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<blockquote> <p>This article really does show that a "hook" can be a determining factor in admissions...<<</p> </blockquote>
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<p>Yes, the article focused on $$$ and fame hooks almost exclusively--the ones that seem most unfair to "unhooked" applicants since the $$$ and fame are not a product of student effort but parental effort.</p>
<p>I've been trying to figure out why that article bothered me so much. I think I finally have it. It wasn't just that the parents thought of their son as having failed even though he was admitted to Carnegie Mellon and Johns Hopkins. It was that they talked this way in public to a reporter for a nationally distributed newspaper. The sense of entitlement (our son had the stats and was at GROTON) got to me as well. It seemed they didn't choose Groton for the education itself, but as a means to an end and then were upset that the means didn't work.</p>
<p>Unexamined in the obvious slant of the article is where their preferred alternative admissions policies would leave those who couldn't come up with the money for a place like Groton or had parents who don't want them in boarding school.</p>
<p>Maybe that sense of entitlement came through in the applications and this is why he didn't make it. My husband went to an exclusive prep school, too, but somehow managed to escape unscathed. He DID start out as a political conservative and ended up getting more and more liberal as he stayed there. This was contrary to the politics of most there; it was just that some of the kids had such a feeling that they should have it made and the world had better recognize it (if not, mummy and daddy would make it).</p>
<p>In the article, mummy and daddy didn't have the wherewithall to try to bribe the colleges. But then they took their outrage public.</p>
<p>It seemed a very unfair article, because you only get one side. The colleges can't very well explain why they didn't take this or that applicant. But the applicants can carry on about how it was special unfair factors all they want.</p>
<p>I do wonder how much a true hook something like "legacy tied to family giving" actually is. I can come up with an anecdote, too. My niece applied to a selective place. She had high grades at a strong private school, high test scores, good ECs, and demonstrated artistic talent. She would have been fifth generation at the school. There are two buildings on campus named for ancestors; the family, taken together, has been by far the largest private donor in the history of the school. She didn't get in -- wasn't even waitlisted. The family thought this was a terrible injustice because of all it has done for the university over the years; "we give and give for decades, and this is the reward we get; she is a highly qualified candidate after all."</p>
<p>To make sure the record is clear, this isn't the school my daughter is attending. She is at a place at which she didn't have legacy status (not much development potential either, since the bulk of the family money has actually gone to the other school!). She was admitted to the school in question, though. I suppose if she had gone there and people didn't know about her cousin, they would have assumed it was her family that was the deciding factor and how unfair it was because they happened to have a higher ACT score than she did.</p>
<p>To Mombot: My dad was born a few years after Ghana (the country he is from) became independant. His relatives urged him not to come back after he went to the U.S. when he was 18, because things were going bad there, due to Rawling's dictatorship. My grandparents divorced when my dad was young. He was their only child in their marriage, but when both of my grandparents remarried and had other children, he became the child that was cast aside, and ended up spending his childhood being sent from relative to relative rather than living with either of his parents. My dad had to make his own opportunities when it came to education and other various opportunites.</p>
<p>He is definitely the exception to the rule when it comes to academics. In his culture there is a very strong double standard, even up to this day (example, my mom blatantly favoring my brother over me, just because he is a boy). Woman are to be seen not heard, and they focus more on home-making skills than education, even though they are allowed to go to college, a good majority of them focus on finding a husband while in college. My dad is the exception to the rule in his culture; he always took a more stronger interest in what I did than in my brother (not to say my dad totally blows off my brother, because he does take some interest, but just not as much interest as he did when I was his age). He wants me to become independant, making my own money, rather than being dependant on a man. I know I probably get my drive from my dad, because I hate hand-holding when it comes to education and I like to seek out my own opportunities, and be able to fall on my own and pick myself up and continue on.</p>
