<p>PerplexedParent:
“And actually, if it is the same thing, what is the point of a sorority? To create a group of people that want to be chosen by other people?”</p>
<p>A sorority is a social organization, with some structured social activities ( in my day we had mixers, formal dances, hayrides, etc) as well as philanthropic responsibilities (we did a certain amount of service and fundraising for a specific cause that our national organization supported). It may also offer a housing option that is an alternative to a dorm or apartment. Sororities also have specific traditions, ceremonies and rituals that are followed, as someone noted below, these can help in making the members feel bonded to each other and to the organization - however, some of my non-Greek friends thought these were hokey and old-fashioned and would never in a million years participate. I liked them. </p>
<p>If the sorority is part of a national organization, then there is a chance to participate in social, philanthropy or service after college, as alumni. So, there you go- it’s simply another type of organization to join in college, and it will not appeal to everyone.</p>
<p>Psi, all of that is well and good (and I really do see that sororities do a lot of good), but I still fail to see why you need a rush process, with its series of parties and its voting people in or out, to attain all of that.</p>
<p>The point of rush is to get to know the incoming girls, obviously – and to give them all a fair shake by ensuring that every house meets every girl for X period of time, so that the outgoing girls don’t dominate the more shy, quiet girls. And, to give the houses a fair shake so that every girl gets to meet all of them, as opposed to only meeting a few because she’s unfairly prejudged that X is the party house and Y is the loser house and Z is the stuck-up house. I’m not sure what is not self-evident about that part, but perhaps I didn’t understand your question?</p>
<p>If your question is what goes on at the parties, it’s the same damn conversations that go on with any college freshmen – hi, nice to meet you, what’s your major, where are you from, what dorm do you live in, have you heard about XYZ on campus. The get-to-know-stuff is exactly the same as what goes in in any dorm or cafeteria or student center or study group, except that it’s occurring in a pre-determined structured space / place / time. That’s it.</p>
<p>Because there has to be some structure to it if you’re making it an organization where you have to pay dues and maintain a house for people to live in. </p>
<p>The parties are a <em>positive</em> thing, PP, because they make it FAIRER than how the guys do it – which is that they all wander around and get drunk, LOL, and a guy doesn’t necessarily have to visit / meet all the fraternities before deciding which one he likes. They make it fairer because all girls and all houses are given an equal shake.</p>
<p>Perplexed, I think there needs to be some process for selection where both the prospective members and the sororities can exercise a choice. It’s not merely a one-sided process - sororities rank order prospective members in order of preference, and prospective members also rank order (and eliminate) sororities in order of preference too. You suggested a lottery, but I am not sure that many would want to commit to a group of people whom they may be living with in close quarters for 2 or 3 years if that group was selected only by chance. Even in regard to dorm room assignments, many freshman use Facebook or some other means to exercise their choice in the matter. Like I said earlier, rush is not a perfect process but it seems to work out fine in most circumstances for people who want to join a sorority.</p>
<p>“The point of rush is to get to know the incoming girls, obviously.”</p>
<p>Sorry, my question really was not clear. What I meant is what is the point of having rush as opposed to some other process by which people join a sorority, if the result is, as I think you said, no different that what happens in a residential college dorm–some people you like, some people you don’t like. Obviously there has to be some structure, but why this particular structure, which to an outsider (at least to me) seems to be so compressed (a series of a lot of social functions in a short amount of time) as to require that judgments be made either on superficialities (I confess this is what I have always assumed) or hunches (this is what I understand you to be saying the selection process is based on; some sort of “vibe” that I will connect with this person). I am willing to believe that the judgments are based on hunches, but are those hunches (which you say sometimes turn out to be wrong) really all that much better at selecting a group of people than some other process (even a lottery process)? </p>
<p>I really am just trying to understand why sorority selection is such a big ordeal, culminating in a yes or no vote about a person. People want to join a particular sorority, let them join. Have some objective criteria or create a lottery if there is a supply/demand problem.</p>
<p>Well, actually, in the beginning of rush, it is the girls who are rushing who make the yes or no vote: 1. by choosing or not to rush. 2. They cut houses first. 3. In the end, the girls are ranked and the girls themselves rank.</p>
