<p>^ I agree that this is not respecting your financial agreement. Actually, a therapist can talk to you if your daughter signs a release. I see good reason for the therapist to not discuss her personal issues. It would violate the trust in their relationship, but your D can sign a release that allows the therapist to discuss only the finances if you are paying. </p>
<p>“Alcoholism has a genetic component and it is in my husband’s family”</p>
<p>Alcoholism extends beyond drinking. It becomes a family behavior pattern. If your husband grew up in a household where family members walked on eggshells around the alcoholic, kept it a secret, or denied it, then this might seem perfectly normal to your husband. These family behaviors are learned very early, and are almost automatic in children of alcoholics who can learn these behaviors even if they never drink. Your husband could be doing the best he can with what he knows, but this can enable the alcoholic. Your husband might benefit from 12 step groups and if he doesn’t wish to go, you still can go.</p>
<p>Tried years ago to get her to go to AA. She went once. Didn’t think it applied to her, of course.</p>
<p>@half empty-I am familiar with RAD but no, she was not adopted. Quite the opposite, she was raised in a close immediate family. No grandparents or other extended with any closeness but our unit is solid-our kids are best friends. I don’t think RAD is her problem. It is worth thinking about though. My cousin adopted a teen they had fostered and he suffers from RAD.</p>
<p>@Pennylane, I wouldn’t mind her getting arrested for driving w no license. I just don’t want the burden of having to drive her at her beck and call. She is impulsive and if I wasn’t willing to jump, that unlicensed drive would happen so it was going to happen eventually. </p>
<p>Yes, we are enabling and being held hostage. Need to dig out.</p>
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<p>Al Anon. You need real-life support; people in your situation who can help you grow your spine. My take is that you know a lot of what you need to do, but you’re having trouble doing it, partly because your husband is not on the same page. It’s really hard to be the bad guy all the time.
What your Dh isn’t getting is that being the “bad guy” really is being the good guy, as far as helping your daughter is concerned.</p>
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<p>You can refuse to drive her unless you feel like it, and you can take away access to the car and keys.
But you know this. You just won’t do it because you haven’t found the strength yet. I think you have it in you, but you need support. Get the support you need. Your Dd’s life depends upon it.</p>
<p>In several respects, I’ve found that some “group” situations (eg, the AA group for family members) can help the go-er very much. Much as this thread can, you hear others’ stories. If one doesn’t work, isn’t the right mix, try another.</p>
<p>But also, sometimes a troubled person leans on another’s imperfections. It can be an excuse (“You’re not perfect, either”) or that the other’s flaws really are too much and get in the way. (Eg, many kids I’ve known with “issues” could rightly point at their own frustration with their parents’ choices, attitudes, or problem-solving techniques- they just didn’t see how their own compensating behaviors and choices did them no good, were no better, were just as mal-adapted.) So some standing back is good, look at how we may be contributing, alter what we can, in our own ways. (Just the same as with some toddlers.)</p>
<p>“Walking on eggshells” is exactly what I called it. That included cleaning up some of my own act.</p>
<p>I’m not sure how much we can go from zero-to-sixty, whether it helps to threaten the ultimate: kicking a kid out, especially when it won’t happen.) When they “don’t get it,” to begin with, that can be volatile, something they rebel further against. I have had to take a softer approach, tell both of mine, at times, that if they can’t manage a cooperative relationship, maybe they should explore options. I’ve pointed out the simplicity and uniformity of our house/family rules and expectations. </p>
<p>I would have been happy for D2 to have a 3.0 gpa, btw. She was at a difficult college, overextended herself, at first. I finally convinced her to include easier classes (since she was also in a demanding major and minor.) I could tell she was learning and settled on, “Just graduate.” She did. </p>
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<p>No, no, no! Just don’t drive her! And hide the keys. You are NOT helping her. She won’t grow up until she has to.</p>
<p>So she lives at home while attending college? No wonder. She has you under her spell. My daughter is the same way - very, very manipulative. And good at it. </p>
<p>My opinion - tell her after she graduates she has six months to move out on her own. Even help her find an apartment. Again, stop paying for the DUI’s or suspended licenses. The fees are in place as a deterrent, if you just pay them, how will that deter her from doing it again? And yes, take away the keys, don’t drive her, give her a bicycle or a bus pass.</p>
<p>About the doctor fees - I was told by my insurance that as long as my daughter was covered by my insurance I was responsible for all her doctor bills that were not covered. I don’t think you can just not pay the doctor, it will go to collections etc… But yes, keep reminding her of your position for unlimited doctor visits etc. </p>
<p>The car is legally hers. Gift from a grandparent. Actually, grandparent gave her a new car. We sold it and traded down to this used model to get our money out of the first round of $ she owed us, from legal fees and auto accidents, etc. </p>
<p>She isn’t the train wreck she was then, but she is not yet fun to be around and is still trying my patience to the max.</p>