<p>To DianeR: Yeah, I wish that they would have atleast talked to the colleges that he were rejected from and find out why he was rejected, so that other people can learn from his mistakes or lack of mistakes. I'm sure your daughter is very qualified; I believe that ACT doesn't measure one's intelligence and should not be made into the ultimate determining factor of whether or not a student should be goin to a certain school. There will always be people who think that other people shouldn't have gotten into certain colleges. They think that person wasn't as "qualified" as they are or as qualified as their rejected friend, and use the excuse to AA, legacy, or athlete status to justify it. They don't truly know what's going on behind the scenes, even though they can take a good guess. Colleges do not accept people who have stats that show that they are going to fail out within the year or people who have "hooks"/"tip factors" combined with an awful/boring personality. Your daughter probably had amazing essays along with outstanding qualities that made her stand out more than the high ACT scorers who were rejected.</p>
<p>My in-laws didn't want to talk to the college about the rejection. They didn't think it would work and they didn't want to think it would work, that the college they loved would change course from an attempt to pull strings. The college made the decision it made and they thought they just had to move on. They aren't the type to try to pull strings and only answered the questions on the application about legacy status because it asked.</p>
<p>It may make a difference that my niece can study what she is interested in at any number of places. So she couldn't show an overall need to attend any particular school or a reason why a particular place would be the best fit. My daughter has very specialized interests that can't be met at many different schools. Her background, transcript, recommendations, and essays were distinctive. This didn't work everywhere, but it happened to work at the places she applied that happened to be (probably) the best fits for her. So the places she wasn't admitted weren't for her to begin with. (At least in retrospect it seems that way!)</p>
<p>My niece ended up at a nice school that she likes and is small enough to have small classes and give her a lot of personal attention in her field (art). So really things do work out. I don't want to leave the implication that her personality is somehow off -- she is a great person, makes friends easily, etc.</p>
<p>As a Trojan Parent I hope you apply to USC; you would make an outstanding candidate. USC is an excellent school with a huge amount of scholarship money, a number of world class programs, and a wide variety of stduents. Don't take TheDad's USC's comments too seriously; I don't anymore.</p>
<p>To DianeR: I'm so sorry if you misunderstood some of my post. I meant that I wish that the parents/reporter could've talked to the Groton grad's list of schools that he applied to and were rejected from. </p>
<p>The article seems to inadvertantly imply that the Groton grad didn't get in because he wasn't a legacy, URM, or athlete, but if we knew the real reason for why he was rejected then parents and students can learn from his mistakes or lack of mistakes. I wouldn't want to find out the reason for a rejection (for the same reasons as your in-laws), but obviously the parents of the Groton grad felt comfortable enough to take it to a newspaper and try to blame the rejection on the fact of not having a "hook". It is the responsibility of the reporter to find out the facts rather than to make assumptions on why a certain applicant did not get in and try to pass it on as the truth. For all we know the reporter could be right in his assumptions, but we don't know for sure, that is what really bothers me about the article, even though it was pretty informative.</p>
<p>I am sorry that I wasn't really clear in my earlier post. The Groton grad wanted to major in pre-med, he could've been rejected for the same reasons as your niece (can study their field in a number of places), but both ended up at good schools and seem to be successful (the Groton grad seemed to be successful in the article). You did not imply at all that your niece didn't have a good personality, and I didn't view it in that way at all. </p>
<p>tsdad: Thank you so much!! Yeah, I remember reading debates about the quality of USC between you and TheDad, both of you offered good, but drastically different views. Earlier in the thread TheDad mentioned that "oddly enough, reading between the OP's lines, I think she might be very successful at USC on terms with which even I could not quibble". I am just trying to remain neutral, and take in everyone's opinions about certain schools. By the time I'm finished visiting the schools on my list and on my dad's list, I will hopefully have an idea of how I view each school in terms of what I saw during the visits.</p>
<p>Yeah, I was positively glowing about USC in this thread...what gives?</p>
<p>TheSiren,
my suggestions have already been expressed (better than I could) in afan's post 53. There are times where giving life's circumstances a little nudge is kinder than risking major disagreements. Best wishes to you.</p>
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Yeah, I was positively glowing about USC in this thread...what gives?
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<p>Your inherent goodness coming out? Truth overcomes the need to be cute?</p>
<p>Any cheese left?</p>