<p>Most of the girls in any house are as clueless about who will be accepting or getting a bid from them as the girls who are rushing are. It’s both ways. The final day seems to be equally as exciting for both groups, from what I understand.</p>
<p>Incidentally, there is also informal recruitment which is far more relaxed. It can also be more personal. The only “problem” with it is that houses that aren’t at quota (maximum allowable membership) do informal. And there are some young ladies for whom only the “best” house will be good enough for them. </p>
<p>Now, you are saying why do you have a quota? Because there might be a group that could easily pledge 200 girls and leave other houses with zero. And those houses would fail. The big house would be totally impersonal. And there would be no room for most members to live in the house, if that should be their desire.</p>
<p>Let’s say you are new to a school. You decide you don’t want to just wait until friendships fall into your lap. Instead, you plan to start talking to people, hoping to find someone with whom you click. You walk into the commons before school & 5 people are sitting at tables, each alone. Who do you decide to talk to first? What if the person doesn’t really care much for you? What if you don’t care much for the person? What if you want to move on to meet the next person? Not much different from rush. The girl decides she want to meet some other young women because she just wants to meet other girls with whom she might form friendships. She goes to events that allow her to do just that. Some work out well, others are just “meh.” It’s not the end of the world if it doesn’t all work out (although I won’t downplay the fact that disappointment can & does happen in the process).</p>
<p>It’s getting tiring to repeat that it’s a two-way selection process. It is not that the sororities all line up and pick who they want. They also have to “sell” themselves. And sometimes the girls they want don’t want them.</p>
<p>it’s like the college admissions process. You look for the fit you want, and the college decides whether it wants to admit you.</p>
<p>D2 just finished rush, and when she called me to talk about which houses she liked best, she said (something like), “I can’t really explain why I like XYZ sorority best, but you know that feeling when you visit a college campus and you just know it feels right? That is how I felt about XYZ sorority.”</p>
<p>Students often choose their colleges after spending less time on campus than girls spend at houses during rush. Most of the time it works out fine. It is more likely to work out fine if the student spends some time getting a “feel” for the campus rather than selecting among similar colleges by lottery.</p>
<p>At this point, shouldn’t we all just agree to disagree? Everyone has a different perspective -from Greeks and non-Greeks, from northern schools and SEC schools, etc. Every view point has been expressed and each side has tried to explain their perspective to others, sometimes with frustration that the other side doesn’t seem to “get it.” Perceptions die hard (or don’t die at all).</p>
<p>This is why Greek life is for some and not for others. </p>
<p>Look, my daughter would never consider a small LAC for college. It’s not the experience she wants. Doesn’t mean there is anything wrong with a small LAC. It is a great opportunity for so many (perhaps even my other child). It has advantages and disadvantages; it’s just not for her. She could apply - and be accepted or not accepted. Maybe they don’t accept her because, despite all the wonderful things about her, there are just too many applicants and they can’t accept all of them. I would tell her that there are options. Other places where she would be happy. It’s not one-size-fits-all. What is a perfect fit for one student is not a perfect fit for all. Even if she gets in, she may find disadvantages (no big-time football! not near a cultural center! etc.)</p>
<p>A lot of the same things apply to Greek life! </p>
<ul>
<li>It’s not for everyone.</li>
<li>There are options.</li>
<li>You may like most of it, but there may be some parts you aren’t crazy about.</li>
</ul>
<p>I like the second semester rush. Gives freshmen a chance to get settled and learn about the houses, if they are so inclined. Then they decide if this is route they want to go.</p>
<p>Is it time to make a new thread, “What are the advantages of joining a sorority?”</p>
<p>That’s a VERY fair point! And honestly the impressions of “what the students are like on this campus” are based on even sketchier impressions – what the tour guide was like (even though the tour guide was one of thousands), how the kids sitting in the cafeteria or in the classroom appeared to comport themselves, whether the kids appeared to the outer eye to be concerned with looks or more natural / down-to-earth … And maybe only an in-depth conversation with one or two students in the context of an overnight stay … And that’s a far bigger decision with far greater implications!</p>
<p>My college had formal rush in the fall rush back in the day (still does), my daughter went through spring recruitment a couple of years ago. A problem with deferred rush (as I see it) is that the freshmen women hear a lot of the stereotypes about the houses. Although the Potential New Members (rushees) are educated to keep an open mind and NPC recruitment is set up to help the PNMs who maximize their options, many girls will drop out of recruitment because they think they are too good for a less-popular group. All 26 NPC organizations have something positive to offer. They all have strong chapters and weak chapters.</p>