<p>@Photo-op~ we now live an hour away from her school so she does a combo of living home and at school. The thing is it is sooo expensive to pay for her student housing. Trying to keep that to eight semesters. </p>
<p>We live in the burbs so no bike or bus pass will do any good or help her to make forward moving progress like getting a job.</p>
<p>How do I force her to move out afterwards? If she doesn’t have money, she can’t rent a place to live. She is no longer so bad that we should try to lock the door to keep her out and that would be devastating to the younger sibs anyhow. Part of her issues are mental health related and not having the confidence in herself to get a proper job post graduation.</p>
<p>I hope there is a <a href=“http://www.nami.org”>http://www.nami.org</a> class or support group close to you. They can provide a safe place for you to vent, learn, talk.</p>
<p>You can send information to the therapist about your daughter, about behaviors and drinking, so that they have a fuller picture.</p>
<p>OP, we will be in a similar boat to you before long. Our middle son is at a summer job in Wisconsin. We’ve told him he needs to get a job and not live with us in the fall. He also has mental health issues and is an expert manipulator. At least my DH agrees with me, but it still won’t be easy. I’m dreading it.</p>
<p>grandscheme, it sounds like you’re doing an awful lot of justifying here. You KNOW, you KNOW, that she drinks daily, but you got her license back for her because you’re too lazy to want to drive her everywhere. I am not unfamiliar with this issue. I have alcoholics in my extended family. The ONLY WAY one young person finally got her stuff together was to get busted for DUI, busted AGAIN for driving without a license and then busted AGAIN for not complying with probation. A few weeks in jail cured her of wanting to do whatever she wanted to do. And the car? You has the legal right somehow to sell the other one. Do the same again. Giving her back her license was about the worst thing you could have done.</p>
<p>I’m also wondering, because you haven’t answered this-WAS she diagnosed as bipolar? That really, really HAS to be addressed. It took my good friend mentioned above until she was 40 to finally begin living a normal life because her parents figured she was just a headstrong kid who would grow up eventually even after she had a diagnosis. It wasn’t until she got her own treatment on her own dime that she became stable. Is that what you want? With proper meds she went back to school, got a job and is self-supporting for the first time in a decade. She has a happy life now.</p>
<p>It’s not all or nothing, a person with mental illness can have areas where they do well. But your D is circling a drain and I don’t see it ending well given what you’ve posted here. </p>
<p>“But your D is circling a drain and I don’t see it ending well given what you’ve posted here”</p>
<p>and the force of that whirlpool is strong enough to bring you and others down it. Please get the help and support you need to set your limits. </p>
<p>Thanks all. I promise I am not trying to justify-just to explain. I want you to know what I/we have been thinking and to know if when you hear the rationalization, it sounds like we are still off. Sounds like in most instances, we are.</p>
<p>She was diagnosed as “probably bi-polar” by a psychologist when we lived in another state (or whatever is the MD version of a psyc doc). He wasn’t her regular therapist but was the one to write her scripts so it got lost in the care cycle there.</p>
<p>We were able to trade in her first car because it was gifted to her when she was a minor so my name was also on the title. When we traded it down to cash it out, she was 21 and I had title to “new” car put in her name only to make it clear it is hers and hers to deal with (though of course we pay for insurance-she is in theory a full time student). She likes to blame a lot on me.</p>
<p>Okay, going to go do some research for support services.</p>
<p>I’m thinking that a new therapist, or at least a second opinion, might be in order. It’s also nearly impossible for people with drinking problems to improve their mental health issues without dealing with the alcohol issues. Meds and alcohol don’t mix well, but also the drinking itself can cause a lot of unstable behavior. Alcohol can exacerbate depression, acting out, and self-centered behavior of all kinds. I think it would be hard to even diagnose a disorder like bipolar unless the patient is sober for a time.</p>
<p>moonchild-its hard to know which problem to deal with first.</p>
<p>Good luck to you. This is a tough tough situation. </p>
<p>My first inclination was to take away the car and let the license lapse and get her a bike and a bus pass. You say that won’t work. If she lived at the college would it work? She is an adult; you have to find ways to stop bailing her out. </p>
<p>Like the idea of checking into support services and seeing if you hear about some new ideas. </p>
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<p>That would be a psychiatrist, which is an M.D. who specializes in psychiatric disorders and has prescription privileges, unlike a psychologist, who is usually a Ph.D and deals more with therapy. If your D is really bi-polar, she should be followed by a psychiatrist in your new state. Medications have helped many people with bi-polar disorder. If she does NOT have this, you need to know this also. She could have borderline personality disorder or some other personality disorder. Knowing what the exact problem is will do all of you a world of good with finding the right resources. </p>
<p>If I had a “might be bi-polar” conversation with a psychiatrist, that would be one of the first things I would explore extensively!</p>