help...freshman son so unhappy

Parent Cafe
61

<p>(Sorry ignore previous post...this is the edited version after I found out where he was going to school).</p>

<p>Mkm,
Tell him to transfer!! I have actually heard that about Wake. I have a good friend from high school who went there and contemplated transferring a few times but never actually did it. I think looking back he wishes he did. He also found the academics to be very rigourous, I would say Wake might be one of the most work intensive schools in the top 30 (put Chicago, Davidson, Cornell, and JHU into that pile as well). Adding to this is a very cutthroat pre-med curriculum.</p>

<p>I am also a former transfer. I went to an Ivy my first year (Columbia) and also found that it just wasn't the right fit socially. Students were too angsty, cliquey, whatever. I transferred to another Ivy (Dartmouth) and found the students to be much more cooperative, friendly, and happy - much more my type of people. People advised me to stay another year at Columbia to give it a chance, but I am so glad I left after my first year. It was so easy to assimilate as a sophomore, and the experience was night and day compare to my previous school. Most people don't even know I was a transfer. I actually went back to Columbia for grad school, and seeing undergrad life there again I thank the stars I transferred. I think it was the best decision I have ever made in my life. Seriously I cannot emphasize enough how much I love Dartmouth and how glad I was able to re-write the history of my life by going there. </p>

<p>I think there are going to be many top colleges that he might enjoy very much that will be socially a much better fit AND less rigourous, with ZERO sacrifice in prestige. My brother transferred to UNC-CH, and loves it. Getting into UNC out of state as a transfer is actually easier than being accepted IN STATE for first-years since UNC drops their out-of-state quota for transfers. If your son got over a 3.0 last semester, it is likely he will be admitted since I assume if he got into Wake he had a strong high school record. </p>

<p>If he did very well at Wake he should check out Brown (full of happy/ cooperative/ nice people, better prestige, and less cutthroat academics). Its also easier to get in as a transfer vs. first year admissions. Also Northwestern, Vassar, Dartmouth, and Penn are worth a look as laid-back top schools with friendly student bodies.</p>

<p>Look at this as an opportunity for him to move to a school that's a better ft, with a better social life, and he can also get a better reputation and less cutthroat academics to boot. Yes, all this does exist.</p>

<p>I say be bold and apply! What do you have to lose? As final note, my guidance counselor told me I wouldn't get into any of my transfer schools (I had a 3.3 first semester). I ended up getting into every school I applied to.</p>

62

<p>Lib, hope it goes that way for my son. Slipper, thanks for the suggestions, he'll have break soon and we'll take a look at some of these.</p>

63

<p>he's got a long road ahead of him, college, med school, residency and on if he plans on specializing.... he certainly isn't going to like all of it. But having been through 2 miserable years with my son, I would have to say if he is that miserable to tell him to start looking around, make him do it though. But the categories of students that he is mentioning are at every school, my son also doesn't fit in anywhere because he doesn't drink, use drugs, like bars, isn't athletic and like's things a bit off the beaten path. So you either get a list of what is available EC wise, and pick a few to start with, talk to a guidance counselor, or switch to another school where you might find things exactly the same. chemistry, biology, A/P is difficult anywhere.</p>

64

<p>Hi mkm,</p>

<p>Do all of this soon however, transfer apps are due in less than a month I believe. I cranked mine out over a weekend so its shouldn't be too difficult, but you do want to give your professors time. If he has over a 3.5 GPA, I think the top schools I mentioned are very well within reach. Brown and Dartmouth are the two I would put at the top. Both are semi-LACs like Wake, but with friendlier students and a lesser workload. At worst its a few hundred dollars that could change your life. As a backup UNC is also a great choice.</p>

65

<p>Son should think about transferring to a decent state university known for having fun. Maybe even one where he has some old friends, maybe especially if his studies keep him a bit occupied for a lot of socializing. Pre-med will be easier for him and more enjoyable.</p>

<p>He won't need to work so hard to get good grades and can even remain relatively anal while doing this.</p>

<p>I don't see any purpose in him killing himself, or you paying $40 k when organic, calculus, physics and some of the other pre-med courses are just hoops to jump though and don't have much to do with being a doctor.</p>

<p>If you go to med school, who is going to care too much about the alleged prestige of your undergrad school? </p>

<p>My son could have gotten into more "prestigious" schools, but is happy and relatively stress free in pre-med at UT Austin. Friends and kids that I have known that have gone to schools like John Hopkins and Rice have had a much harder time as pre-meds and the resulting relatively low grades have discouraged some from med school or led to years of worrying about med school acceptance.</p>

66

<p>"I don't see any purpose in him killing himself, or you paying $40 k when organic, calculus, physics and some of the other pre-med courses are just hoops to jump though and don't have much to do with being a doctor."</p>

<p>In many places, you can even take those classes at a community college, or in a "post-graduate" year. When you consider the "weed out" factor, perhaps with even better results at getting into med schools.</p>

<p>Life is short. Be happy. Go light.</p>

67

<p>If the issue were academics, I would agree with you. However, it sounds that the OPs son is happy with his courses, even if he is stressed out. On the other hand, his major problem seems to be social, which would be helped by transferring to another school with similar academic quality but with a different personality.</p>