<p>^^^I agree with you motherdear…I think that is definitely a drawback to deferred rush…From what I understand, “tent talk” is a real problem, even with non-deferred rush. I am encouraging my daughter to go into the rush process with a completely open mind. At this point, she knows nothing about the sororities at her particular school. I am not naive enough to think that she might not be influenced by the “tent talk” but I surely intend to warn her about it.</p>
<p>On a similar note…my daughter has joined the facebook group for her intended school and has posted a profile on a roomate matching website…the website matches potential roomates based on a suvery that they all take. An algorythm is in place to “match” the roomates…The potential roomates can then contact one another if they are interested in rooming together. It is sort of like match.com…It will be interesting to see how this all unfolds for D…really all you get is the other person’s “profile” pictue and a little blurb about the person. You do not get to see how they answered the questions, only the percentage of how you match with them (this is a flaw in the system to me). You can then “friend” them on facebook… I think initially, the potential roomates are looking at each other superfically, only going on what they “look” like on facebook…they do not have alot to go on except physical perceptions…Is there a correlation here to sorority rush? Very interesting…</p>
<p>Any advice from former sorority members?
I’ve been following this thread for the last two weeks. D decided very suddenly 3 days before deferred rush second semester that she was going to join recruitment. None of her friends were interested but she is the “summer camp” type and wanted to see what it was like. She had her heart set on two of 12 groups on campus; made the first cut, and didn’t make the second (out of three cuts) for the two that she was attracted to. She dropped out immediately but is very depressed. She is thinking that she will try again as a sophomore since there were many sophomores in the recruitment with her. Any uplifting words that I can give her? Any advice for next year?
Thanks for your help. My college never had sororities and I went to school in the late 60’s - so this is all very foreign to me.</p>
<p>I originally did not get a bid, then eventually did … I still recall my depression vividly. It really hurts. For me, it was different. My sorority was actually a national service sorority at the time (it later became a panhellenic sorority). Because of this, things were more flexible … apparently, some of the members did some “stumping” for me, and I got a late bid. This does NOT happen with panhellenic groups; there are no late bids.</p>
<p>As I think back on it, I don’t know if I would have rushed all over again. I think I probably would have moved beyond caring by then … or maybe because my best friends had joined, I would want to be in the group more than ever. I don’t know. I did eventually become the group’s president; later I was an advisor. It worked out for me.</p>
<p>The only thing I can say is your D will have to decide for herself when the time comes. She will remember how she feels now, I’m sure … so she will have to decide whether or not she wants to risk being turned down again. This is one of those moments in life when we want to throw our arms around our kids & protect them from the pain. Yet it’s also one of those things our kids must decide for themselves. I wish your D my best.</p>
<p>I’m sorry your D is disappointed! However, deciding only to rush 2 houses (based on what?) is a recipe for disappointment. A house your D might not have liked at first blush may be one she would have loved. At my first recruitment event, there were two houses I loved and two I didn’t really like. At my second recruitment event, I realized that I didn’t really like one of the houses I had initially (thought I) loved and absolutely enjoyed one of the houses I was “meh” on intially. I ended up pledging the latter and having an awesome experience.</p>
<p>If your D decides to rush again, she should keep an open mind about all the houses she is invited back to. Good luck! :)</p>
<p>I’m sorry your D is hurt. Sometimes, the value of something is only as a learning experience for later but that doesn’t make you feel better. </p>
<p>This is one of the disadvantages of spring rush. The girls develop opinions of which sororities they think they want and target those. When rushing as soon as school starts, no one knows anyone so you go into with a more open mind. I realize there are disadvantages to early rush too. </p>
<p>I can’t offer any advice based on personal experience as I didn’t go through rush and never considered joining a sorority. I was rushed informally by a senior who was the lab assistant in a class. She started introducing me to members of the sorority and invited me to dinner at the house. A couple of other girls invited me on “Coke dates” and the next thing you know, I had a bid. I didn’t even really know what it was all about and had no idea how to respond. Now I know how lucky I was to have avoided all the drama.</p>