<p>I think the point Barron’s is making is that the daughter never said she was the victim of sexual harrassment and yes with two adults and in the absence of sexual harassment charges two wrongs and all that…it will be more to the point if the Dean needs a statement from the daughter.</p>
<p>Doesn’t matter if the daughter complains of sexual harassment. What matters are the university employment policies and procedures and their definition of harassment.</p>
<p>Outcome - had a conference call with both of his bosses. I told them the only outcome that was acceptable to me was dismissal. They both agreed with me. I also asked them to dismiss him over elimination of the position not for sexual harassment. In doing so it would protect the woman (so she wouldn´t have to go on the record) and it would give him some severance money because he has 2 young innocent children and a wife. </p>
<p>I am not asking for applause here, but many of us are in the position to do what´s right, and I am just doing what my conscious is telling me to do and in doing so I am also protecting my firm from possible damaging law suit.</p>
<p>Is the position really being eliminated?</p>
<p>Will he be told the real reason, and that he is being given this opportunuity to collect severence as part of the outprocessing, or will he not know ? Always curious how that is handled.</p>
<p>Professors by virtue of their authority position have two fiduciary responsibilities:</p>
<p>a) Not to chase or have relationships with students
2) Not allow themselves to be chased by students. </p>
<p>In other words, they are required to say “NO” clearly, unequivocally and not create an environment where the wrong impressions are given. So the excuse “he/she chased me” will not wash. The onus is on the professor, not on the student, they are held to a higher standard. The same applies to Politicians for example, we expect them to be held to a higher standard.</p>
<p>Firms could always do restructuring, just like colleges could change its course offerings. This particular individual knows he is in a big trouble. He has been trying to call this woman to apologize, and trying to reach me. I am sure he will know why, but it won´t go on the official record.</p>
<p>Glad to hear he knows the real reason. I remember lots of “restructuring” and renaming of positions at DH’s old company. But, IIRC, one time they told someone his position was being eliminated and then it was posted on the website’s job openings. That didnt go well.</p>
<p>I think you grossly underestimate the power of a young determined woman. What if they just happen meet in the library or the Union or a ski trip? Just two people hanging out? Or they wait until after the end of the term. And many are not just over 18 but 21 and over. There are so many faculty married to younger former coeds there must be some happy connections going on. This neo-Victorian protectionism of “weak and vulnerable” females is a little insulting to them. Some colleges just require the faculty person not grade the student if he/she is in the class.</p>
<p>barrons, my opnion would be no different if it were a male student and a female or male prof. It is unprofessional for the prof to get involved with a student while she/he is still the prof.'s student.</p>
<p>This is common sense.</p>
<p>This post isn’t about a prof and a student who was not in the class, but a prof and HIS student. Unethical, regardless of age or sex of either.</p>
<p>Glad OLDFORT you handled it promptly and appropriately as you should. I know someone who makes a LOT of $$$ handling sexual (& other) discrimination cases. The EEOC refers cases they believe have merit to him when the employee doesn’t have an attorney and they feel the case has merit. Ignoring & selective blindness/deafness in the workplace is BAD and expensive.</p>
<p>needsadvice, I concur with others that you have done what you should/can. It is great to hear that your D is pulling away on her own.</p>
<p>I don’t think it would be prudent to go to his other employers without anything from your daughter. Lawyers on this thread could tell me otherwise, but my first guess is that he could have grounds to sue you if he were fired from those jobs based upon just your statements (not sure if he’d win, but that wouldn’t be fun for you).</p>
<p>This guy committed sexual harassment and should be fired from the job at needadvice’s daughter’s university. He sounds like he is in denial about his ethical and professional obligations. As poetgrl says, this was a guy grading a student he was sleeping with. This is different from just happening to meet next semester. There really isn’t any excuse for this. Barrons, as I posted much earlier, I was on the receiving end of female advances as a young professor and I had the good judgment not to respond. That’s all that is necessary and it is not so difficult to do.</p>
<p>One question: the posters here are labeling him a serial predator. Do those of you posters who are saying this have any evidence that this professor routinely harasses his students? I missed that (the only evidence I recall was just a Facebook post with another young woman, which hardly seemed sufficient to demonize him if there is no additional evidence but I definitely have not read this whole thread). I’m not defending his actions in any way, but I think people shouldn’t immediately jump to the assumption that he’s been doing this at this school and the other ones and thus needsadvice needs to go talk to other schools that employ him.</p>
