much stronger, far more enlightened person. I realized that we cannot properly care for her until we are well ourselves. And to say she turned our life upside down is not an understatement.</p>

<p>Bottom line, is I feel from the little I have read, scareddad, that you are very angry, resentful about this intrusion on your life, bitter about the sacrifices her behavior is causing you to have to make and rageful at her seemingly lack of remorse. I have to remind you, you are not dealing with a well person. She was dateraped, that in ITSELF is so traumatizing, it could take years to get over that alone, then she has been dealing with everything else to boot. This girl is suffering and feeling hopeless. She is so aware of the devastation she has caused but it probably feels so overwhelming she doesn’t even know where to begin the healing and rebuilding. A very strong support system (inpatient or out) is imperative to this process, one which she feels really comfortable with. If it means 4 hours a day with her rehab center, so be it…good for her that she has found the vehicle to get her the support she needs. School and all the other milestones you want her to achieve can wait, she has a lifetime for that, the important thing is for her to get well.</p>

<p>As a parent who has dealt with a similar situation, I feel your pain, and believe me have had some very dark days. It is easy to get angry and lash out but it is most important for you to put into place your own support system which will help to educate you and enlighten you with what she is experiencing. It did wonders for our family and while I will never utter the words, “it is over” we are in a really good place right now. She needs your support and your love, the only way you can fully give that to her is to fully understand what she is going though. Remember she doesnt’ want to be where she is at this point in her life…she wants to be well, happy and thriving. It is heartbreaking to watch. I urge you if you haven’t already to take good care of yourself and join a group, get a family and personal therapist…etc…it really is the best investment you can make in an effort for the healing to begin not only for your daughter but your entire family. Praying for all of you.</p>

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<p>Being human I’ve decided to give a update since so many spent time to read and give feedback. Not much has changed still doing the AA and IOP and she is working 35hrs a week at her old job. She has tested clean in both of her drug tests. She is on a anti anxiety/ depression med. Is still seeing a therapist which she doesn’t really want to go to anymore. “I’m good Dad I have support from my fellow addicts”. </p>

<p>Her siblings rooms are 10x cleaner than hers and they are 1/2 her age. Everything is a work in progress for her is probably the best way to explain it. The 9 years old will wake up early to make her bed, get dressed, is ready 30 minutes early for school, a true joy for the whole family. The others aren’t far behind…you would think this would convict her a little bit “my litte sister is more disciplined than I am…can’t have that” instead it’s “I over slept, I’m so tired, I’ll clean it when I get home, etc etc” While it aggravates me on the inside just as much now as it did a month ago the wife and I are used to her lack of focus/action. She has tons of action if it’s something she wants to do. AA party she wanted to get there early! </p>

<p>She has hurt many people along the way we are one of the many. Seems she slept with her best friend of 5 years boyfriend before she left for college lost her virginity to him who knows if that’s true. The friend and boyfriend had been together for 2 years. The friend and her mom came over and my daughter agreed they talked etc etc etc etc. in the end my daugher said “I’m not kissing their ass I apologized what more do they want?” “I shouldn’t have done that to her I see that I can’t aplogize anymore than I have.” The friend and mom were looking for something more heartfelt in words and bodylanguage I guess. Weren’t receptive to my daughters relatively quick “I’m sorry I hurt you” reply. They’re adults so they’ll work it out if they want the relationship. Really too much to get into I would be posting a book. That is one of the recurring problems is lack of true sorrow or at least what you would think true sorrow looks like if that makes any sense. Pretty much for everything it’s a very “I’m sorry you’re right” now let’s move on type of attitude.</p>

<p>Still smokes like a chimney after saying twice she will quit what else can I say about that? She talked for two days how a happy she was she quit etc etc only to be smoking on the 3rd day. Still moody from cordial to quiet depends on the day. She did write a very heartfelt letter acknowledging that she sees the sacrifice that we are making for her and doesn’t want us to think that she is taking advantage of us. She commented on the $$ we are spending and was thankful for that.</p>

<p>The flipside is she also wants approval to go fly to another state to hang with her friends these “deep friendships” she forged in rehab. While the wife and I think it was a nice gesture we both feel like “Well, you working full time do you think it’s fair we pay all of your bills and you get to just blow your money on personal wants?” We haven’t had this conversation yet we will be having it this week. We both wonder how grateful she’ll be when we say “You pay 1/2” we haven’t decided exactly yet.</p>