68

<p>Mkm -- There is absolutely no shame in transferring if the fit is truly not there! Like Slipper, my D transferred after her freshman year. Like your son, academics at College No. 1 were terrific, but the campus culture did not suit her. Armed with much better knowledge of herself and what she needed in a school, she made an excellent choice second time around. The transition was relatively easy and she is a very happy sophomore. If your son’s gut tells him it’s time to move on, he should act quickly. Those transfer deadlines are looming. And please know that not every school with a less competitive, friendly atmosphere will be a "lesser" school! You’ve gotten some good ideas from other posters. I’d add to the list Wash U and Tufts. Both are transfer-friendly schools with good sciences, smart kids, and non-cutthroat cultures.</p>

69

<p>MKM - Premed is not exactly geared for friends & fun no matter where you attend college.... sounds like your son has also had other impediments to making friends... so I would concentrate more on becoming involved on campus, than spend time looking elsewhere. Plus, if he's like most, you'll hear more of the downside than anyone else! The friends will come... premeds need each other! If he still feels like he wants a change, he can look around this summer and apply for a winter transfer. anyway, that's MHO! Best wishes!</p>

70

<p>
[quote]
My older son says "What, you mean you actually read every assignment and supplemental reading?---you gotta learn to skim!" The unhappy one tends to be very anal---everything done just right. Needless to say the grades are good

[/quote]
Lots of good advice so far on fit, finding friends, and so on. But nobody has commented on this statement by the OP so I'd like to.</p>

<p>In engineering they say they teach you how to study effectively and think logically. The funny thing is, they never actually spend a minute of class time discussing these things. It's just something you're supposed to figure out on your own along the way, and BTW if you don't figure it out you're going to end up flunking out or transferring to another major.</p>

<p>Seems to me something similar is happening with your son. Profs will pile on work, and you have to figure out what needs to be studied in slow detail and what can be skimmed for the general ideas. They don't tag things with this in the syllabus, nor will they ever talk about it in class. Good study skills are for some strange reason just expected to appear. </p>

<p>It sounds like your son is resisting this, intent on mastering every assigned bit of work. This can't be sustained. Not in most liberal-arts majors, and certainly not in professional schools like law. For that matter, I've heard that in med school something similar happens and they give more material than can be learned. I'm not a doctor, check with a recent med-school grad on this, but if so your son is better of learning to prioritize/schedule now than later.</p>

<p>There are books that discuss this so he doesn't have to figure out everything on his own. One I recommend highly is "What Smart Students Know" by a founder of the Princeton Review test-prep firm. The book discusses how to study various material.</p>

71

<p>Actually not many top schools accept winter transfers, even if they do you still need to apply by March. Also, talking about friendships, the best way to meet people is fall orientation. Every day you meet new people during this period.</p>

<p>Klc, I might agree with you if I had not heard similar things about Wake from other students. Wake has a good reputation, but its academic rigour is well beyond the consideration it is given. I wouldn't want to be there as a pre-med. Similatly I would never go to a cutthroat place like Hopkins, when places like Brown get the same or better consideration and are less cutthroat. Its not only about the grades, its also about the people. </p>

<p>As a transfer myself I cannot emphasize enough how important it is to transfer sophomore fall.</p>

72

<p>"MKM - Premed is not exactly geared for friends & fun no matter where you attend college...."</p>

<p>Of course it is. I know excited, involved, happy premeds at all kinds of places, places where there are no weed-out strategies employed, and where med. school admissions approach 90-100%, and with MUCH less prestige than Wake, JHU, Duke, etc. At my alma mater, the music department boasts that a higher percentage of music majors go on to med. school than the biology majors. </p>

<p>For some strange reason, entering pre-meds, especially at the pre-med factories, seem to think they have to take 6 of the required 11 courses in their first year, and then are surprised for some reason when they don't have a life.</p>

73

<p>
[quote]
Life is short. Be happy. Go light.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>I love it. Add in "less is more" and I have a philosophy of life.</p>

<p>Well, I guess I need to add in something about the importance of dark chocolate ...</p>

74

<p>Looking at the adjustments in a list, small wonder he isn't feeling so hot. He's had his physical, mental and social world turned upside down.</p>

<p>That said, some of his disappointments aren't symptoms of other ills. I've heard similar complaints from other private college students. </p>

<p>Your son is finding out that aaving 100 amazing friends is an anamoly in life. If, like my S1, he grew up with 100 amazing friends, he might assume he will automatically land in similar groups everywhere he goes. </p>

<p>Life is not like that. We all have to get out there and find our people.</p>

75

<p>True but sometimes the place just isn't right. I agree he needs to give Wake a chance, but applying elsewhere now is important. Transferring as a junior is more socially challenging as compared to transferring sophomore year.</p>

<p>At the right school you can have 100 amazing friends.</p>

76

<p>Agree with slipper. To the OP's son I say, keep trying to make it work at Wake, but get those transfer apps done, too. Then, come spring, the decision to stay or go will be yours. Stoic suffering is NOT a virtue for college students, especially at 40K a year. And for some kids, 2-3 friends are NOT enough. Some kids are happy being part of a small subculture. Others don't feel whole unless they're part of the mainstream.</p>