<p>Barrons, your argument is irrelevant. The responsibility lies on the Professor to say no and walk away. The professor is a professional, with an employment contract that forbids relationships with current students, and as a professional and an adult he/she is obligated to be the “grown up” and do the right thing. If they want to start a relationship AFTER the student is NO LONGER in their class, and they NEVER teach that student again, that’s another story.</p>
<p>
Name one. Seriously.</p>
<p>Clap–Clap–Clap</p>
<p>[applauding Oldfort, even though she is not asking for applause]</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>This has nothing to do with protectionism of “weak and vulnerable” females. It has everything to do with protectionism of “weak and vulnerable” students from their authority figures viz, their professors. Just like protecting employees from their supervisors. </p>
<p>Secondarily these rules also protect the authority figures from being manipulated or having their integrity questioned.</p>
<p>We don’t “know” what is written in the college handbook because we don’t know which college this is. In early, early posts several different college handbooks were linked and in fact some of them “allowed” profs and students to date as long as the profs rescused themselves from grading. We simply don’t know what this particular college “rule” is, regardless – if this prof graded the OPs daughter he is most likely in trouble of some sort at any college. We also don’t “know” if this prof is a predator – that word has been used repeatedly but we simply don’t know for certain that he has repeatedly had affairs with students that were in his class and whose work he was grading. Which is why the OP needs to be careful legally for herself about reporting behavior to other employers as a secondhand party. </p>
<p>The difference between Oldfort’s example is the man at her company subjected a fellow employee to unwanted activity. The OPs D, at least as far as we know, was engaged in a consensual adult relationship. Now that could change if the OPs D decides to come forth and complain. There is a difference. The college will sort it out no doubt.</p>
<p>barrons, </p>
<p>This problem isn’t limited to females. There are also gay professors who hit on young male students. The rules and issues are exactly the same at most colleges. So, this isn’t about “females;” it is about professors or other faculty and students. </p>
<p>In fact, the only one of my kid’s friends who was sexually harassed was a gay male student who was harassed by a gay prof. The kid said no; the prof kept pursuing. </p>
<p>This isn’t about male/females. It’s about the power imbalance. In the workplace, most companies ban romantic relationships between supervisors and those they supervise. Whey shouldn’t that basic principle apply to faculty/student relationships?</p>
<p>I work at a college. Several of my (male) colleagues have married former students. Usually they wait until the student is not longer in their classes to get involved. But they certainly meet as professor/student. It has been happening forever. When I was a undergraduate centuries ago, the head of my department left his wife for a pretty young student. I don’t see it as too different from meeting someone at work. If you watch 'Mad Men", the (male) executives are always marrying their secretaries. Same kind of age/power discrepancy. I even know some women who have married former students (one is ten years older than her husband). I don’t see how to put a stop to it.
Having said that, if my D got involved with a professor, I would be upset. With a T.A., not so much. the age difference would be less.</p>
<p>You’re not actually comparing an academic setting in 2011 to an ad agency where they all drank all day long in their offices and smoked all day long in their offices (etc…), are you?</p>
<p>The point of madmen, at least one of the points, if you read the writer/producers take on it, was how horrible it was for women in the workplace back then.</p>
<p>Of course, perhaps you are. Maybe you are saying these “liberal” academics really aren’t. More the “do as I say not as I do” types? </p>
<p>Look, I have no big issue with somebody dating a professor, but I do if the professor is the students teacher AT THE TIME. And just because “it’s been goin on forever” is not a reason it ought to continue to go on. At one point, you could have said that bosses always slept with their secretaries, now not so much. Does the fact that it once went on mean it ought to still be going on?</p>
<p>I’m genuinely trying to figure out what it is you are trying to say. That it goes on, or has gone on? Or that it is all right that it is still going on?</p>
<p>“At one point, you could have said that bosses always slept with their secretaries, now not so much”</p>
<p>Really? And you know this how? </p>
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