<p>She wants her freedoms back and feels like she has been trying and doesn’t get why she hasn’t earned our trust back if not fully at least halfway. It seems like through the whole process she gives very good lip service and much less in the way of action in the terms of mending broken bridges with those she has hurt. It’s almost as if she feels like “I said I’m sorry isn’t that enough I’m sorry” She has a new slogan she learned in rehab “Don’t trust anybody no one will understand what you are going through unless they themselves are addict or a recovering addict” so all of her new friends are recovering additcts. To be honest while paraphrased that statement is very true because I still can’t logically understand this addiction I just have to accept it for what it is. Today she txt’d her mom and said “I’m staying after work for 1hr to talk with friends” wife said “Are you leaving <em>place of work</em> or staying there?” …“Staying mom gosh” then a text saying “You know what sucks? When your parents don’t trust you!”</p>

<p>She is currently out with friends from work that aren’t “addicts” eating at Applebees until 8:30-10:30 her first time really doing anything not rehab related. It’s almost laughable to us because she will almost lecture us on how addicts are the only people that really know what she is going through, how she can’t even talk to kids her age anymore, etc etc. Yet all of these people are her age and in school or Seniors in highschool.</p>

<p>She has hung out with her sponsor and done much in the way of hanging out with addicts at meetings and more meetings it’s almost like socializing much of the time. They sit outside and smoke talk eat food etc. often she wants to stay 30 minutes later to just chill.</p>

<p>Wife and I are pretty much numb and are just trying to keep day to day life normal for the other kids. They tire of the constant shuffling ride here, ride there, be right back, want to know when “big sister” will be driving again. We don’t have answer to that question yet.</p>

<p>I think it was “Poet” who replied that maybe we aren’t the best support system. My wife and I agree 10000%!! We aren’t…the concept of addiction, the jargon, the meetings is so different from what we can relate too. My daughter wants to move she wants to be free have addict friends over, get to hang out after work, pretty much have life the way it was before all of this happened. Drive, do stuff, etc.</p>

<p>That’s it!! This week we will be continuing the norm and having the $$ talk, 3 month plan, where do you want to move, why there, and all of that good stuff. Best of luck to all of the recovering addicts and their familiy’s during this Christmas season.</p>

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<p>ScaredDad, I continue to be appalled at your attitudes. You should have posted the first paragraph and stopped there. When I read it, I thought you had actually changed.</p>

<p>Given her recent history, holding down a 35 hour job, going to meetings regularly, and going to therapy are HUGE accomplishments. </p>

<p>Your critical judgments and lack of true support are painful to read.</p>

<p>You need help.</p>

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<p>Scareddad…You mentioned a couple things in your post that almost sounded like you were speaking about my daughter. My daughter was not an addict but was smoking pot on occasion. So much of the behaviors that you mention are part of the tapestry of drug users, ADHD and depression. The inability to give a heartfelt apology is what hit me the most. I don’t think my daughter is still able to geniunely feel sorry for anything she has either done or does that causes hurt or pain to anyone. I can’t imagine what her life will be like if she can’t feel. I too look at my other 3 children who are all only a year and two years older and wonder what went wrong with my daughter. There is something missing in the heart of my daughter and I just can’t figure out how that happened. I have questioned myself regarding holding her accountable for things she did when she was younger and I thought I did. Your daughters reaction to sleeping with her best friends boyfriend is an example of that inability to feel how they hurt someone else. The fact that she even slept with him tells you she can’t understand cause and effect. Have you and your wife been able to go to an occasional therapy session with your daughter? The reason I mention this is because many kids like this tend to not discuss the important issues, and many things that should be discussed the therapist has no idea of. I was shocked to learn that my daughters therapist had no idea that things were going on that were far more important than the nonsense my daughter was bringing up. My occasional joint sessions are my way of seeing if the therapy is addressing the real stuff and not my daughters bull#%$@ that has nothing to do with the problem that got her to therapy to begin with. </p>

<p>The behaviors of these kids are the hardest to understand. You will not be able to understand many of the things you see, partly because she is completely egocentric right now and her values seem so foreign to how you thought she would be. I know the idea of “time” sounds like a sentence of putting up with this, but is really was meant to say that with time her behavior should show glimpes of coming back to the family. It really does take time. My daughter is still a pain in the a$% and I do look forward to her being independant and moving out. Once she can support herself I will be happy to show her the door and I will stock her kitchen cabinets with the staples. I just can’t do it yet because as much as I would like to I just don’t want a repeat of where we were. The medication is working, the therapy works, she attends school, works a couple of jobs but there still is a missing component that tells me she just isn’t ready. It could be that she has threatened to leave so many times and we tell her she is free to go but yet she stays. My husband jokes and says she just wants to make us crazy…I think the joke is on us, and at times she does want to make us crazy. I am doing a secret countdown in my head…remember we have been at this longer than you. I can close my eyes and dream of having four functional kids. I think of going away for a weekend and not considering my daughters mental health and choices. Both my husband and myself are in a much better place than we were even from this past summer. I think we reached the height of everything during the summer when her boyfriend came back into the picture. Now I am almost at the point of accepting her choices and realizing that she may very well marry this young man. I pray that is not for many years. Hang in their scareddad and try not to count the days…it will drive you insane.</p>

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<p>3 years down the road for us. My daughter is finishing her freshman year with a bang. She has a 4.0. Wants to be a therapist. She’s moving into a new apartment with a friend, by choice, away from the boyfriend that we were terrified she would marry. She is doing all of her own packing. At 21, she is a very responsible drinker and uses no drugs…better than most parents can say on this forum…and she stays away from influences that would take her in the wrong direction. She still smokes, but smoking is the addiction that will kill her the slowest. Count your blessings. She will stop. When she feels confident in her ability to manage the rest of her life without it. Ultimately, this kid was a GOOD example to her younger siblings…of what NOT to do, and how to beat back something once you have allowed it to overcome you. In our case, our daughter is extremely bright, but had ADHD. A raped threw her over the edge and began a horrendous eating disorder with a whole host of other destructive attitudes and behaviors. We stayed by her side through it all. It cost us a bloody fortune; it was not easy. But some of the biggest rewards you can have as a parent (or a spouse) come from being unwilling to lose one another. My daughter knows that no matter what…her family is there. We will not be walked on. But we are here for support. My husband and I have stood together. I know that there is NOTHING we cannot get through. Her younger brother knows that his family is a rock. I just thank GOD that he is natured completely differently :)</p>

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<p>By the way Scareddad…You might want to check the attitude of the younger kids. They are aware of what has been going on and they should as a result not be asking when sister will be driving again. Be careful with their attitudes because this type of seemingly innocent behavior from them may not be as innocent as you think. They may be feeding the fires so to speak by demanding their “me” time when older sister needs a little more time.</p>

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<p>debrockman…How wonderful to see your daughter coming along so beautifully. It does take a solid strong family to help these kids get back on the path. I am happy to hear that your girl is doing so much better and is strong enough to be on her own. I don’t think my daughter will be ready to leave until she is finished with school because that seems to be her biggest stress. When she is not in school life is wonderful and the negative behaviors just don’t exist. I am proud of the fact that our daughter is attending school and taking a substantial credit load, is working, joined a sorority of really nice girls, and manages to keep up good grades (we are keeping our fingers crossed this semester since she is new to sorority life and its demands). She is in a stable relationship although they see each other only a few times a semester. I am concerned about this boyfriend because I see changes in him that I don’t particularily think are good for my daughter. I try to keep quiet but I do point out the important stuff. I think she hears everything I say because she is developing her own voice when she sees things that just aren’t really right. Overall, we are in a much better place than I thought possible but I will be happy to see school over for her. She was never the real academic type but she is a very hard worker and loves to be very busy. I think she will make an excellent self employed business woman because she seems to have that in her. Only time will tell what direction she will go in. Hope, prayer and persistance is so key to seeing the positive results, and this all takes time. This stuff did’nt happen over night and it does not go away over night. My daughter is like a work in progress and one day I really believe that she will be a masterpiece. The whole family has stood by our girl and she knows it. That makes such a difference.</p>

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<p>mommathree…BIG hugs. It does take the whole family and it does take hope, prayer and persistence…just as you say. And lots and lots of therapy. </p>

<p>When I say my daughter has an apartment…keep in mind…it is 5 miles from our house. Her old apartment was 20 miles from our house…and that was too far :slight_smile: She sleeps at home MOST nights :slight_smile: But she is almost 22 and we want her to feel like she has some independence since all of her other friends are away at school. Since she is a student in town (we are lucky to have a great major institution in town) her tuition is low so we have the money for the apartment in her college fund. Letting her have some space really helps. 21 year olds don’t live exactly like old married people. If she has some freedom, we don’t judge her every move…some annoying things she does are more a fact that she is 21, not part of mental illness.</p>

<p>My daughter finally has a new boyfriend. Funny how the boyfriends tend to fit the mental image they have of themselves. Her last boyfriend stood by her in the dark times, but he had no willingness to stay with her as she grew back OUT of the dark times. As she got healthier, she saw that too. Her new boyfriend (coming to dinner tonight) is a smart, handsome, computer engineering major who treats her like a queen. Her self-image grows every day. It was difficult to see her self-image so low. National merit scholar…fabulously good looking…but an ugly mixture of ADHD, rape, abuse, anxiety, depression and general teen angst swirled out of control.<br>
Scareddad…I PROMISE. Things can get better if you stick with it. It is so hard. I can’t say I did very well some days. I told my husband yesterday that HE saved her in one particular moment when I wanted to throw her out of the house. She appeared in Playboy. I am very conservative. I wanted to kill her! I saved her other days. Rely on one another’s good days. Your younger kids are watching. It is hard to strike the balance between enabler and supporter…I totally know that. Therapists can help you. And do try to break away from the emotional agony and live your own lives when you can. It will help your daughter.</p>

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<p>Thanks for the updated scareddad. It takes time, and the road can be bumpy, but it will get better if she is working her program.</p>

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<p>scared- if there’s a support group in town for parents you might give it a try. I know the emotional response is that anyone in that kind of group is either so much worse off than you that they can’t help you, or are just wretched losers. But- you will have days where you are much worse off than you think- and days when you start to feel like a wretched loser. It’s not a “misery loves company” dynamic-- more of people giving you coping tips that you would never have thought of on your own.</p>

<p>A friend of mine told me that when her kid was battling demons the best advice she got from a parent in her support group was to ask herself, “is this the hill I want to die on?” That helped suppress the rage she’d feel over the annoyances like a messy room, oversleeping, leaving dirty dishes in the sink, being inconsiderate, not being helpful to the younger siblings, etc. She would ask herself that 30 times a day and it really helped her keep perspective- she would have gladly taken a bullet or a grenade to keep her kid alive and safe, but no, she was not prepared to take a bullet for clothes in the hamper, a neatly made bed, or any of the other niceties of family life.</p>

<p>Her kid is now healthy, productive, considerate, and has paid them back in joy and pride for all of the pain and financial investment of those years in therapy. But it took a village of concerned people to keep the parents focused and not tearing each other apart while the kid was drowning.</p>

<p>You are very brave and this is very very hard. It will take a long time so try not to count the minutes and days on how long your ordeal has been going on. I suspect that a teenage girl who slept with her best friend’s BF has been acting out for quite a long time without you realizing it-- and that, coupled with the rape, must mean some very tough stuff to be working out in therapy. You may have initially thought that her “poor choices” began in college and therefore, could be resolved in as many months. But now that you see that she’s been miserable for a long time, you probably realize that her problems and some of the family dynamics are going to take a very long time to heal.</p>

<p>It’s ok to want to throttle her about 15 times a day. As long as you realize that if she could stop being ill she would, and that the idealized image you have carried of your little girl has probably not been reality for a long time before you watched her hit the skids.</p>

<p>hugs to you for being brave and for being there for your kid. It’s not easy and it’s not fun.</p>

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<p>ScaredDad, it sounds like there has been very good progress. IMO, you just have to let the smoking thing go–she’ll stop when she wants to.</p>

<p>The biggest problem seems that she is living in your home, and that forces you to be not only her parent, but her behavioral therapist as well. This is very unhealthy for all of you. In our area, there are many sober living homes, for young women such as your daughter. They live in the house together, there is a house manager, and they must go to meetings, and share in the taking care of the home, which, of course, includes keeping the room clean. Sometimes they cook together as well. If her doctor prescribes such an arrangement, the expenses are usually deductible as a medical expense. Around here such a place would go for $500 to $800/mo for a shared room, $1200 up for a private room. I suggest you look into it. Good luck, and in any case, it’s very important that you go to some kind of support group such as ALANON or family therapy or both.</p>

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<p>Just checking in to see how you are doing, Scareddad. Hope you are making it through the holidays ok.</p>

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<p>Scareddad…some of these later posters sound like they have good experience with some kids who have struggled. Based on my experiences this is very good advice. I think having an adult child at home with an addicition is torture for everyone. I must say that having our daughter have the ability to be home when she wanted us, and another place to be when she didn’t, was a blessing to all of us. In our case, the living conditions were horrible, but safe…she stayed with a Christian band that had a house in town…a total pit, but she was safe. We weren’t dealing with drugs and alcohol as much. Sober living houses are also a very good choice since you are.</p>

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<p>Reading an interesting book called The Tipping Point, by Malcolm Gladwell…given to me for Christmas by daughter’s new (awesome) boyfriend. Interesting chapter about smoking…who smokes, who gets addicted. Interesting reading. Big correlation between smoking and depression due to the dopamine that the body receives from the nicotine. In essence, cigarettes are a means by which depressed people “self-medicate”.</p>